North Little Rock Development

[bchris02]

And the Wyndham in NLR is called the Wyndham Riverfront Little Rock, so it even associates itself with Little Rock.

I also thought that it was sad that NLR made such a fuss about insisting that Alltel was located in NLR. I heard Ray Tucker on the radio trying to defend NLR, but someone countered that UALR was the host school and many of the people that were doing the leg work to get this thing done were in LR so they were ok with it being said that it was in LR.

Does it really matter? This is absurd that people in NLR would get so upset by CBS saying the tournament is in Little Rock. They should be thrilled to have such an event.

[ndark]

As a resident of NLR from 0-18 I agree with everyone. This whole little man syndrome that NLR has for LR is very similar to the whole NWA v. LR thing to me. Everybody has it out for the big guy.

I no longer live in NLR but if I did I would vote to consolidate both cities as I am sure most of my friends and relatives in NLR would do when told of the advantages of being one city. Sadly, it will never happen.

[Architect]

As a resident of NLR from 0-18 I agree with everyone. This whole little man syndrome that NLR has for LR is very similar to the whole NWA v. LR thing to me. Everybody has it out for the big guy.

I no longer live in NLR but if I did I would vote to consolidate both cities as I am sure most of my friends and relatives in NLR would do when told of the advantages of being one city. Sadly, it will never happen.

Here's a quote from Jeff Hankins article in this week's Arkansas Business about the overall (success) of the tournament:

"I have to admit that I grew tired of all the talk and correcting over whether the games were being played in North Little Rock or Little Rock. It's a Pulaski County facility that happened to be built on the north side of the river, and no one outside the two cities could care less about differentiating between the two."

[cozmosis]

I no longer live in NLR but if I did I would vote to consolidate both cities as I am sure most of my friends and relatives in NLR would do when told of the advantages of being one city. Sadly, it will never happen.

I've lived in Little Rock before... I live in North Little Rock now... I see no reason to merge the two. There is a distinct difference in how North Little Rock handles business than that of our southern neighbors. Why would I want to bring LR's headaches into my world?

With that said, are there benefits to consolidating some services? Sure. I think Central Arkansas Water is a prime example of that. And I do believe that certain local agencies would benefit from strong interlocal agreements to streamline business between cities. However, I would stop way short of a merger. You can talk about the economy of size, but bigger isn't always better and I don't see any benefit from a governmental operations standpoint.

There is a large contingent of merger-supporters -- including many on Urban Planet -- who want to merge so the Little Rock city limit sign says "Population 250,000" instead of whatever it says now. They think that adding North Little Rock's 60,000 people will magically increase the appeal of Little Rock on the national scale -- even though the people, businesses and attractions will stay the same -- and, just maybe, we'll be able to get a Nordstrom's or something.

[bchris02]

I've lived in Little Rock before... I live in North Little Rock now... I see no reason to merge the two. There is a distinct difference in how North Little Rock handles business than that of our southern neighbors. Why would I want to bring LR's headaches into my world?

With that said, are there benefits to consolidating some services? Sure. I think Central Arkansas Water is a prime example of that. And I do believe that certain local agencies would benefit from strong interlocal agreements to streamline business between cities. However, I would stop way short of a merger. You can talk about the economy of size, but bigger isn't always better and I don't see any benefit from a governmental operations standpoint.

There is a large contingent of merger-supporters -- including many on Urban Planet -- who want to merge so the Little Rock city limit sign says "Population 250,000" instead of whatever it says now. They think that adding North Little Rock's 60,000 people will magically increase the appeal of Little Rock on the national scale -- even though the people, businesses and attractions will stay the same -- and, just maybe, we'll be able to get a Nordstrom's or something.

How does NLR handle business better than LR? Are the two cities really that different?

[Architect]

I've lived in Little Rock before... I live in North Little Rock now... I see no reason to merge the two. There is a distinct difference in how North Little Rock handles business than that of our southern neighbors. Why would I want to bring LR's headaches into my world?

With that said, are there benefits to consolidating some services? Sure. I think Central Arkansas Water is a prime example of that. And I do believe that certain local agencies would benefit from strong interlocal agreements to streamline business between cities. However, I would stop way short of a merger. You can talk about the economy of size, but bigger isn't always better and I don't see any benefit from a governmental operations standpoint.

There is a large contingent of merger-supporters -- including many on Urban Planet -- who want to merge so the Little Rock city limit sign says "Population 250,000" instead of whatever it says now. They think that adding North Little Rock's 60,000 people will magically increase the appeal of Little Rock on the national scale -- even though the people, businesses and attractions will stay the same -- and, just maybe, we'll be able to get a Nordstrom's or something.

Honestly, what are the benefits of them being separate? It didn't start out that way.

[CentralArkansas]

Honestly, what are the benefits of them being separate? It didn't start out that way.

He's basically saying he wants to merge services where it benefits him....aka the water merger.

[cozmosis]

How does NLR handle business better than LR? Are the two cities really that different?

My dealings with city government have been much more personable in NLR than LR. Perhaps it's because it's a smaller government... Perhaps it's because there is a different mentality... I don't know why it is different, just that it is.

Honestly, what are the benefits of them being separate? It didn't start out that way.

You're right... 100 years ago, they were one city. So does that mean they should be one city now? To use the logic that what was good 100 years ago is good today means that cities like Jacksonville (incorporated 1941), Sherwood (1948) or Maumelle (1985) shouldn't even exist!

I understand the argument using the economy of scale... But where do you draw the line? Merge Little Rock and North Little Rock? Merge the whole county? Merge the entire MSA? How big is too big? And would pro-merger supporters know when that is? From reading some of the posts on this board, I don't think so. Believe it or not, some people choose to live in smaller communities for the very reason that they are smaller communities. I didn't move to NLR for that reason, but I choose to stay here because of it.

[cozmosis]

He's basically saying he wants to merge services where it benefits him....aka the water merger.

I'll be honest, my first inclination was to suggest a few places to put your post. I mean... You don't know me and I don't know you, so I can't imagine how you feel you're capable of explaining to the masses exactly what I believe. But I try to be a rational man, so I'll take a different approach. Let's take a look at your post...

You say I want merged services where it benefits me. Why would I not want that? I would think that we all want a government that benefits us in some way. The CAW merger worked out pretty good. I'm happy. Why be against it? (And for the record, I wasn't against it before the merger.)

Your posts suggests that I wouldn't support the merger of services that don't benefit me. Again, why would I? If I think a merger would be a detriment to the city I live in and the quality of life that I enjoy, it would be ludicrous for me to support it. Now show me some other separate entities that would benefit from uniting and I'll make decisions on a case-by-case basis.

Let's be honest, a Little Rock and North Little Rock merger wouldn't be a merger in any sense of the word. Big brother would swallow up and digest little brother and we'd all be residents of a larger, more unruly Little Rock. I'm sorry, but I don't desire to live in a city of 250,000 that stretches 160+ square miles... and I especially don't want to live there if there is any chance the Little Rock School Board could be in charge of the new city's schools!

[bchris02]

I'm sorry, but I don't desire to live in a city of 250,000 that stretches 160+ square miles... and I especially don't want to live there if there is any chance the Little Rock School Board could be in charge of the new city's schools!

You already do. As far as economics are concerned they are the same city. I live in LR, in Riverdale, but I find myself shopping and eating in NLR just as much if not more than in LR.

...and I especially don't want to live there if there is any chance the Little Rock School Board could be in charge of the new city's schools!

Even if there was a merger I would support the school districts staying separate.

A merger wouldn't be so attractive it NLR and LR would work together instead of always trying to one up each other. Sometimes it seems LR tries so hard to establish its own identity and one-up LR that it makes silly decisions.

Edited April 2, 2008 by bchris02

[cozmosis]

You already do. As far as economics are concerned they are the same city. I live in LR, in Riverdale, but I find myself shopping and eating in NLR just as much if not more than in LR.

I see what you're saying... but you have to believe that economics and government are completely separate. Just because our local economy works well doesn't mean that a municipal government covering the same area would succeed, too.

[Architect]

My dealings with city government have been much more personable in NLR than LR. Perhaps it's because it's a smaller government... Perhaps it's because there is a different mentality... I don't know why it is different, just that it is.

You're right... 100 years ago, they were one city. So does that mean they should be one city now? To use the logic that what was good 100 years ago is good today means that cities like Jacksonville (incorporated 1941), Sherwood (1948) or Maumelle (1985) shouldn't even exist!

I understand the argument using the economy of scale... But where do you draw the line? Merge Little Rock and North Little Rock? Merge the whole county? Merge the entire MSA? How big is too big? And would pro-merger supporters know when that is? From reading some of the posts on this board, I don't think so. Believe it or not, some people choose to live in smaller communities for the very reason that they are smaller communities. I didn't move to NLR for that reason, but I choose to stay here because of it.

Cozmosis - I think we all respect your opinion, but we can't debate opinions. Your opinion is your own. So, help us by outlining debatable, plausible argument of your perspective.

The plausible arguments FOR a merger (and I believe to answer your question, it should be county-wide) are proliferate, including, but not limited to the following:

- first and foremost, its more efficient economically (there is NO argument that duplicate services is in any way beneficial for our collective community)

- second, its much more marketable (the world is becoming a smaller place - greater Little Rock had better become more relevant, and quickly)

- third, as bchris02 so eloquently put it, you already live in Little Rock (don't kid yourself by an imaginary boundary and a green sign - its ONE community)

As a exercise for your consideration, should Sherwood really exist? It has no relevance. It is quite literally the "growth" of North Little Rock, is it not? Would it be of benefit to NLR for Sherwood to merge with it? I think so....

[Aporkalypse]

You already do. As far as economics are concerned they are the same city. I live in LR, in Riverdale, but I find myself shopping and eating in NLR just as much if not more than in LR.

Even if there was a merger I would support the school districts staying separate.

A merger wouldn't be so attractive it NLR and LR would work together instead of always trying to one up each other. Sometimes it seems LR tries so hard to establish its own identity and one-up LR that it makes silly decisions.

I think a city-county merger is more likely to occur than a LR-NLR merger. This has occurred other places like Nashville and Louisville and been beneficial. Memphis is trying to do it but the rest of Shelby Co won't go along. The school districts would remain separate, no doubt.

[CentralArkansas]

I'll be honest, my first inclination was to suggest a few places to put your post. I mean... You don't know me and I don't know you, so I can't imagine how you feel you're capable of explaining to the masses exactly what I believe. But I try to be a rational man, so I'll take a different approach. Let's take a look at your post...

You say I want merged services where it benefits me. Why would I not want that? I would think that we all want a government that benefits us in some way. The CAW merger worked out pretty good. I'm happy. Why be against it? (And for the record, I wasn't against it before the merger.)

Your posts suggests that I wouldn't support the merger of services that don't benefit me. Again, why would I? If I think a merger would be a detriment to the city I live in and the quality of life that I enjoy, it would be ludicrous for me to support it. Now show me some other separate entities that would benefit from uniting and I'll make decisions on a case-by-case basis.

Let's be honest, a Little Rock and North Little Rock merger wouldn't be a merger in any sense of the word. Big brother would swallow up and digest little brother and we'd all be residents of a larger, more unruly Little Rock. I'm sorry, but I don't desire to live in a city of 250,000 that stretches 160+ square miles... and I especially don't want to live there if there is any chance the Little Rock School Board could be in charge of the new city's schools!

You proved my point. You want to merge with Little Rock....only where it helps your pocketbook. You don't hear LR residents saying "lets just merge this utility and that city service, because it will cut my bills by 15%." LR people that want to merge want to merge EVERYTHING, not just whats beneficial to them personally.

But, you do hear that from NLR, much like yourself. You praise the CAW merger because LR residents had increased rates to help subsidize NLR. Heaven forbid though, in a city-wide merger, something might not benefit you directly. Nevermind that there would be other things to off-set it.

[cozmosis]

You proved my point. You want to merge with Little Rock....only where it helps your pocketbook. You don't hear LR residents saying "lets just merge this utility and that city service, because it will cut my bills by 15%." LR people that want to merge want to merge EVERYTHING, not just whats beneficial to them personally.

But, you do hear that from NLR, much like yourself. You praise the CAW merger because LR residents had increased rates to help subsidize NLR. Heaven forbid though, in a city-wide merger, something might not benefit you directly. Nevermind that there would be other things to off-set it.

So, the people of Little Rock support mergers for the right reasons and the people of North Little Rock support them for the wrong reasons? Is that what you're saying. You paint with an awfully broad brush, my man. It's attitudes like yours that make folks like me not want to be a part of a new, larger Little Rock.

Again, CAW worked out -- fine by me. Will the police department improve if there is a merger? Will the fire department improve if there is a merger? With Little Rock still vacuum my leaves from the curb in the winter like North Little Rock does now? Sell me on the idea of a merger by telling me how it will directly benefit a guy living on Park Hill. Because from my front yard, I don't think I'll see a lot of benefit from it...

[CentralArkansas]

So, the people of Little Rock support mergers for the right reasons and the people of North Little Rock support them for the wrong reasons? Is that what you're saying. You paint with an awfully broad brush, my man. It's attitudes like yours that make folks like me not want to be a part of a new, larger Little Rock.

Again, CAW worked out -- fine by me. Will the police department improve if there is a merger? Will the fire department improve if there is a merger? With Little Rock still vacuum my leaves from the curb in the winter like North Little Rock does now? Sell me on the idea of a merger by telling me how it will directly benefit a guy living on Park Hill. Because from my front yard, I don't think I'll see a lot of benefit from it...

You are continuing to prove my point. You want to pick and choose which departments you would like to merge with where it will benefit you. You wonder why there's some derision among LR residents? It's because of things just like CAW; our water bills jumped over 10% when we merged so we could subsidize NLR.

Who wouldn't want that kind of deal?

As far as police go, it sure as hell would improve. NLR can barely keep officers because they are quitting and joining the LRPD because of higher salaries. I highly doubt you'd see any difference in other city services as well. It's not as if NLR is some kind of modern urban utopia.

[Aporkalypse]

You are continuing to prove my point. You want to pick and choose which departments you would like to merge with where it will benefit you. You wonder why there's some derision among LR residents? It's because of things just like CAW; our water bills jumped over 10% when we merged so we could subsidize NLR.

Who wouldn't want that kind of deal?

As far as police go, it sure as hell would improve. NLR can barely keep officers because they are quitting and joining the LRPD because of higher salaries. I highly doubt you'd see any difference in other city services as well. It's not as if NLR is some kind of modern urban utopia.

It would sure help from the electric standpoint. In general I like Patrick Henry Hays but his decisions regarding electricity supply have been plain boneheaded. NLR already relies on the LRPD for help. It doesn't have the size to have the homicide, narcotics, and gang expertise the LRPD does yet it has similar rates of the root problems.

[cozmosis]

You are continuing to prove my point. You want to pick and choose which departments you would like to merge with where it will benefit you. You wonder why there's some derision among LR residents? It's because of things just like CAW; our water bills jumped over 10% when we merged so we could subsidize NLR.

Simple question... Would the merger of Little Rock & North Little Rock benefit you?

[CentralArkansas]

Simple question... Would the merger of Little Rock & North Little Rock benefit you?

I'm actually mixed on incorporation, despite my posts here. I truly believe it would benefit NLR much much more than it would benefit LR.

So, as it is, I'd have to say I don't know. I just can't stand NLR resident's attitudes (very similar to certain NWA folks) about merging. They think they are some kind of higher civilization, which is laughable to say the least, but then advocate mergers like CAW.

Edited April 3, 2008 by CentralArkansas

[hogwash]

It would sure help from the electric standpoint. In general I like Patrick Henry Hays but his decisions regarding electricity supply have been plain boneheaded. NLR already relies on the LRPD for help. It doesn't have the size to have the homicide, narcotics, and gang expertise the LRPD does yet it has similar rates of the root problems.

What is your basis for criticizing decisions on the electric utility? Before deregulation power cities like NLR, Benton, Bentonville, Clarksville were at a real advantage over everyone else. It was only when the energy companies pulled the rug out from under them that things got bad and prices have skyrocketed.

I think NLR is one the power communities in the state that is exploring the idea of a cooperative lignite fired plant in south Arkansas. If NLR can find a good longterm supplier or some sort of solution that isn't execssively expensive, I don't see them giving up that utility. Having local electric crews that can be deployed is valuable to the citizens, as they often get electricity back before customers on entergy and the cooperatives.

[Aporkalypse]

What is your basis for criticizing decisions on the electric utility?

A 38% increase in electric rates over their previous provider?

Hays lost a lot of popularity in NLR over that.

[King of the Parkhill]

A 38% increase in electric rates over their previous provider?

Hays lost a lot of popularity in NLR over that.

Even after the 38% increase my electric bill from NLR is cheaper than it was from Entergy when I lived in LR. I would like to see a direct comparison on electric rates between to two providers mathematically broken down by usage. That said, I agree with aporkalypse that people don't care that electric rates basically remained steady for 10 years prior to the increase. This is simply because it is easier to raise rates yearly by small increments than to slam a person on a fixed income with a large correction.

[hogwash]

Those rate increases really weren't expected by anyone. All the power cities in Arkansas had been dealing through Entergy. When contracts ran out Entergy refused to sell power anymore to those communities, opting instead to sale at retail value elsewhere. NLR and others were forced to buy elsewhere at much higher rates than before. Entergy in essence was playing hardball and is trying to convince those power cities to give up their utilities. No one was expecting Entergy to refuse to sell, as they had worked in good faith with all these communities across for so long.

Its tough to criticize the city for passing along a cost they had no way of absorbing without cutting other services.

[skirby]

Plans are in the works for a development in the 400 block of Main. The developers want to build a five story addition to the back of two buildings

now there. The first floor would be for parking and the the other four would be for condos.

[cozmosis]

Plans are in the works for a development in the 400 block of Main. The developers want to build a five story addition to the back of two buildings now there. The first floor would be for parking and the the other four would be for condos.

From reading the Argenta blog, it doesn't sound like the neighborhood is fond of this development. From looking at the renderings myself, it doesn't look like it would exactly compliment the historic district. I believe the majority of the building's exterior as planned is going to be dryvit.