Jump to content

Downtown movie theater coming


Coleco

Recommended Posts

Here's the Press with their "Who would ever go downtown for a movie" story.

http://www.mlive.com/business/grpress/inde...0680.xml&coll=6

"If they build it, who will come?"

Man, I hope this takes off and proves every local naysayer wrong. I don't have any desire to drive down the road and pay $20 to see a movie at the boring surburban theater, but I would love to make a night of it with dinner and walking around DT and a movie. Am I (and those of us here) the only ones who think that way?

BTW, I know a LOT of school groups went to the Egypt exhibit at the Public Museum and then drove all the out to Celebration to see the IMAX film. How much better and easier of a field trip would it be to go to an IMAX down the road from the museum?

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Replies 196
  • Created
  • Last Reply

It doesn't seem like this development is strictly for the suburbanites to come downtown, watch a movie, and hit 131 out to Wayland. This development appears to be a secondary venue for conventioneers, folks at the bars, residents in surrounding 'hoods, etc.... GR Press better get off this "field of dreams" crap, what a bunch of asinine expletives. It's not about luring people to the city, its luring those who are already here for something.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

yeah it would have been nice if loeks built the celebration and IMAX downtown a few years ago. At this point the market does seem to be a little oversaturated but the problem is there all the same and all high priced.

When I go down to the palm beaches to visit family we sometimes go out to movies. I'm always amazed at the amount of movie theaters and the differences between them in style, price, ect. There are 3 within about a mile of each other. There has to be at least 20 theaters in the area and being in florida I would think it would not be as big as MI. But some places are a lot cheaper with shows for $5. there needs to be more diversity in the local theaters. And a second run show like the old Alpine 4 needs to return although dt is probably not the place for that.

Woodland cinimark seems cheaper than the others but I use a student discount. Overall I am very disapointed in the quality of that theater. From the outside its OK. But the inside is extremly small, narrow and plain compared to the rivertown one, and it is always trashed and unkept, I was shocked the first time I went there at how rundown the brand new theater was.

I hope the new theater brings a new brand to town like amc, muvico, rave, or something else

a few years ago there was mention of magic theaters going dt that might be cool.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's the Press with their "Who would ever go downtown for a movie" story.

http://www.mlive.com/business/grpress/inde...0680.xml&coll=6

"If they build it, who will come?"

What a bunch of crap! If these developers think it will go, and they can get financing, who cares what Loeks and Goodrich think? <_<

When Riverbank Books was opening, did they ask Barnes & Noble or Schulers if they thought a bookstore would work downtown? When the JW Marriott was planned, did they ask the Marriott on 28th whether a new hotel downtown was viable? What a bunch of boneheads.

The article should be, "If you build it, the (jealous, wish I had the cahoney's to make it work) naysayers will come". :rofl:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It doesn't seem like this development is strictly for the suburbanites to come downtown, watch a movie, and hit 131 out to Wayland. This development appears to be a secondary venue for conventioneers, folks at the bars, residents in surrounding 'hoods, etc.... GR Press better get off this "field of dreams" crap, what a bunch of asinine expletives. It's not about luring people to the city, its luring those who are already here for something.

Agreed. It's more like adding park benches, gardens, and a playground to an existing park.

Imagine: come DT for a few laps around the ice rink, a quick bite, a cuppa, browse the bookstore, then go catch a flick. Park once, walk to all these convenient interesting destinations & attractions. I live a mile away; I'd much rather my disposable income went DT instead of some township.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This development appears to be a secondary venue for conventioneers, folks at the bars, residents in surrounding 'hoods, etc....

When I was walking by the new art museum at about 12:15 on Tuesday afternoon a guy was on the phone in front of me. I overheard him say: "No, I haven't seen a movie theatre yet, but there's gotta be one around here somewhere."

Convention goers and out of town business folks just expect that we have something like this.. hopefully we soon will.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hear you, in fact I have a story like that, too. I think this development will fly, I don't think the market for this development is purely motivated by suburbanites. This theater will probably more cater to people downtown for a bigger event. If I was downtown for a convention, I would want to lay loose and check out the city... If this involves seeing the next Bruce Willis movie, then so be it.

It's VERY interesting that they guy you over heard said, "but there's gotta be one around here somewhere." This tells me that people comming here EXPECT these things from little ol' GR. Are we to cater to these people and give them what they want? :) I sure would hope so.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think this will go over great with all the visitors. It's very common for a travelor who has nothing to do in the evenings to go catch a movie.

I think what would really make it work is if the downtown restaurants put together "dinner and a movie" specials. I'd be so excited about this!! Some restaurants around Knaps corner do this. By two entres, get movie tickets or something like that. Could you imagine being able to go to dinner at Sierra Room, or McFaddans, Leo's, etc, and then walk to the theater with free or discounted tickets?! Afterwards you could hit Bar Divani for drinks. How cool! So much cooler than going to rivertown and eating at Applebees.

The hotel restaurants could probably take advantage of this too. What a great way to keep hotel guests in the hotel, eating at the hotel restaurants than to offer them movie tickets at the brand new theater that's in walking distance.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's the Press with their "Who would ever go downtown for a movie" story.

http://www.mlive.com/business/grpress/inde...0680.xml&coll=6

"If they build it, who will come?"

"We've been asked for years about a downtown theater and have always responded by saying, show us how to do the parking to make it competitive with a suburban theater," Loeks said.

Loeks is obviously stuck in a suburban mentality. A downtown theatre hits a different market than a suburban theatre and therefore has different market requirements. I currently live downtown San Diego and neither major theatre downtown has dedicated parking. One (AMC) is in an urban mall and has an agreement for its customers to get validated/reimbursed for the adjacent parking structure (which is obviously baked into a higher ticket price) and the other (Pacific) provides absolutely no parking, yet both have successfully operated for years.

Further, these two theatres are successful despite multiple suburban theatres literally a few minutes’ drive outside the city with free parking and lower ticket prices – so it’s not that they’re simply filling a suburban market void; there is a distinct market for downtown movie-goers.

Loeks is trapped in the suburban thinking that the theatre is the sole destination and therefore parking will be a prohibitive cost for customers, because they just want to see a movie, and cheap. The reality is theatres and most retail (for the same reasons) in downtowns across the country don’t provide parking, leaving it to the customer to figure out, or if they do the prices are higher to subsidize the parking. That’s just how cities work.

The reasons are simple:

1) Downtown residents, employees and travelers almost always walk or if the downtown is large enough take a cab, because it’s easier than driving – thus a major attraction of living and/or working in the city. The local downtown customers simply don’t drive and thus don’t need parking.

2) For suburbanites coming into the city, their destination is the city, not the theatre, or restaurant or bar or wherever they happen to be going. They happily pay for parking or hunt down a spot on the street because they’re spending the evening downtown; not just seeing a movie.

Loeks is also missing out on the demographics. Of course your base is not going to be the families or highschoolers that he’s so concerned about. It’s hipsters in their 20s and 30s, empty nesters and generally anyone without kids in tow who are spending an evening downtown, and these people are able and willing to pay higher ticket prices and/or pay for parking as need be.

His statement above shows he’s not proactively trying to understand how urban theatres work across the country; rather he’s waiting for someone to roll up and show him how to take his same old suburban model and shoehorn it into the city, which is never going to happen.

Frankly he looks totally clueless, and I'm glad someone else is beating him to the punch.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"We've been asked for years about a downtown theater and have always responded by saying, show us how to do the parking to make it competitive with a suburban theater," Loeks said.

Loeks is obviously stuck in a suburban mentality.

Frankly he looks silly, and I'm glad someone else is beating him to the punch.

Welcome dtsd! I think you articulated well what many of us were thinking. :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

OK, I'll ask.. what the heck is a brew and view?

Hoh docta! It's the coolest. You buy a beer and drink it in the theater DURING the movie. Bestest everest.

My experience has been at the Magic Bag in Detroit or the Vic in Chicago, bar venues that run double-features of classics or movies recently released on DVD, from like, 10PM-2AM. Since most people aren't seeing the movie for the first time, everyone's talking or yelling at the characters on-screen. Its a riot. A great night out with friends.

JD Loeks would probably think there's not a market for it. Because he'd really have to be shown how to market fun and make it competitive.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The thing that scares me about Ramco-Gershenson is that they drove North Kent Mall into the ground. Hopefully they have improved since that development. :)

Anyone check these Detroit developers' credentials, tax liens and BBB status yet? I look forward to hearing a report back. Go Geha!!

Gershenson Realty, Farmington Hills,

http://www.ramco-gershenson.com/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

While I think this is somewhat important, we can't lose sight of the fact that a good downtown has variety in the people living there. We want families to be able to live and be entertained d/t as well as the art/indie crowd.

I see something like the old Woodland theater (sort of). Maybe 1 or 2 theaters dedicated to the Art/Indie films, while the rest will be the mainstream "Finding Nemo 7" or whatever.

Guess my point is, I rather see the latest Blockbuster comedy movie as opposed to the latest Best of Show at Cannes or whatever. We need a good balance of d/t entertainment. We also don't want to force venues like UICA out of business by directly competing with them, which big chains could definately do (think Walmart vs. Joe's Market).

Any new multi-plex theatre is going to focus on first run Hollywood movies, that is what makes money. As far as art/indie movies, we have that downtown at the UICA and the Wealthy Theatre. I would hate to see an indie film series at a big box movie theatre cut out neigborhood level programing at these smaller venues. Must be careful what we wish for.

As far as the demographics working to support a theatre in downtown the big issue would be the cost of parking. Many people living in GR would rather drive fifteen minutes to see a movie in suburbia rather than spending five bucks to park downtown, or should I even bother to mention the possibility of walking? In many ways the populace just needs some simple information to let them know that they can do it, that is easy, cost effective, time efficient and what they want.

Loeks understands that their specific suburban model would not work downtown, the acreage for parking just wouldn't be available. However a theatre can work, it just needs to use an urban model, which the current proposed developers understand.

A brew and view may well be popular but it may well detract from the entertainment value of the movie with people running to retrieve and release beer.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Providence Mall would be a great model for this theater/retail development:

mall4rf.jpg

waterandmall2an.jpg

I grabbed these from the UrbanPlanet photo section:

http://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=24418

Providence is a great example of a nice-looking city with a good deal of dense, medium-height buildings:

http://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=24317

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Having done retail in Grand Rapids downtown for nearly 6 years. I've come to the realization that this area won't support an Art-house theatre per se. We simply don't have the masses to embrace alternative film culture. I hear of many individuals that like the concept however when push comes to shove...the bodies aren't there. This is the reality of the town that we live in. They're simply aren't enough people that give a crap about alternative whatever. As has been my experience in music retail... new cool crap sells only when it's an out-of-towner with discerning tastes. Don't know what the problem is...lack of knowledge in the general area?

Are we intellectually challenged? A certain curiousity lacking?

I've spoken to my friends at both the Wealthy theatre and at the U.I.C.A and granted they probably haven't spent the marketing dollars...not that thay have the dollars to do that..however..no one comes out to see interesting film en masse.

So if this new theatre comes into fruitition...expect more of the same if not immediately, certainly months later.

By the way...how many of you went to see "grisly man" when it was running at the U.I.C.A.?

Do you need the ACADEMY to tell you to see this film? How about CAPOTE? Saw it at Celebration South(Pre-Academy nomination), 10 people in attendence. Pathetic.

Trying not to sound sanctimonious...just people in these parts don't give a fudge about culture..film...music...art in general unless it's shoved in their faces via ENTERTAINMENT TONIGHT.

So you get this new theatre downtown with the promise of alternative fare...It does this for a few months, Drives the Wealthy St theatre and U.I.C.A out of the film business and then switches to mainstream films.

Mission accomplished and we're screwed.

H

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think its a problem of people being turned off by alternative meda (I think there are a few alternative newspapers that actually do quite well) but its the feeling (that was also represented by your post) that somehow alternative entertainment MUST be better, because fewer people enjoy it?

The whole "we are better then you are" mindset of the alternative culture is how an outsider looks into the alternative film, music, etc. scene. The post that you put up there only proves this point. What the indie film world needs is a sense of hunbling. It used to be indie film makers acknowledged that thir films werent going to be seen by many, and that they would have to try their best to make the film as entertaining as possible.

Now a days, indie film makers don't view their works that way.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It appears to me that the alternative films are just that, alternative. Obviously the films aren't providing "alternatives." You can't beat Bruce Willis grabbing a Glock and shooting the hell out of a few terrorists. Or as I like, the blowing up of something. It isn't telling the story, but it cost a lot of money to do, and it was friggin awesome. You should have seen the blast radius, it friggin killed. Most people like movies that appeal directly to their senses.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think its a problem of people being turned off by alternative meda (I think there are a few alternative newspapers that actually do quite well) but its the feeling (that was also represented by your post) that somehow alternative entertainment MUST be better, because fewer people enjoy it?

The whole "we are better then you are" mindset of the alternative culture is how an outsider looks into the alternative film, music, etc. scene. The post that you put up there only proves this point. What the indie film world needs is a sense of hunbling. It used to be indie film makers acknowledged that thir films werent going to be seen by many, and that they would have to try their best to make the film as entertaining as possible.

Now a days, indie film makers don't view their works that way.

So don't be an 'outsider'. Dive in. The only barrier keeping you on the 'outside' is

your own fear of the unknown. It can be briefly uncomfortable delving into something

different than the cultural 'norm', but don't let that stop you. New worlds await your exploration.

I don't believe for one minute that those involved in the aforementioned 'alternative

culture' thinks of themselves as 'better' than anyone else. However, indie films, art,

and music do appeal to those with a degree of education that may be perceived as snobbish. But that perception can quickly be diminished if one has any kind of

curiosity of the world and a good search engine.

Curiosity is the key to all knowledge, to all questions asked and all answers given.

Indie films are the response to a film makers curiosity, questions, and search for

answers. They are the expression of someone's point of view. They can be

uncomfortable. For some, they may be boring. Or, they can blow the top of your

head off with new insight.

Embracing films, music, and art of other cultures, alternative or not, requires

empathy and awareness of the validity and beauty of thoughts, ideas, sounds,

other than what one is generally exposed to in their own culture. They are not

always going to be entertaining in the Disney definition of the world.

Some film makers have something else to say. And while they may acknowledge

their films won't receive wide distribution, I'm sure they would love just one more

person to view their work. Doing so may require opening oneself up to the bigger

world and that takes study, thought, and discovery - in other words, time.

One reason mainstream media and commercial art, video, music, tv, radio, etc.

are so successful is that it is spoonfed to the masses and people accept it without

having to think much about it.

It seems the cool thing to say, 'I hope the new movie theatre shows indie stuff,'

but saying it and supporting it are two different things. Instead, see if you really

like the alternative film genre by supporting those places that show them. Or, go

rent movies made by indie filmmakers, don't reject those that aren't English-

speaking, and get exposed - as a good friend and extremely intelligent guy did

for me. I think Vertigo knows this person as a customer, and he also turned me

on to some really incredible music, some that he picked up from a certain music

store on Division. :thumbsup:

I thought I had a pretty good music collection, until I was exposed to more world

music, electronic music, and sounds than I ever thought about before.

You won't like everything new that you try, no different than trying new foods,

but you'll be better for the experience. Opening yourself up to other cultures, film,

music, books, and art won't turn you into a snob, it will make you a better citizen

of the world.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site you agree to our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.