Music City Star Postponed

[rocky top buzz]

Here is a link to the NCP article:

http://www.nashvillecitypaper.com/index.cf...s&news_id=49221

Ok, so there talking about pushing this back AGAIN, and saying they are already having finacial problems. Add this to the fact that this leg of the train will probably be the least traveled, and it make me wonder, do you think this thing will ever happen? 6 months ago I would have said you crazy, but now I have serious doubts.

[Lexy]

LOL!!! Gotta love that Homeland Security budget taking all the money from everything.

[Anti-ock]

GRR! We've been waiting for this since what, 2003?

[Rural King]

A metro rail system is going to happen IMO, they have went to far I think for it not to. There is support on the local and state level for it, so it will happen if all possible, even if delayed due to financial issues. Now I could be wrong, but I hope I'm not.

[bwithers1]

Yes, they have gone quite far along in the process to get delayed by a lack of insurance, of all things. I feel confident that this project will get bailed out again. Looking on the bright side, maybe the RTA will get all of the kinks worked out on this one and apply the lessons learned to the other legs of the system, so that future time and cost estimates are closer to reality. And geez I wish I felt more confident about ridership on this line.

[rocky top buzz]

That's my big problem. Along with the current problems, how will ridership really turn out???

[BnaBreaker]

Funny how rail systems all over the country have seemingly infinite hang-ups while at the same time another freakin 20 lane expressway can get pushed through in what seems like seconds in comparisson.

[LA_TN]

One note, Tuesday's editorial in the City Paper questioned the need for commuter rail and RTA leadership

[samsonh]

Theres another article in the NCP today about it as well. This one mentions that David Briley is beginning to question the projects business plan. Something I can agree with him about finally.

I think this project runs the risk of losing so much money that it sours Middle Tennesseans on future rail projects that could actually work and support themselves. I think that once we see ridership numbers (if it ever opens) they might be embarassingly low. Hopefully I will be wrong and thousands will ride daily but we shall see in a year or two or three.

[ATLBrain]

Way to go David Briley. There's never been a better person at "questioning" something after the fact. From what I can tell, the commuter line seems like putting the cart before the horse. I mean that it doesn't seem to serve a really urban submarket by going out to Mt. Juliet (and won't it go to Lebanon too?). My expectations for this are pretty low. At the same time, I wonder why the first line wasn't put in between M'boro and Nashville (or am I rehashing previous discussions?).

Sorry for all the parentheticals.

[Rural King]

^ They did it that way because they basically were given the track for free all the way to Lebanon, because of that fact this is a very cheap project in the scheme of things. If the the ridership numbers are just nominal it will be used as a working model to push for another better route, probably to Murfreesboro.

[rocky top buzz]

According to RTA, the next line would be to M'boro, and they are in the planning stages right now. I too felt that m'boro should have been the first line; with the money they are now looking at spending, how much would the cost difference have been?

Here's my question: If they simulated the train ride from LEbanon to Nashville about 6 years ago, why has this project taken so long to get to this point anyway? I understand they had to build stations in each city, but from the pictures I see these are wood structures, and we can build 5,000 square foot houses in 3 months! So if the track existed, why hasn't this thing been running for the past 4 years?

[Rural King]

I don't know the numbers off hand, but I do know it would have involved laying or making some arrangement with I believe CSX to share track, which would have been pricey. I learned most of my info off the main thread over the last year, when I have time tonight I will see if I can get through its 15 pages and see if the numbers and reasons are stated in any of the posts with links to source information.

As for why its taken so long, the federal funding took awhile to get appropriated.

[smeagolsfree]

If gas prices continue to rise so rapidly then many people hopefully will be happy they have an alternative into town. I wish I did where I live. I think with the rise of gas more success will be realized. Lets hope so anyway

[sleepy]

How's the transportation once folks get downtown? Will there be shuttles meeting the train and going up 2nd Avenue and making some sort of loop through the CBD? Also, buses out Broadway?

I think that'll make or break things as much as the train itself.

[Bears]

How's the transportation once folks get downtown? Will there be shuttles meeting the train and going up 2nd Avenue and making some sort of loop through the CBD? Also, buses out Broadway?

I think that'll make or break things as much as the train itself.

I agree. Another thing they have to fix is the frequency and the price. I know riding transit is usually cheaper than having a car however, not in Nashville where even if you do commute to work by bus, a car is still a neccessary item. The Music City trains are coming in only twice a day. Same frequency as Memphis' Amtrak and the closest station is about 100 miles away. Will this rail line also be used by frieght? I remember trains along this track in Lebanon and every month, there was a train to Watertown that was used for entertainment. They also built a rail road bridge over highway 109 in Wilson County so that probably caused part of the delay.

[Hankster]

Here's my question: If they simulated the train ride from LEbanon to Nashville about 6 years ago, why has this project taken so long to get to this point anyway? I understand they had to build stations in each city, but from the pictures I see these are wood structures, and we can build 5,000 square foot houses in 3 months! So if the track existed, why hasn't this thing been running for the past 4 years?

The answer to your question is very simple. Government red tape. Had this project been been done by a private company, and fully financed by a private company, it could have been accomplished in about a year, two tops.

[sleepy]

The answer to your question is very simple. Government red tape. Had this project been been done by a private company, and fully financed by a private company, it could have been accomplished in about a year, two tops.

But it wouldn't have been done by a private company because the risk is too great.

[Lexy]

I just really have a bad feeling about this whole thing now. It has nothing to do with the money aspect about it, rather the overall planning just seems elementary. It is a scary situation to be in right now if you are involved with the design of this project. I just simply don't see it working past a year or two. They really should've went to some other cities to see how they do their rail transit. Taken notes, and came back and did it right. Now taxpayers are going to be left with the bill on a rail system that doesn't work.

[nashvillwill]

I have a hard time dealing with this topic. While i have all hopes for the success of this first line, i feel i must agree with the majority that it will fail. But, failure is a relative term.

I remember a reference on the C.C. forum that convention centers are typically know as "loss leaders". Most urban transit are not profit generating entities. Unless you have the volume of the N.Y.C. transit system(7 million per day at $2 per fare) most transit systems could also be considered a "loss leader". This is not to say that mass transit is bad, because the pay-off is savings on roads, and an improved quality of life.

I understand the financial benefits of begining with the Lebanon line, but it still doesn't make long-term sense to me. If I remember the study-link correctly, Lebanon has 60k daily commuters traveling to Nashville for work compared to Murfreesboro's 120k. As a student of MTSU I am often frustrated by being known as a "suitcase college". However there is a reason we get that name. With over 25k students (40% of which live in Davidson County) we are commuting students. This would help the cost of the line in the reverse-flow sense (reverse flow is part of the plan). How many people do you think need to travel from the core to Lebanon at 7am?

[nashscan]

My thing is, why the bias against rail? When the stupid media asks leading questions like "should we really give MORE money to this project" the average stupid person will sheepishly shake their head no.

It's been amazingly cheap to get this project started. If they scrap this project now, I'm gonna go postal baby!

[downtown cliff]

The answer to your question is very simple. Government red tape. Had this project been been done by a private company, and fully financed by a private company, it could have been accomplished in about a year, two tops.

Which is why all of the private developments around town are ahead of schedule? (sarcasm alert)

[Lexy]

I have a hard time dealing with this topic. While i have all hopes for the success of this first line, i feel i must agree with the majority that it will fail. But, failure is a relative term.

I remember a reference on the C.C. forum that convention centers are typically know as "loss leaders". Most urban transit are not profit generating entities. Unless you have the volume of the N.Y.C. transit system(7 million per day at $2 per fare) most transit systems could also be considered a "loss leader". This is not to say that mass transit is bad, because the pay-off is savings on roads, and an improved quality of life.

I understand the financial benefits of begining with the Lebanon line, but it still doesn't make long-term sense to me. If I remember the study-link correctly, Lebanon has 60k daily commuters traveling to Nashville for work compared to Murfreesboro's 120k. As a student of MTSU I am often frustrated by being known as a "suitcase college". However there is a reason we get that name. With over 25k students (40% of which live in Davidson County) we are commuting students. This would help the cost of the line in the reverse-flow sense (reverse flow is part of the plan). How many people do you think need to travel from the core to Lebanon at 7am?

My point exactly. It just makes better BUSINESS SENSE to go to Murfreesboro first. Regardless of whether the rail lines you use are free or not. You still have to make an effort at making money and gaining ridership. This won't happen with a line to Lebanon IMO. They half-hearted the effort on the rail, and it will show thorugh soon enough. I hate that too, but it's just the way it will be IMO.

[Bears]

Well since it was so cheap, I could see why they would go for it. Keep the stations and rail for future use and dont run trains daily until there is actually a market for it. Maybe run it for big downtown events like a Titans game, New Years, and the Fourth of July.

[Lexy]

Well since it was so cheap, I could see why they would go for it. Keep the stations and rail for future use and dont run trains daily until there is actually a market for it. Maybe run it for big downtown events like a Titans game, New Years, and the Fourth of July.

That's actually not that bad an idea. Seriously.