"UNCC" "CPCC" - What's in a name?

[DigitalSky]

I'm pretty sure that Dallas has the largest community college system, but don't quote me on that one.

[appatone]

I believe CPCC just recently started to offer four year degrees by using Wingate's accreditation. I think we will CPCC increase its prominence through becoming more of a four year institution however I don't think they'll shift there format too much from a community college type of atmosphere.

If CPCC wanted to change their name they could always call it Elizabeth College which was the college on Elizabeth Ave. prior to CPCC's existence.

[Richhamleigh, DC]

As for CPCC, I am impartial to it becoming a four year university. I like being able to say it is the second largest CC in the nation. What is the largest?

As for Charlotte, I am tired of people feeling like our school will have a lower reputation if we drop the NC out of UNCC. Charlotte is one of the top 25 largest cities in the country; people now know where it is. Fewer people knew Charlotte as a major city ten to twenty years ago, but it has drastically changed and has been given an identity. However, when you look at our school's sports teams, how often do you hear UNC Charlotte mistakenly said at games or on the rare ESPN mention? They are known as Charlotte and there is no question.

Sure, it would cost money to replace signs, yes, but you can spread it out over time. I'm sure nobody would discredit our school for having a few leftover stationary pads that include the words North Carolina on them.

As for the matter on UCLA, there is no major UCL or the like to mistake it as. UNC and UNCC are where people get confused. It's when somebody says "I go to UNCC" and the other person says "oh yea? The tar heels right?" By calling it The University of Charlotte, there can be NO mistake. Even the OLD name of Charlotte College (like Boston College) is better than the satellite-esk name "UNC Charlotte." I wish it could be an informed student body vote rather than just the senate. As for Joe Franco (the SB president,) I'm pretty sure he had it in his agenda to push for the name change as well... wonder what happened there.

I feel it is more than necessary to establish this school as a University with an identity of its own. Yes, we do need a football team, but that is a whole issue unrelated to this. And, if we did have a team, it would be called the CHARLOTTE 49er's, not the UNCC 49er's.

Bonnie Cone established this school as Charlotte College, I am unaware if she had a hand in the name changing to UNCC or if that was a UNC system decision when they took Charlotte into their arms. Changing the name will not discredit the quality of a diploma of UNCC's namesake. Did it discredit those of Charlotte College when it was changed to UNCC? No, it was a symbol of Charlotte's rise and part of its history. So then you would be able to say to your grandchildren "I graduated from Charlotte back when they used to call it The University of North Carolina at Charlotte." That's something to be proud of rather than be embarrassed about.

There are many issues to be resolved as the school molds itself into a NC powerhouse like the Triangle Four. Changing the name to The University of Charlotte will only help establish that identity. (I severely doubt UC will get confused with Cincinnati as few people call it UC as we would call ours Charlotte.) Chapel Hill's true name is UNCCH but I can't tell you the last time I heard it called that. It simply goes by UNC, Chapel Hill, or Carolina. Any of those names will be a direct hit if mentioned to a NCAA tournament fan or high school seniors applying to college country wide. Having Charlotte known as UNCC only hurts its reputation by putting it in a shadow.

As to whether people know if Charlotte is in NC or not, that's basically irrelevant because I don't automatically think "Illinois!" when I hear the name Chicago. That is mostly because Chicago's identity isn't placed with Illinois, just like Charlotte is practically independent of having a NC identity (not including NASCAR. The HOF may cause this to change a little.)

Until the day that you walk through the streets of downtown and people are talking about being from NC instead of being from Charlotte, I will continue to call UNCC "Charlotte" instead of "UNC Charlotte." Just go ahead and change the name already.

Thoughful response Aussie...personally, I like what you have to say and your justifications.

[dubone]

Thanks for your response a_luke. (Welcome to UP, too, by the way). Are you from the "Charlotte University" area or the Charlotte "University area".

I like the idea of name Elizabeth College, as that doesn't exist in the nation any more.

But I like the idea of it just staying CPCC with them also offering 4 year full degrees as CPC or Elizabeth College or Mecklenburg College or some variation.

[monsoon]

The UNC System includes the following schools:

• Appalachian State University

• East Carolina University

• Elizabeth City State University

• Fayetteville State University

• North Carolina Agricultural and Technical State University

• North Carolina School of the Arts

• North Carolina State University

• University of North Carolina at Asheville

• University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill

• University of North Carolina at Charlotte

• University of North Carolina at Greensboro

• University of North Carolina Wilmington

• University of North Carolina at Pembroke

• University of North Carolina Wilmington

• Western Carolina University

• Winston-Salem State University

I am not sure why Charlotte should get the special designation of the University of Charlotte. If it intends to remain as part of the UNC system, and I think it definately should, then the name at best could be changed to Charlotte State University. Personally I think the University of North Carolina at Charlotte sounds better. It means that UNCC has the resources of the entire state system behind it.

[rockhilljames]

Coastal Carolina never had the name USC at Conway. It was known as the "University of South Carolina-Coastal Carolina College". It is now known simply as Coastal Carolina because it withdrew from the USC system and is now an independant university.

When I was growing up there in the 60s & 70s, it was simply referred to as "Coastal" by the locals.

Likewise, I have never known Francis Marion to be called anything else except for Francis Marion. It had that name in the 70s when several of my friends from High School went to school there.

You are correct in that Coastal Carolina was called USC-Coastal when affiliated with USC (it was actually Coastal Carolina College prior to joining the USC system), my memory isn't always that great. Francis Marion can trace it's history back to 1957 when USC-Florence was founded as a two year school. When enrollment increased, the local community pushed for a four year school. In 1970 the school became a four-year college and changed it's name to Francis Marion.

My main point for both of these schools is that as they became larger and wanted to establish their own identity, they severed ties from the USC system and it's worked out well for both schools. I think it would also work out well for Charlotte.

[dubone]

The name is not related to its involvement in the UNC system. It would still draw funds from the system. The funding is the only thing that really matters, as each school has independent academic reputations, endowments, admissions standards, tuitions, etc. So changing names is purely about branding. a UNC name helped to provide credibility during its nascent stages, but I think evolving away from that name helps it to be a more independent brand, stepping out of the shadow of UNC-Chapel Hill.

Frankly, the fact that it has the UNC in the name seems to be asking for a comparison, which seems to tick off most UNCC students and grads. (I hear more Chapel Hill bashing from UNCC people than I hear from any others because of this constant comparison). When the two schools are compared, its hard for the relatively young school to win, when Chapel Hill has such a longstanding reputation and accrual of funds over multiple centuries. To evoke a more independent brand would help to end that constant contrast.

In the sporting world, it is known as "Charlotte", and I think a lot of people like that. I think that is where the idea of calling it Charlotte University comes from.

[Richhamleigh, DC]

I am not sure why Charlotte should get the special designation of the University of Charlotte. If it intends to remain as part of the UNC system, and I think it definately should, then the name at best could be changed to Charlotte State University. Personally I think the University of North Carolina at Charlotte sounds better. It means that UNCC has the resources of the entire state system behind it.

Even as part of the UNC system, why not consider making it more distinctive and, as some would argue, in the process making it sound more prestigious? Again, I respect the UCLA analogy but since the UNC system is historically very different from the UC system, in the long run, as UNC-C improves its academic core I would argue that a distinct moniker only furthers the overall reputation of the institution.

[graydog]

I like Charlotte University for lots of reasons. I could also favor Charlotte College. Maybe it could be a 1 name college like Berkeley. The whole U of Insert State Here always seemed like a power play/ego thing by the system administrators. The academic woirld is more political than the business world, I've heard from friends in teaching. I also think UNCCH should be Carolina University, or just Carolina.

[krazeeboi]

In South Carolina several of the regional campuses changed their name after they got to a certain size and wanted their own identity. Coastal Carolina used to be USC-Conway and Francis Marion University used to be USC-Florence. Both have benefitted from the name change. USC-Spartenburg will be the next to change, although they've now changed to the ungodly USC-Upstate, whatever the hell that's supposed to mean.

They really wanted to pander to Greenville, but it also demonstrates regional cohesiveness in a certain way.

But I also think that perception-wise, UNCC would benefit changing its name to "University of Charlotte."

[krazeeboi]

I also think UNCCH should be Carolina University, or just Carolina.

That's interesting, because it was suggested in the Columbia subforum that USC be changed to "Carolina University" (although somewhat tongue-in-cheek). If either school did this, the other would certainly be upset, since both go by their official names as well as "Carolina."

[AuLukey]

Thanks for your response a_luke. (Welcome to UP, too, by the way). Are you from the "Charlotte University" area or the Charlotte "University area".

I like the idea of name Elizabeth College, as that doesn't exist in the nation any more.

But I like the idea of it just staying CPCC with them also offering 4 year full degrees as CPC or Elizabeth College or Mecklenburg College or some variation.

Thanks. Oddly enough, I actually thought about that question when entering it into my profile. I guess the answer would have to be Yes.

I support calling the school Charlotte University (or UoC.) Thus, I live in the "Charlotte University" area.

I also live in Charlotte's "University area."

So both names are correct.

[graydog]

That's interesting, because it was suggested in the Columbia subforum that USC be changed to "Carolina University" (although somewhat tongue-in-cheek). If either school did this, the other would certainly be upset, since both go by their official names as well as "Carolina."

Good point. How about UNC and USC then?

BTW what do the USC folks think of the national media referring to UNCCH as Carolina?

[AuLukey]

I like Charlotte University for lots of reasons. I could also favor Charlotte College. Maybe it could be a 1 name college like Berkeley. The whole U of Insert State Here always seemed like a power play/ego thing by the system administrators. The academic woirld is more political than the business world, I've heard from friends in teaching. I also think UNCCH should be Carolina University, or just Carolina.

Well, going along with the Berkeley, that's just a nickname really because it's full name is The University of California, Berkeley. So it is in the same boat as Charlotte right now.

As much as I want to see the name change over, I think it will just start to be called Charlotte and people will forget. If more school emblems made the word Charlotte much more prominant than the UNC portion, then there might be less of an issue because press and the community would pick up more on the Charlotte portion. That is just hunch that I hope would work if the name change never took place. It's all about identity.

[krazeeboi]

They really think nothing of it, because they also refer to USC as "Carolina."

I wonder if there was possibly confusion surrounding this when USC was part of the ACC.

[fulcrumsf]

I personally don't think they should change the name of UNCC, Living in California for so long I associate UC with University of California. That to me is way more confusing then UNCC.

I would much rather have people distiguish UNC-Charlotte by winning some NCAA titles, and eventually getting a Football team.

[krazeeboi]

I don't think the "UC" factor will be an issue at all if UNCC changes its name to "University of Charlotte," since there are already so many other UC's: Cincinatti, Chicago, California, Charleston WV, etc.--in other words the abbreviation is so common, it's rarely used exclusively for one university universally.

[AuLukey]

I don't think the "UC" factor will be an issue at all if UNCC changes its name to "University of Charlotte," since there are already so many other UC's: Cincinatti, Chicago, California, Charleston WV, etc.--in other words the abbreviation is so common, it's rarely used exclusively for one university universally.

I agree. Just as Chapel Hill is technically called UNCCH, I have only seen that on paper. Even with UNCC, I don't think I've actually heard somebody say that in about three years. Whether it becomes CU, UC, or stays UNCC, it will be known as Charlotte, so I wouldn't get too worried about getting schools confused based on abbreviations.

[monsoon]

Good point. How about UNC and USC then?

BTW what do the USC folks think of the national media referring to UNCCH as Carolina?

Having lived in both states I have noticed that "Carolina" means USC in SC and UNC in NC. If the national media is covering a major game in SC, say USC vs Clemson, they will also use "Carolina" to refer to USC. The media does not exclusively use the term for UNC but I under stand where UNC fans might think this. USC fans do the same thing.

USC is problematic as it is also used for the University of Southern California. So USC is often referred to as Carolina or something with the Gamecocks in it.

[dubone]

Usually in sports broadcasts, UNC is referred to "North Carolina", and then random times during the game, they'll just shorten it to Carolina. I'm sure the same goes for South Carolina.

While it is true that each state refers to its own U_C as "Carolina", in Charlotte, "Carolina" is most often interpretted as South Carolina by people I've come across. That is true despite the city being in North Carolina, and despite having a significant number of Tar Heel graduates and fans.

I no longer say "Carolina" when speaking of my alma mater. I most often say "Chapel Hill" and occassionally say "North Carolina". I'll rarely say "UNC".

[voyager12]

Believing that UNCC or any of the branches for that matter will ever equal or outshine Chapel Hill even if the name is changed is not realistic. That being said UNCA, UNCG,and UNCW have all managed to carve out distinct identities for themselves. What is UNCC's identity? The school does not have one and its tough to develop when the campus is so disconnected from the city center and surrounded by sprawl. I think UNCC's plans to concentrate more housing onsite and develop a "quad style" interconnected campus will be a great step forward.

[monsoon]

Actually UNCC is quite well known for Nursing, Architecture and Engineering & Programming. If I were going to go into one of these fields, I would not consider Chapel Hill. In fact its Architecture program is nationally known and there is high demand to get into that college. Likewise, graduates from its engineering program have absolutely no trouble getting jobs and that college has ties to many of the major technology firms in the area including IBM, Microsoft and Duke energy. It's not clear to me that any University in the Carolinas, benefits from being stuck in the middle of a Central Business District. It usually limits what a school is able to do. Chapel Hill, Duke and for that matter NC State are not exactly in skyscrapercity if you ask me. If you don't have a car you can't survive at these places.

Prestige of a University might help get your first job but I doubt it, especially for an undergraduate degree. After that, where you went to school is irrelevant.

[dubone]

Although it isn't really pertinent to the overall conversation, I have one correction that I must interject: not only can you survive without a car in Chapel Hill, but you must. There really isn't much student parking, and most of what is available is no where near the classroom buildings. The campus and town are very walkable and bikeable, and the bus system is farefree. Not sure about Duke or State, though.

The reputation of the school you attended factors throughout one's life, although it isn't always a primary deciding factor. I know I select doctors and dentists based on my perception of the school they attended. I also factor education into hiring decisions that I have made. Certainly not the only factor, though.

As Charlotte University, it will give it the opportunity to strike off as being more independent, which I think help's people's perceptions of it as a national university.

[monsoon]

Dr's and Dentists these days are chosen by most people based on who the insurance will pay for. In any case, I don't think their undergraduate program is that important to what medical training they might have.

In regards to hiring I've been involved in the hiring decisions of dozens of people and where the degree comes from isn't really that relevant. What is important is what they did while they were at a school including related job experience. If I were hiring a programmer I would much rather have a graduate from UNCC with co-op experience over someone from a more "prestigious" school with none. (and UNCC has an excellent co-op program).

[AuLukey]

Actually UNCC is quite well known for Nursing, Architecture and Engineering & Programming. If I were going to go into one of these fields, I would not consider Chapel Hill. In fact its Architecture program is nationally known and there is high demand to get into that college. Likewise, graduates from its engineering program have absolutely no trouble getting jobs and that college has ties to many of the major technology firms in the area including IBM, Microsoft and Duke energy. It's not clear to me that any University in the Carolinas, benefits from being stuck in the middle of a Central Business District. It usually limits what a school is able to do. Chapel Hill, Duke and for that matter NC State are not exactly in skyscrapercity if you ask me. If you don't have a car you can't survive at these places.

Prestige of a University might help get your first job but I doubt it, especially for an undergraduate degree. After that, where you went to school is irrelevant.

I don't feel Charlotte is hurt so much by being detached from uptown. Afterall, it is within a quick five minute light rail ride (*cough) or a ten minute drive to uptown. However, State is pretty self reliant in that it has so much built around it, you could live on campus and never own a car the four (or more) years you went there. Chapel Hill is about the same, I have plenty of friends that live there. While there isn't much around the school, there isn't really all that much in Chapel Hill to miss out on besides the school. Another example of a school that promotes on campus activity. Charlotte, Wake, and Duke are probably the better examples of schools where students need a car if they want to be able to do much. Charlotte is trying to overcome this slightly with the announcement of the "college environment" being constructed on the new Jon Kirk sometime this decade. They are building the Greek Village to overcome the issue of frats and sororities being so cut out of campus. And the city is "planning" to make N Tryon into a walkable street front retail area. That's due sometime before the next century kicks up. Duke and Wake students all seem to drive where they need to go from what I've seen. On my last visit to Wake I noticed vast lots full of 90's BMW's and new SUVs.