Charlotte Center City Streetcar Network

[underoak]

Re: The intersection of Hawthorne, the streetcar and the Seaboard line on the 1934 map and the 1954 map. I had an old ex in-law who lived on Thomas Street in 1932 as a child. He said he lived there because of its proximity to the work at the railroad, and he himself grew up to work for railroads. So I wonder whether the trolley and the intersection with Seaboard at Hawthorne was a way to get workers to the railroad line easily. Could there have been a workers' shop or stop on the rail line at the Hawthorne overpass, where the trollies stopped? Ex in-law is no longer around to ask.

Re: streetcar meeting Tuesday. There's another post, with background from a November meeting on the streetcars, up now at Under Oak. Information is from the Merry Oaks newsletter. The newsletter also said trolleys require only one driver while buses require three. I don't understand the reasoning behind that; if anyone understands, I'd love to hear more. Would trolleys only run 40 hours a week?

Request: If anyone has good enough eyes to read the name of the "lake" on the 1954 map just north of Central Avenue between Arnold and Flynnwood (where Birchcroft Apartments are now), I'd love to know the name. Maybe Lake Judah? Lake Jared?

Re: streetcar stop design: Has anyone seen the wooden vendor tables in downtown Asheville that fold up vertically when not in use, underneath a canopy? Cool design.

[tozmervo]

The newsletter also said trolleys require only one driver while buses require three. I don't understand the reasoning behind that; if anyone understands, I'd love to hear more. Would trolleys only run 40 hours a week?

A streetcar vehicle would have about 3x the passenger capacity of a Charlotte city bus.

[southslider]

A modern streetcar would have more capacity. But the vintage trolleys to be used initially on the starter line from CTC to Presby have less capacity.

[archiham04]

Re: The intersection of Hawthorne, the streetcar and the Seaboard line on the 1934 map and the 1954 map. I had an old ex in-law who lived on Thomas Street in 1932 as a child. He said he lived there because of its proximity to the work at the railroad, and he himself grew up to work for railroads. So I wonder whether the trolley and the intersection with Seaboard at Hawthorne was a way to get workers to the railroad line easily. Could there have been a workers' shop or stop on the rail line at the Hawthorne overpass, where the trollies stopped? Ex in-law is no longer around to ask.

Maybe it is "The Spot" and that is why it is not facing Hawthorne. I think the building is made of CMU though ... that would probably date it to the 40's

[underoak]

Maybe it is "The Spot" and that is why it is not facing Hawthorne. I think the building is made of CMU though ... that would probably date it to the 40's

Thanks. Will have to do some site investigations.

[ExCal01]

Has anyone heard anything recent regarding the status of the application for the $25 million grant to start build a 1.5 mile stretch of the streetcar in uptown? I believe the City Council authorized the application, so I assume it was made and the city is waiting to hear back the FTA?

[New Name]

^I was thinking about this too... considering CATS is saying they will likely cancel weekend service of the South End Trolley. So those things are free now....if you're broke on the South End rails, your broke on the Elizabeth Ave rails too...

[Urbanity]

Just posted in the 2030 transport thread. We might get some insight tomorrow:

http://charlotte.bizjournals.com/charlotte/blog/queen_city_agenda/2010/04/transit_chiefs_tackle_regional_issues.html

[southslider]

^^Except that the trolleys may move to Trade/Elizabeth, if Charlotte wins the grant, and CATS may not be responsible for funding their operation on such starter line.

Edited April 15, 2010 by southslider

[Urbanity]

There are a series of Streetcar Community Update meetings this week and next. According to the Observer, "The public will be able to see results of the Charlotte Area Transit System’s survey on potential streetcar line stops."

April 20, 2010

6:00 – 8:00 p.m.

St. Andrews Episcopal Church, Central Ave, Charlotte, NC 28205

April 22, 2010

6:00 – 8:00 p.m.

Charlotte-Mecklenburg Government Center, Charlotte, NC 28202

April 27, 2010

6:00 – 8:00 p.m.

Johnson C. Smith University, Sarah Belk Gambrell Auditorium, 100 Beatties Ford Road, Charlotte, NC 28216

www.charmeck.org/Departments/CATS/Rapid+Transit+Planning/Center+City/Upcoming+Public+Meetings.htm

[tozmervo]

The graphic and meeting minutes for the April meetings are up.

http://www.charmeck.org/Departments/CATS/Rapid+Transit+Planning/Center+City/Public+Meeting+Summaries.htm

It looks like there has been some minor location adjustments to some stops and three stops added based on more study and feedback.

There's also an intriguing plan in there showing how bike lanes might go around behind the stops. I'm not aware of a precedent for that proposal, but I like it.

[southslider]

The City should hear this week from the Feds as to whether the starter alignment (CTC-Presby) will be awarded Urban Circulator funding.

[New Name]

I'm amazed that this is still on the table for funding (even though I understand the sources and buckets from which the money comes from in relation to the black hole that is the City of Charlotte's finances).

I am SURE many more people will be amazed too (and by "amazed" I mean "angry and belligerent")

[southslider]

^Like the transformation of South End, Elizabeth redevelopment should counter some of the naysayers. Though the grant is to be announced this week, construction won't begin until 2011. By then, Charlotte should be enjoying an economy well into recovery. And if so, the next phase of streetcar (likely JCSU) should advance.

[New Name]

I like reading articles that forecast good news (according to my personal priority list). Of course, one man's "good news" is another man's folly - I'm always torn about leveraging tax money that the City obviously doesn't have - but this is tops of my list for ways to use that tax money...so - it's a wash.

Charlotte seems sure to win a $25 million federal grant this month to support development of a streetcar system. It’s a win expected to bring congratulations — and controversy.

Read more: Charlotte News - Charlotte Business Journal

[dubone]

If the Federal government backs this, that is great news. The economy still needs stimulation and investment in transit like this is especially good, especially when it helps connect our existing rail system with some major institutions, the government district, CPCC, Presbyterian Hospital, and major destinations like Met Midtown and Elizabeth Avenue.

I for one will absolutely be a rider on this line as I go to doctors at Presbyterian Hospital, and shops at Midtown. I currently tend to bum rides for both.

I am a little worried about the phase approach, but in a way (if you consider the old trolley was a starter line for the blue line), that has actually been a very successful model.

I do worry, though, that it will have very low ridership and that that will hurt prospects. But I guess future phases will have the benefit of computer models anyway.

[tozmervo]

Depending on service cost and frequency, I think the line could actually see reasonable ridership because of CPCC. There are lots of students that use bus lines to go from the CTC to CPCC now, and the trolley might provide a better alternative. (Of course, CATS would be siphoning off of their bus ridership.)

I've wanted the Red Line Gold Rush to extend down to Kings for a long time. It seems like such an easy and obvious change - Uptown access to CPCC and Midtown would be vastly improved.

[southslider]

Since the starter streetcar line will serve the Government District, I'd like to see the Gold Rush Red Line re-routed east of the Transit Center to Metropolitan via the new NASCAR Hall of Fame. From Trade at CTC, the Gold Rush could go down Caldwell to Stonewell to Charlottetowne, then looping back on Kings Drive, Pearl Park Way and Kenilworth back to Stonewall.

[New Name]

^Isn't the Gold Rush on it's last financial legs though? I just read that BOA and WF are phasing out their financial support of the Gold Rush - and CATS doesn't have enough money to run it free - I do think that you could charge $.50 and still get riders though....

[Urbanity]

CBJ just recently reported that City Center Partners want to expand service:

http://charlotte.biz..._transportation

Edited July 7, 2010 by Urbanity

[Sabaidee]

I'm curious about which streetcar technology CATS will choose for the line, I know CATS held a technology showcase with various vehicle manufacturers back in January. I think the new "third rail" or APS technology used in Bordeaux, France is pretty neat and Alstom was one of the invited manufacturer at the showcase.

Edited July 7, 2010 by Shawn&Zae

[Urbanity]

The word just came through. Charlotte got the federal 25m grant for starter streetcar line!

Apparently there is some press conference at 1:30 to announce and discuss the next steps!

Edited July 8, 2010 by Urbanity

[New Name]

The word just came through. Charlotte got the federal 25m grant for starter streetcar line!

Apparently there is some press conference at 1:30 to announce and discuss the next steps!

Awesome. I wonder who we beat out. Wasn't Ft. Worth trying to launch a Streetcar for quite some time too...

[Sabaidee]

Awesome. I wonder who we beat out. Wasn't Ft. Worth trying to launch a Streetcar for quite some time too...

Here's the list of the complete funding and which city got funding.

http://www.fta.dot.gov/news/news_events_11820.html

According to the FTA, our starter line will use the 3 replicas trolleys for the time being?

[New Name]

Streetcars for St. Louis, Cincinatti, Dallas, Ft. Worth and Charlotte!

Ladies and gentlemen, I think we're looking at a huge paradigm shift when it comes to how American's will think about transportation. These are not vanity projects - these are seeds.