Wyoming Land Use Plan 2020 - DRAFT

[francishsu]

The City of Wyoming has released a draft of their future land use plan. A series of public meetings, starting in May, are scheduled to get input from various communities.

Overview of Wyoming LUP 2020

http://www.ci.wyoming.mi.us/plan_future.htm

Details of the plan, with the exception of the map, are apparantly currently not available on the website, but can be obtained from the Planning Commission Department.

Land Use Plan Map DRAFT

March 2006 Zoning Map

Currently scheduled public meetings

Location: City Council Chambers

Time: 7 - 9pm

May 9th - North and central portions

May 23rd - Areas east of Division Avenue

May 30th - South area

[GR_Urbanist]

Wyoming Land Use Plan:

Build bigger parking lots.

More strip malls.

Tax credits to encourage more payday loan stores, and pawn shops in the "downtown area".

Widen 28th street to encourage more pedestrain traffic.

Make more city streets dead end roads.

[GRGyp]

Build bigger parking lots.

All part of a cunning plan to save the Great Lakes. Bigger parking lots mean more sewer run off. More sewer run off equates to more discharges into the Grand River. More discharges into the river, means more water flowing into Lake Michigan. Lake levels go up! Where's the problem?

More strip malls.

Don't give Mr. London any more ideas.

Tax credits to encourage more payday loan stores, and pawn shops in the "downtown area".

And dollar stores. You can never have too many dollar stores.

Widen 28th street to encourage more pedestrain traffic.

Wyoming's is an aging population. The drivers are a little slower on the gas pedal as a result. A wider 28th street increases the chance of more bonus points awarded to drivers when they take out pedestrians forced onto longer intersection crosswalks.

Make more city streets dead end roads.

Also make them one way, to further decrease traffic congestion.

[GRDadof3]

Build bigger parking lots.

All part of a cunning plan to save the Great Lakes. Bigger parking lots mean more sewer run off. More sewer run off equates to more discharges into the Grand River. More discharges into the river, means more water flowing into Lake Michigan. Lake levels go up! Where's the problem?

More strip malls.

Don't give Mr. London any more ideas.

Tax credits to encourage more payday loan stores, and pawn shops in the "downtown area".

And dollar stores. You can never have too many dollar stores.

Widen 28th street to encourage more pedestrain traffic.

Wyoming's is an aging population. The drivers are a little slower on the gas pedal as a result. A wider 28th street increases the chance of more bonus points awarded to drivers when they take out pedestrians forced onto longer intersection crosswalks.

Make more city streets dead end roads.

Also make them one way, to further decrease traffic congestion.

I like that last one the best.

Thanks for the info francishsu.

[grrwymg]

Ouch - my city just got kicked in the junk.

Yes, 28th St. is a abomination. Yes, "Wy-Man" is rediculous. But overall - it's a fine place to live and raise a family. Wyoming is much more than 28th St.

I'm sure there are much more positives than negatives in Wyoming.

[francishsu]

When I get the time I'm going to try to compare the future Land Use Plan to the current zoning. Probably little change in the parts of Wyoming already built out.

I agree, grrwymg, Wyoming is a good place to raise a family and its population has continued to grow. Some people on this board like to slam Wyoming, but then some people want to annex it.

[Phizzy]

Land Use Plan Map

Has Wyoming annexed parts of Byron Township? It looks like it based on the map.

[GRGyp]

When I get the time I'm going to try to compare the future Land Use Plan to the current zoning. Probably little change in the parts of Wyoming already built out.

I agree, grrwymg, Wyoming is a good place to raise a family and its population has continued to grow. Some people on this board like to slam Wyoming, but then some people want to annex it.

I was born and raised in Wyoming, and it is still a good place to live. The thing to remember is it's a suburb, still a relatively young city, and not the main city in this area. As such it's going to have it's up and down moments as the neighborhoods turn over and are replaced by new generations of people living there.

A lot of the neighborhoods in Wyoming are turning over for the first time. Houses built in the late 50's through 70's that were purchased by young people just starting out families, have seen those families grow, watched the children become adults and move out, and now have the original owners retiring and moving on. In the last 15 to 20 years this has been happening.

Most of these neighborhoods were built in blocks, with the same demographics moving in, growing, and aging at the same time. Basic laws of averages state that they will all move on in short period of time, and you will get a radical turnover in demographics in these neighborhoods during this time. It's only natural that a little culture shock is going on in Wyoming right now.

We are not taking about 3rd, 4th, and 5th generations households like Grand Rapids in these neighborhoods where time has evened out the moving of people in and out to steady flow. These are 1st and 2nd generation households moving in and out, and so it will be bursty and dramatic when it occurs.

Sound planning in Wyoimng is a must right now.

[francishsu]

Has Wyoming annexed parts of Byron Township? It looks like it based on the map.

Technically, the land in question is conditionally transferred from Byron Township to Wyoming under a P.A. 425 agreement rather than annexation. I'm not familiar with all the conditions, but I believe that Byron Township will get some revenue off of the millage. After the 50 years, I'm not sure whether it reverts back to Byron Township or if it ends up being annexed by Wyoming. But for at least 50 years, it seems that the land is basically treated as belonging to Wyoming. Any residents become Wyoming residents I believe.

[roberto]

When I get the time I'm going to try to compare the future Land Use Plan to the current zoning. Probably little change in the parts of Wyoming already built out.

I agree, grrwymg, Wyoming is a good place to raise a family and its population has continued to grow. Some people on this board like to slam Wyoming, but then some people want to annex it.

True. After living in Cascade Township for 20+ years, we moved to Wyoming 2 years ago and were pleasantly surprised with the services Wyoming provides to their residents.

Re: The aging population comment. Not true. We are getting alot of young families moving into our neighborhood.

[GRDadof3]

It's too bad Wyoming's taxes are so high. Something like 36 Mills? The city may need to look at possibly lowering them if they want to spur more consistent growth in the older sections. Otherwise, it will continue to bleed people to Georgetown and Byron Townships, where millages are in the mid to high 20's.

[francishsu]

There's much more affordable housing available in Wyoming, especially compared to Byron Township. The average home price in Byron Township is twice as expensive. You say the population is bleeding, yet Wyoming population grew from 2000-2005. And it's projected to reach its build out population in 2010. The Wyoming millage is in line with Grandville, Kentwood and Hudsonville. We'll see what happens with the millage in Byron Township and Georgetown as their populations grow.

[GRDadof3]

There's much more affordable housing available in Wyoming, especially compared to Byron Township. The average home price in Byron Township is twice as expensive. You say the population is bleeding, yet Wyoming population grew from 2000-2005. And it's projected to reach its build out population in 2010. The Wyoming millage is in line with Grandville, Kentwood and Hudsonville. We'll see what happens with the millage in Byron Township and Georgetown as their populations grow.

That's true that there are more affordable houses now. But even a $120K home has taxes of over 2100/year.

You're right, they're in line with Grandville and Kentwood, but theirs are also high. Very few people actually live IN the city of Hudsonville, so I wouldn't necessarily compare the two. The townships have a lot of room to grow, so I don't see the millages going up anytime soon in any of them. In fact, most of them are probably flush with cash. Especially townships like Jamestown, Georgetown or Dorr.

Even Grand Rapids taxes (Grand Rapids Schools) are only 29 mills, which is comparable to Cascade (Forest Hills Schools) and Caledonia (Caledonia Schools). I'd love to see Wyoming succeed, but a reassessment of its tax structure may be warranted. Especially when taxes are so high and they still had to close fire stations recently.

Kent County Tax Tables 2004

[blindside]

After close inspection of the proposed land use plan for 2020 I could not find anything different from what we have today. Isn't Wyoming supposed to be the "city of vision and progress"? The large swath of low-density residential is pretty gross to look at.

[MJLO]

Wyoming makes no sense, will someone tell me the distinction Between Wyoming and Grand Rapids? The only reason it was formed was to spite GR in the first place. It's the original inner ring suburb, it's the Livonia, Warren, and anything downriver, of west Michigan.

And can someone please! tell me why it has 5 separate school districts within it's borders! That has always bugged the crap out of me. Thats more annoying than calling 28th st Downtown. Wyoming bugs me, it's the one place in the metro area I refuse to live, it's so obscure and mediocre! God placed purgatory in Michigan, he named it Wyoming.

[grrwymg]

It's too bad Wyoming's taxes are so high. Something like 36 Mills? The city may need to look at possibly lowering them if they want to spur more consistent growth in the older sections. Otherwise, it will continue to bleed people to Georgetown and Byron Townships, where millages are in the mid to high 20's.

Just a touch over 34 mills. But yes. Like the city did a few posts back, I am taking a kick to the junk everytime taxes come due.

[grrwymg]

And can someone please! tell me why it has 5 separate school districts within it's borders! That has always bugged the crap out of me.

That's a good question. I've only lived in Wyoming since Apr. 2002. I don't have any kids yet - but that question has always bugged me too. I think consolidation of a few of the smaller districts w/ the bigger districts would help. But then you're faced w/ folks being attached to their 'district' - so who knows...

Thats more annoying than calling 28th st Downtown. Wyoming bugs me, it's the one place in the metro area I refuse to live, it's so obscure and mediocre! God placed purgatory in Michigan, he named it Wyoming.

Ouch. Yes - it does seem silly to call 28th street "downtown Wyoming"; it's rather sad. But purgatory? Yeesh. 28th street is just as bad in GR and in Cascade as it is in Wyoming. I guess I don't understand all the negative vibe surrounding Wyoming on this board. <shrug>

[MJLO]

Wyoming is just icky, I'm not trying to knock on you're town man, it's one of those places thats in the middle on everything the poster child for mediocrity. It's not horrible, but it's not great. It's not ghetto, it's like the diet ghetto, or ghetto-lite

[Rizzo]

Wyoming makes no sense, will someone tell me the distinction Between Wyoming and Grand Rapids? The only reason it was formed was to spite GR in the first place. It's the original inner ring suburb, it's the Livonia, Warren, and anything downriver, of west Michigan.

And can someone please! tell me why it has 5 separate school districts within it's borders! That has always bugged the crap out of me. Thats more annoying than calling 28th st Downtown. Wyoming bugs me, it's the one place in the metro area I refuse to live, it's so obscure and mediocre! God placed purgatory in Michigan, he named it Wyoming.

Wyoming reminds me of a thorn in the side of GR. Wyoming is liked by many people because you can have gritty urban or classic 50s suburban... theres a wide spectrum of Wyoming that appeals to a lot of people, its population reflects that.

[allbusiness]

It's too bad Wyoming's taxes are so high. Something like 36 Mills? The city may need to look at possibly lowering them if they want to spur more consistent growth in the older sections. Otherwise, it will continue to bleed people to Georgetown and Byron Townships, where millages are in the mid to high 20's.

I don't think it's fair to compare any city's tax structure to a township's tax structure. It's apples and oranges.

Cities typically provide police and fire services, plus snow plowing and hundreds of other services that county government provides to townships. If cities got rid of their police and fire services (typically 40-50% of any city's budget), their taxes would be low too. It's a choice people make.

Not that city residents don't pay the same level of county taxes for almost no services -- they do! If city residents stopped paying just the county taxes for the sheriff department (from which they receive no services), the taxes in the townships would increase dramatically.

I thought one of the goals of this forum was to promote CITY life, not the "low tax, low density, big lot, drive everywhere" lifestyle of the typical townships....

Again, it's a choice each of us makes.

Me? I'm a city boy.

[GRDadof3]

I don't think it's fair to compare any city's tax structure to a township's tax structure. It's apples and oranges.

Cities typically provide police and fire services, plus snow plowing and hundreds of other services that county government provides to townships. If cities got rid of their police and fire services (typically 40-50% of any city's budget), their taxes would be low too. It's a choice people make.

Not that city residents don't pay the same level of county taxes for almost no services -- they do! If city residents stopped paying just the county taxes for the sheriff department (from which they receive no services), the taxes in the townships would increase dramatically.

I thought one of the goals of this forum was to promote CITY life, not the "low tax, low density, big lot, drive everywhere" lifestyle of the typical townships....

Again, it's a choice each of us makes.

Me? I'm a city boy.

I'm not promoting township life. I'm just pointing out that many people are attracted to the low tax lifestyle that township living provides. Just like low tax structure States are enjoying economic booms. But the comparision is apples to apples for people looking to buy a home, or looking to relocate. Cities need to compete for residents just like States do.

[francishsu]

Even Grand Rapids taxes (Grand Rapids Schools) are only 29 mills, which is comparable to Cascade (Forest Hills Schools) and Caledonia (Caledonia Schools). I'd love to see Wyoming succeed, but a reassessment of its tax structure may be warranted. Especially when taxes are so high and they still had to close fire stations recently.

As you well know, GR also has the city income tax on top of the property tax. At the $120,000 range, even with moderate household income, you're going to break about even. I don't think it'll be wise for Wyoming to lower the millage at this time. Property values would need to grow accordingly to compensate.

Also, I'm not sure what your definition and measuring stick of "success" would be for Wyoming.

[GRGyp]

And can someone please! tell me why it has 5 separate school districts within it's borders! That has always bugged the crap out of me.

When does school districting have anything to do with city operations? Heck, Grandville schools has jurisdiction over Wyoming students west of Byron Center Ave and into the Wyoming panhandle. The money Grandville has been expanding with has come mostly from student head count money from families moving into developments built within the city of Wyoming!

All that districting for the smaller school districts with n it (Godfrey-Lee, Kelloggsville, Godwin) was most likely set well before Wyoming incorporated into a city anyway. It's something that should be addressed state education board. At the very least Godfrey Lee should be forced to merge into the Wyoming school system and Kelloggsville and Godwin should be merged as well. At the same time, Wyoming Public should seriously look into merging all three high schools under one roof. Wyoming Park at a small class B, Rogers at class B, and Godfrey at a small class C would make for a much more healthy school system to pool resources, upgrade facilities, and get kids back into a setting parents would like them to be in.

The overhead saved on duplicity of management staff and facilities would get more money back to kids who really deserve it.

[GR8scott]

I've always liked Wyoming there is a lot there. But it seems like a real mixed bag of things.

For the most part it reminds me of some of the Detroit subburbs along Woodward and Gratiot (28th street like only 2 running side by side in a boulivard) which is why I think it would be cool but probably not possible to widen 28th and turn into a boulivard.

I don't know what some of you find "icky" about it, it is mostly an older WWII era inner ring subburb, so yeah the houses are older, smaller, closer together, the retail is older some unkept, and some not planned very well but thats going to happen as time goes on.

The school systems have always bothered me too, I don;t know why Godwin Hights and Godfrey Lee are not part of Wyoming in the first place. IMO, it would be best if GR annexed the land in those 2 districts from Wyoming and they merged into GRPS. At the very least, they should consolidate into Wyoming school, which would be a lot more probable concerning budgets and the fact they are in Wyoming.

Kellogsville should break away from Wyoming, Kentwood, and Gains TWS. and become its own city. And Wyoming should annex the land up to the South Beltline and develop that along with the panhandle with higher density and industrial.

And the Grandville portion of Wyoming is there because there is nothing in Wyoming in the panhandle and its right next to Grandville high school, so it should either be developed by wyoming with higher density (something like Sterling Hights) and build a new school down there or annexed by Grandville.

Maybe "downtown" Wyoming could build some midrises like an a few 5-10 story office, apartment, or hotel buildings (Royal Oak/Birmingham)

Thats my basic rant on Wyoming, it should be more like Detroits subburbs (not a bad thing) so dont get me started on Kentwood or Walker either

[MJLO]

I've always had my opinions on Wyoming, to me it's presence creates an energy rift, that fractions the metro area from functioning smoother, People like Mr. Vorhee's and his stances. As a city it just seems so unorganized. I am very aware that the school districts existed before the city incorporated. It would only make sense to streamline them, and I think having a unified school district would make Wyoming have a more community sense. It's just people that have ties to the schools, and nostalgia, that would fight the merger. But the very creation of Wyoming is a perfect example of the local rule battles that went on back in the 60's. It was these kind of government formations, that have helped accelerate the Demise of Detroit. They continue to this day, to prevent Southeastern Michigan from coming to a unified stance, and progressing forward. I would hate to see that happen here. Wyoming is alot like the burbs of Detroit, but the Inner ring ones that haven't faired so well in recent years. Not a good thing to be likened to. Do I think it needs mid-rises, No, I think that would be in direct competition to the downtown office market. I think what it needs to do is seriously look at itself, it's crappy two bedroom, one bath tiny homes, on tiny lots, bungalows. Figure out what the best way to Reverse it's declining image, and truly come up with a plan to beautify it's "downtown". It can be done. But the direction things are going, is just rearranging chairs on a sinking ship. You have to do more than put in old style lights along 28th st. Most of it sill doesn't have side walks. It looks rediculous. But at least I know where I can go to cash my checks or get cash advances.