Uptown skyshow to head to Knights Stadium

[dubone]

Yeah, that wasn't really consensus at all. In fact, my position was that uptown already has such a concentration of public and subsidized housing that we are pretty far away from being an emerald city or what not.

As for people not wanting to live uptown, I will refer you to the sales numbers for the condominium projects. Even existing units in First Ward sell in a matter of days or weeks on the market. People do want to live uptown, and the home values are a result of that, not in spite of that.

But anyway, the idea is that we are trying to build the inner city into a place that is desireable to live, not just a place of ghettos (forgive the word) filled with crime, drugs, and poverty.

We are trying hard to make it safe, to build a community, to create a sense of place that is more than just an office park. We are trying to build up the entertainment aspect, as that is what most new uptown residents want (most are young and without children), while also generating more economic activity out of the visitors and the commuters. But we are also adding grocery stores, drug stores, on top of our pre-existing neighborhood services like cleaners, convenience stores, barbers, etc.

But lively entertainment-related activity are what makes for a vibrant center city. Without the entertainment places, even uptown residents would be in their homes in front of the television. Pubs, clubs, theatres, and special events like fireworks get everyone out in the streets, comingling. That's what its all about. And things will not be the same this July Fourth, and that is a shame.

[queensguy06]

17 individuals were arrested, 0.02125% of the people in attendance.

Was it really .02125% or was that sarcasm? That means that only 800 people showed up. I would cancel the show if only 800 people showed up.

[atlrvr]

That would be 80,000......if it was 800 then it would have been 2.125%.

[reverbandwhiskey]

Opening day was the busiest of the year. There isn't anyone at the games now (comparitively speaking).

Plus, I find it very hard to believe it took you an hour to get from Pineville to Fort Mill. Maybe 30 minutes at the most on a busy day. But an hour? You can take Rt. 51 near the mall through downtown Pineville over the RR tracks, and continue on to Fort Mill that way. It shouldn't take you more than 30 mins tops. If it took you an hour there must have been some horrible accident or something. 485 east usually backs up from the mall back to I-77, but it takes 20-30 mins even when traffic is backed up. 485 west usually doesn't have any problems. (unless there was an accident)

Yes, It was busy, about 10,000 at the game. And traffic was a disaster we took 77 down and it honestly took exactly an hour to go from the parking lot at my bike shop on Polk St to the time we got out of the car in the Knights parking lot.

Now, how many people do you think are going to come for the fireworks display? Tell me honestly that you believe that the area around the Knights Stadium can handle that amount of traffic.

[mediamongrel]

I think WBT did us a favor by getting out of the way so, perhaps, a fresh new look can be painted for our 4th celebration that isn't promoted by a bitter right-wing radio station.

Ok, if you're not going to the show because you think a radio station is "right-wing" this thread is getting way off the topic. I should have figured it was the fault of Bush that the fireworks show has moved.

[monsoon]

It only takes one person these days to hurt a lot of people in a big crowd. If the police managed to arrest 17 then that means several times that number were involved in the riot. If you go back and read the comments of the people who were there that posted here on Urbanplanet, they were genuinually scared for themselves and family including their children. Nobody wants to be in the vicinity of people in the middle of a pitched battle of confused hand-to-hand fighting and a violent free-for-all. (this is the definition of melee which the papers and police have used to describe the event.) I believe that at least one person here said that someone was throwing fireworks into the crowd. A very scary proposition to consider if you are going to take your kids or possibly elderly parents there to watch the show.

None of the dozen or so suburban fireworks events have anything remotely close to something like this happening.

[turbocraig]

Neither did uptown's show for 29 years, till last year's sole issue. It could have happened anywhere, even in white bread suburbs. You can't always stop people that want to hurt people from doing just that. Since that crazy Islamic follower drove his Jeep into a crowd at Chapel Hill a couple months ago, I guess people shouldn't go to college either? Kent State, anyone? Random shoot 'em ups at fast food restaurants? Let's all stay indoors so we don't get hurt.

As you stated, it only takes one person to hurt a lot of people in a crowd, no matter where that crowd is. But I guarantee you that none of these suburban shows will have nearly the police presence that uptown did. So, if someone does get crazy... well, good luck.

[monsoon]

Kent state was tragic. It should be noted that shooting was performed by the police.

[turbocraig]

It was the National Guard, but the point there is that even so-called rational people are capable of making poor choices that can hurt people in crowd conditons. Just because the venue changes, doesn't meet the mindset will, or that any variety of circumstances can result in someone getting hurt. In the words of the late Pope John Paul, "People are People". Oh wait, no... that was Depeche Mode.

[dubone]

Yes, but people are people, and bad things can happen anywhere. Grandmothers get raped in the suburbs, children get run over by icecream trucks, mothers get beaten up by fathers, children watch their mothers come off of a drug fix, you name it... Bad things happen anywhere. Do the gang kids that showed up downtown and wreaked havoc last year have cars? Yes. Do they know how to steal one if they don't? Yes. Do they know how to get to Fort Mill and Huntersville? Yes.

Per capita, crime is lower in the central district, so fewer scary things happen to people living there. But crime happens everywhere.

The events last year were scary, but in real risks, their families were more at risk on their drive home on 77 than they were when they were downtown last July Fourth.

[monsoon]

Do they know how to get to Fort Mill and Huntersville? Yes.

Per capita, crime is lower in the central district, so fewer scary things happen to people living there. But crime happens everywhere.

Maybe, but I can't say that I have ever seen that they have in the vast numbers that inhabit downtown at night.

I have yet to see a pimped out escalade riding on 24s cruising around The Pennisula.

In terms of crime, I believe there has been one homicide in North Mecklenburg in the last decade and that was between two guys fighting over a woman. (ironically after going downtown where the fight began) The love struck guy stuck the other with a knife in front of the police, and he was immediately arrested. I don't think worrying about urban thugs getting in cars and coming to the outlying areas is much of a concern. It just doesn't happen.

[dubone]

The paradox of crime statistics is that it is skewed by geographical area. Crime is a social result, not the result of land area. When there is a density of people, there will be more crimes in a geographical area. When 80,000-100,000 people are in a quarter square mile for an event, there are risks for crime. But the real risk for individual members of that crowd is greatly diluted.

I don't know. I guess I just don't want to live in fear and flee somewhere with fewer people just for the notion that little crime happens within 5 miles of me.

No comment on the Escalades.

[monsoon]

The paradox of crime statistics is that it is skewed by geographical area. Crime is a social result, not the result of land area. When there is a density of people, there will be more crimes in a geographical area. When 80,000-100,000 people are in a quarter square mile for an event, there are risks for crime. .......

In a few weeks, you will have 250,000 people in an even smaller area than that of uptown at the Cocacola 600 race. It's far far larger than any downtown event, yet I have never ever heard of a "melee" taking place there by disenfranchised urban youth.

[Charlotte_native]

Ok, if you're not going to the show because you think a radio station is "right-wing" this thread is getting way off the topic. I should have figured it was the fault of Bush that the fireworks show has moved.

Oh I've gone to the show for years even though I dislike the content of the station -- my point was more simple than that (and i certainly don't blame any shrubs for fireworks moving) -- my point was only that a show sponsored by some entity without an agenda would be nice. Nothing more.

As for the NC - SC debate. The location outside the city is irrelevant to me. I would feel the same if it were in NC but in Kannapolis or Gastonia. The point of building an urban environment is to have a concentration of amenities, events, living, and commercial all in one place. A place where you don't have to drive to everything -- so getting on the interstate to leave town to go to an event promoted as the display for that town makes no sense.

[Charlotte_native]

In a few weeks, you will have 250,000 people in an even smaller area than that of uptown at the Cocacola 600 race. It's far far larger than any downtown event, yet I have never ever heard of a "melee" taking place there by disenfranchised urban youth.

You have never heard of the melee at the races because it doesn't make the news. There are plenty of fights in the parking lots and at the event. "Urban" people downtown fighting makes the news, not "non-urban" people fighting at races, high school football games, etc. I lived in Charlotte for my first 10 years or so then Mint Hill for 10 more -- there is plenty of violence outside the core city -- all the time.

[ngp]

In a few weeks, you will have 250,000 people in an even smaller area than that of uptown at the Cocacola 600 race. It's far far larger than any downtown event, yet I have never ever heard of a "melee" taking place there by disenfranchised urban youth.

I've probably said this here before, but a downtown fireworks show with a few arrests is still vastly more family-friendly than what goes on at those races. Belligerent drunk rednecks lifting up women's shirts against their wishes, fights in the parking lot, projectiles being tossed at people, and some of the most vile racism I've ever heard in person.

You aren't seeing melee's by disenfranchised urban youth at the race because the disenfranchised urban youths can't pay $100 per person to take part in the event. Open the doors to everyone and watch what happens.

Some people are just too lazy to drive period.

Yeah, because as we all know, nothing says "healthy and active" like driving a car everywhere you go.

[monsoon]

You have never heard of the melee at the races because it doesn't make the news. There are plenty of fights in the parking lots and at the event. "Urban" people downtown fighting makes the news, not "non-urban" people fighting at races, high school football games, etc. I lived in Charlotte for my first 10 years or so then Mint Hill for 10 more -- there is plenty of violence outside the core city -- all the time.

Well, you do have a point about the reporting. I am the first to say level of news reporting here amounts to litte more than tabloid sensationalism. However the CocoCola 600 isn't having to move or close down because people are beating each other to smitherines in riots and melees. Everyone understands individuals getting drunk and getting into fights. They don't however understand or tolerate swarms of gangs fighting each other with little regard for the others around them. Many of these people also fought the police which is why they got arrested. Drunks don't normally do this. That is the big difference.

[dubone]

The point is, WBT didn't have to move the fireworks either. It is purely perception breeding reality. Uptown is not more dangerous in 2005-6 than it was in 1985-6. Everyone knows that.

[Seabreeze]

It only takes one person these days to hurt a lot of people in a big crowd. If the police managed to arrest 17 then that means several times that number were involved in the riot. If you go back and read the comments of the people who were there that posted here on Urbanplanet, they were genuinually scared for themselves and family including their children. Nobody wants to be in the vicinity of people in the middle of a pitched battle of confused hand-to-hand fighting and a violent free-for-all. (this is the definition of melee which the papers and police have used to describe the event.) I believe that at least one person here said that someone was throwing fireworks into the crowd. A very scary proposition to consider if you are going to take your kids or possibly elderly parents there to watch the show.

None of the dozen or so suburban fireworks events have anything remotely close to something like this happening.

I actaully started that thread. I agree, it was crazy. But I think solving a problem by simply avoiding the scenario is not that bright. There will always be events that draw large crowds downtown. Instead, there should be newspaper articles about how the city is upping security for skyshow... and the station putting on the show shouldnt have to bare the whole cost of this. I really think the city and businesses downtown all benefit from events such as skyshow... the other businesses really should have stepped up and help witht he rising costs of the show.

[cinco]

yeah, i'm afraid the only fireworks the uptown area will get this year, is a bunch of repressed youth popping off their pistols in the air.

but the excuse of a "melee" is playing patsy to the real reason.... $.

[reverbandwhiskey]

Yeah, because as we all know, nothing says "healthy and active" like driving a car everywhere you go.

Ok, that just made my morning.

[rooster8]

I can't believe that Charlotte will no longer have a major fireworks show for the 4th. I agree with other suggestions that perhaps one of the banks could help with it. It doesn't even have to be uptown, but there should be one big show for the whole city.

Also, I think it's ridiculous that WBT was running the show themselves. There are lots of companies out there that plan these kinds of things. I don't understand why they were doing all the work. If they didn't want to pay for it any more, they should have just said it was too expensive and not blame it on other factors (time, violence, etc.).

[Charlotte_native]

I can't believe that Charlotte will no longer have a major fireworks show for the 4th. I agree with other suggestions that perhaps one of the banks could help with it. It doesn't even have to be uptown, but there should be one big show for the whole city.

Also, I think it's ridiculous that WBT was running the show themselves. There are lots of companies out there that plan these kinds of things. I don't understand why they were doing all the work. If they didn't want to pay for it any more, they should have just said it was too expensive and not blame it on other factors (time, violence, etc.).

Perhaps all of this is a gracious way for WBT to bow out and make room for a new sponsor without looking like they quit. Not that I have any solid reason to believe so, but I find it surprising that Center City Partners, the mayor, and all involved players would truly get caught by surprise by something like this. Maybe a good chance to get everyone in arms, upset, like us that the event is "leaving" so they can announce the new savior corporate sponsor and also justify why the city will spend more $ on security (to appease the "I love all the stuff that comes with a city but don't want to pay for it" folks).

[monsoon]

One thing to note is that when WBT started this fireworks show in the 70s, it was the biggest pop radio station in the city as FM had not yet taken off that much yet. It, and WAYS owned the airwaves for POP. This is where people like Bob Lacy (Bob & Sherry) got their start. So the fireworks show was a natural for them then as WBT was as Charlotte as Harris Teeter. In those days they could demand anything they wanted for Ad revenue.

The migration to talk radio is fairly recent for them in their long history in the city. Remember this is the oldest radio station in the Carolinas and is so old that it only has 3 call letters. However FM, Satellite, MP3s, the internet, has killed AM radio and they are on the way out to being a place that caters to a very small minority of radio listeners. As I mentioned earlier, I believe it was their new owners that killed off the expense of the fireworks show as it no longer makes sense for this station.

[UptownGrrl]

Perhaps all of this is a gracious way for WBT to bow out and make room for a new sponsor without looking like they quit. Not that I have any solid reason to believe so, but I find it surprising that Center City Partners, the mayor, and all involved players would truly get caught by surprise by something like this. Maybe a good chance to get everyone in arms, upset, like us that the event is "leaving" so they can announce the new savior corporate sponsor and also justify why the city will spend more $ on security (to appease the "I love all the stuff that comes with a city but don't want to pay for it" folks).

Well I give credit to Center City Partners and city staff for jumping on this right away. Can't say whether WBT's decision was a surprise or not, but anticipating the public fallout, they've hustled to do whatever they can to save the day and keep an Independence Day celebration viewable from uptown and the immediately surrounding area. It will be great if they can pull it off. I hear the last major hurdle to be addressed is nailing down sponsorship committments - and pretty quickly. Does Urban Planet have like an extra 50K laying around??