Steelcase property on the move

[GRGyp]

call me out of the loop... but what happened to Steelcase? That place of theirs on Eastern and 44th is HUGE. Are they out of business or something? Did they move? Is someone going to buy that weird looking pyramid building of theirs?

The story I heard was that the 44th street manufacturing location was shutdown because the plant no longer fits how Steelcase runs it's business. Steelcase switched over to more of a JIT (just in time) manufacturing concept and the 44th street plant isn't setup for it. The plant was built during the time where Steelcase would stockpile parts, raw materials, and finished product at the manufacturing centers.

The 52nd Street plant is better setup to do this and can handle the capacity. So I guess it was simply a better option for Steelcase to shut the 44th Street plant down and sell it, then retrofit the plant and put all the unused space to work.

Guys think about it, If it's something on say, the steelcase land, look at what those facilities are geared for. If it's Walmart, which who really knows. It's not going to be retail, it's going to be distribution. It would be Walmart moving brain capitol, and investment into, argueably the hardest market for them to break into. I mean I guess I could see a supercenter, since they have been trying to build on 44th for a while now. But my money given facilities and proximity would be more geared towards the operations side vs. the retail.

According to Fox 17, the plant sits on over 200 acres of land. That's a massive amount land to move just one tenent into, especially given fact to how much more compact and focused manufacturing facilities are now days. My best guess is they parcel up the 200 acres and move several tenants into the area.

The existing Steelcase buildings take up a third of a square mile. It's 4 to 5 times the size of the original footprint for what we thought Faust's multi-billion dollar RiverGrand project was going to be. It's going to take more than a Wal-mart Super Center to take up that area. One of Wal-Marts mega distribution centers might take up a good portion of it, but do really want to see something like this in the middle of Kentwood?

Not to mention that Michigan wouldn't be an idea place for a distrubtion center considering it's flanked by water on three sides. A distribution center here could basically serve Michigan, Indiana, Illinois, Ohio and parts Wisconsin before freight costs to go around the lakes would take their toll. Plus they already have a mega distrubution center south of Indianpolis so Illinois, Indiana and Ohio are already covered there.

[DwntwnGeo]

One of the articles that I read yesterday mentioned that most (around 85% seems to stick in my mind) of the existing plants and building will be demoed to make way for "condos, retail, and possible subdivision."

You are right GRGyp about the older Steelcase plants. These plants were build when they stock piled or housed a lot of raw materials and also finished products waiting for distribution etc. In today's world, most businesses cannot operate in this fashion. I guess it was cheaper to build newer factories over by the Pryamid than it would have been to reburbish these older plants.

I don't think a company of the size of Walmart, Costco, Meijers etc., would be interested in something like this anyways. With as large as any of them are, I would think they would want to be near a major transportation route. Granted 44th Street is a busier street in the area, but if they had the chance, wouldn't they rather be closer to I-96, I-196, US131, or M6 where they would have very easy access to the largest transportation routes in the area?

[Sunlover38]

How about a Mall of America

[GRDadof3]

Not to mention that Michigan wouldn't be an idea place for a distrubtion center considering it's flanked by water on three sides. A distribution center here could basically serve Michigan, Indiana, Illinois, Ohio and parts Wisconsin before freight costs to go around the lakes would take their toll. Plus they already have a mega distrubution center south of Indianpolis so Illinois, Indiana and Ohio are already covered there.

Not to keep this moving off-topic, but they looked at Mt Pleasant for a Walmart Distribution facility, but I don't think it went through because they couldn't get all the tax breaks they wanted. This was a few years ago I think.

[GRGyp]

Not to keep this moving off-topic, but they looked at Mt Pleasant for a Walmart Distribution facility, but I don't think it went through because they couldn't get all the tax breaks they wanted. This was a few years ago I think.

Let me rephase that A distribution center in Michigan is not an ideal place to have one if you want to service a regional area of several states. If your goal is to just service Michigan, and possibly northern Indiana, northern Illinois, and northwestern Ohio, it's possible. If Walmart did build a big distribution center in Michigan somewhere, it most likely be done for two reasons.

1) Provide a closer a less costly distribution path into the Chicago and Detroit markets.

2) Signal that they are going to drop super centers all over the state of Michigan and lock horns with Meijer. I pity Meijer if this happens.

To have this happen on the Steelcase property, however, I have to agree with DwntwnGeo and say that traffic issues would be prohibitive. A place like M-6 and 8th Avenue would be more there style. Large farmland area where they could plop down a large facility and give quick access to M-6, I-196, and US-131.

The 44th street site would be a better place for a more urban/suburban redevelopment to revitalize the neighborhood. Maybe a living center concept with a retail hub near 44th and Eastern with mixed residential moving back northeastward towards 36th and comercial development going up along Eastern to the north? I say this because don't think you want to add more traffic to 36th Street, but at the same time Eastern Avenue along that stretch is vastly underutilized and needs a influx of business to justify the 4 lanes of pavement. There really isn't a lot of traffic flowing over that stretch of road currently.

[tony speller]

HOLY SHNIKIES!! 200 ACRES?!?!?!

... and i bet it's being sold for less than the 30-some acres downtown

[tony speller]

Not to keep this moving off-topic, but they looked at Mt Pleasant for a Walmart Distribution facility, but I don't think it went through because they couldn't get all the tax breaks they wanted. This was a few years ago I think.

There is actually a pretty huge distro place in Coldwater, southeast of Kzoo. That's actually not a bad spot... right in between (with easy access to) Detroit, Chicago, Kzoo, Grand Rapids, Fort Wayne, South Bend, and everywhere else in between. Building another center like that in Grand Rapids would seem pointless... especially when the west part of the state is ruled by Meijer.

[starrfish]

The article in yesterday's GR Press said "a mix of houses, restaurants, stores and industrial uses." They also mention Ashley Capital being responsible for developing the Detroit Race Course land in Livonia - from race track to corporate center/retail shopping area. Major tenents of that development include Technicolor, International Paper, Costco and Meijer.

Whatever ends up on this parcel, my fingers are crossed that there won't me a WalMart of any kind involved. It will definitely be an interesting project to watch...

[AlexPKeaton]

I suggested Wal-Mart for the other "massive land deal" GRDad mentioned, not the Steelcase property. And that was just making a guess based on his unloved company comment.

-nb

[bwindi25]

I thought the mayor stated in his State of City address earlier this year that the city wanted to turn this Steelcase land into a sustainable business park. "one companies waste becomes the next companies raw material" Am I thinking of the wrong area or did the "Sustainability" idea just look good in the press and get scrapped when a real deal came along? anybody know?

[MJLO]

I very much disagree that Michigan is not the "ideal" place for Distribution center. Couple reasons.

1. Michigan has been pretty much the only place that Walmart has not been able to dominate. Namely because two of the Nations largest general Merchandisers are, and have been headquartered here long before Walmart existed. What better way than to build a customer base, in an area that has beat you back for decades, than to go in and become one of the areas largest employers. Create a customer base from the inside out.

2. Michigan is closed off on three sides, but easily accessible, with in 6 hours drive of the largest concentration of people in the country. MI, OH, IL, IN and Southern WI combined have about 50 million people. The entire west coast can't even claim that many people. If you were to take all the mountain, and plains states. AZ NM CO ID MT NV WY SD ND NE KS OK, all of these states populations added together, would come to about half. So I don't think it would be that bad of a business decision, because you're really not that far from a very large, very Walmart friendly demographic (Michigan withstanding).

As for the steelcase land, one key thing I want to know more about, Tenants. Without tenants it doesn't mean a damn thing. Im sure they can fill it up, I'd like to see a mix of Medium to High density residential, mixed with a large office tenant and maybe some high tech manufacturing.

[CK1]

They're still around, and actually are doing pretty well financially now. They had some rough years after going public and with the early 2000's, and have shed about 10,000 jobs in the area. They still own the Pyramid and their corp HQ on 44th. The rest of the manufacturing complex is being sold.

It's good to see that unused / underutilized property is being redeveloped, but at the same time, how much more residential / retail do we really need in the 'burbs at the expense of manufacturing / knowledge based land/bldgs/businesses? In order for more retail to be viable, it has to take business away from other retail in the area (not too many people are going to drive in from out of the area simply to shop at a grocery store, fill up at a gas station, or grab lunch at a McDonalds. A destination retail store like a Cabela's or an IKEA (both of which seem to be spoken for in the state already) would bring additional income and wealth into the area, whereas converting industrial / commercial space into cookie-cutter retail / housing is more just redistributing wealth in the area.

Again, I am all for redeveloping obsolete properties, it'd just be nice to see it create wealth instead of pull it from elsewhere in the metro GR area.

[numstead]

^thats a very good point

[MJLO]

That property that is inside the city of Grand Rapids, it would be a great thing for the city. an Ikea on that property would do wonders! It would be a regional draw and be in the city. CK1 you were talking about having something like that developed on the property right? I wasnt really sure about your theme there.

[GRGyp]

I very much disagree that Michigan is not the "ideal" place for Distribution center. Couple reasons.

MJLO, it does have all that, and again I ammended my statement it's all a matter of the scale of your distribution as to whether or not Michigan is ideal or not. If Walmart wants to distribute to all portions of the following states from a single distribution center, Michigan is not ideal:

Michigan, Indiana, Ohio, Illinois, Wisconsin.

In this case, moving the distribution center south near South Bend or Valpraiso would be a better option as you will have better logistics to the south and into Wisconsin as Lake Michigan is out of the equation.

Now on the other hand. If it's a smaller distribution area that covers all of Michigan, and parts of Illinois, Indiana, and Ohio, Michigan is a great place to locate it. It can cover everything just as you said. If Walmart were to do this, however, I think it would have to justify the move by an even more aggressive building campaign of new stores and conversions to super centers in the state of Michigan. The farther north you move a major distribution center into Michigan, the more you need to dominate the state with sales centers. And while Walmart is growing in Michigan, I don't think its at a dominating point just yet.

[CK1]

That property that is inside the city of Grand Rapids, it would be a great thing for the city. an Ikea on that property would do wonders! It would be a regional draw and be in the city. CK1 you were talking about having something like that developed on the property right? I wasnt really sure about your theme there.

MJLO - I was more just getting at the point that the with the proposed development being residential / retail, there will be more distribution of wealth than the overall long-term creation of it. Granted, there will be many jobs created via the construction of anything going on w/ the Steelcase property, but once the buildings are up, there won't be much in the way of high-wage / high-benefits jobs left. Having a business located on the property that would bring in dollars from outside the area (either via exporting goods / services or having people from other areas travel to the desination to spend money) would be the best case scenario, and would assist in growing the area versus cannabalizing from other metro areas.

Like I said before, progress in any format is usually nice to see...but as with a lot of the proposed developments in the GR area, it would be nice to see a mix of business expansion / creation AND residential / retail buildup versus almost strickly residential / retail buildup.

One more thing - having an IKEA would be a huge boon to that area, but I think Canton beat us to the punch on that one!

[Kayak1]

call me out of the loop... but what happened to Steelcase? That place of theirs on Eastern and 44th is HUGE. Are they out of business or something? Did they move? Is someone going to buy that weird looking pyramid building of theirs?

It is my understanding that the pyramid and the headquarters on the corner of Eastern and 44th are staying. They still have a huge production facility off of 54th??? The reason they are selling a huge chunk of their realestate is that they used to build a bunch of stuff and hope that they sold it. Now they only build what they have sold so they do not need all the production space.

[GRDadof3]

Like I said before, progress in any format is usually nice to see...but as with a lot of the proposed developments in the GR area, it would be nice to see a mix of business expansion / creation AND residential / retail buildup versus almost strickly residential / retail buildup.

I would disagree. A lot of the new developments, at least downtown, are 'jobs-producing" developments. And relatively high paying jobs. The Medical Towers complex, Children's Hospital, VAI, MSU Med School, Mercantile Bank expansions, Macatawa Bank expansion (if that happens), West Michigan Women's Health Center, St Mary's planned expansions, and even the JW Marriott. Compared to even a lot of the cities featured on this site, which seem to be all high rise condos.

Of course I'd love to see MORE jobs-producing developments, and definitely some more corporate expansions/relocations to the area. But while it's not pretty like a new BOA Tower, and won't get us an article in Money Magazine, it's company expansion none the less. And each job has a multiplier effect, which although is not quite as much as manufacturing was, is still probably at least one or two ancillary jobs for every job created.

Some people may disagree, but I don't see the big difference between IKEA and Walmart. Just another way to get people to part with their money on cheap junk. I think people are just enomored with it because it's Scandinavian (big deal).

[GaryP]

Some people may disagree, but I don't see the big difference between IKEA and Walmart. Just another way to get people to part with their money on cheap junk. I think people are just enomored with it because it's Scandinavian (big deal).

I think IKEA is a lot nicer to their employees. Average pay around $16/hr with benefits if I recall correctly, but that may be wrong.

[starrfish]

Some people may disagree, but I don't see the big difference between IKEA and Walmart. Just another way to get people to part with their money on cheap junk. I think people are just enomored with it because it's Scandinavian (big deal).

They also don't seem to be trying to take over the world. It seems that they try to strategically place their locations - not putting them everywhere they could. Exclusivity seems to mean something in terms of making their brand more appealing. I know whenever I've gone to the IKEA in Schaumberg, we make a day of it, knowing full well that we won't be going back for a while.

[DwntwnGeo]

I think IKEA is a lot nicer to their employees. Average pay around $16/hr with benefits if I recall correctly, but that may be wrong.

Wouldn't the pay be relative to the area that it serves? Fore example, a job in Grand Rapids makes $30k a year while the same job in New York City will bring you $60k a year.

GRDadof3 Quote:

"Some people may disagree, but I don't see the big difference between IKEA and Walmart. Just another way to get people to part with their money on cheap junk. I think people are just enomored with it because it's Scandinavian (big deal)."

I guess I am with GRDad on this one. I don't really see a big difference between the two. I do think people are interested because the style is something different and their are not that many of them around. I am not a huge fan of the merchandise in either of the stores. Then again, I grew up with items that were built to with stand time and not be tossed to the wind when you remodel.

[GRDadof3]

Wouldn't the pay be relative to the area that it serves? Fore example, a job in Grand Rapids makes $30k a year while the same job in New York City will bring you $60k a year.

GRDadof3 Quote:

"Some people may disagree, but I don't see the big difference between IKEA and Walmart. Just another way to get people to part with their money on cheap junk. I think people are just enomored with it because it's Scandinavian (big deal)."

I guess I am with GRDad on this one. I don't really see a big difference between the two. I do think people are interested because the style is something different and their are not that many of them around. I am not a huge fan of the merchandise in either of the stores. Then again, I grew up with items that were built to with stand time and not be tossed to the wind when you remodel.

Hey, somebody agreed with me. IKEA's reinforcement of their quality brand by using scarcity is just that: a marketing trick. Their merchandise may have a bit of style to it, but the construction is pretty poor, IMO. But you get what you pay for, and I don't fault them for doing what they do.

My distaste for Walmart and their so-called labor practices is not that strong with me. In fact, I used to work at a Sam's Club part-time while in college and made quite a bit of money at the time. Way more per hour than comparable jobs at other places. My disgust for Walmart is simply for how disgusting their stores are. They are gross flea-markets compared to a Target store, even though the merchandise is probably pretty similar. Again, that's Walmart's brand. That's the impression they want to portray.

They also can put up a Walmart pretty much anywhere with a population of more than 20,000 people because they are a giant flea-market. IKEA has limited appeal.

But that's all just my opinion.

Back to my earlier post, it had nothing to do with a Walmart store coming to the Steelcase site. However, some of you may have connected the dots already. It will be interesting to hear people's opinions of quite a few good paying jobs working for the Devil.

[CK1]

Back to my earlier post, it had nothing to do with a Walmart store coming to the Steelcase site. However, some of you may have connected the dots already. It will be interesting to hear people's opinions of quite a few good paying jobs working for the Devil.

I'll keep the red carpet in the closet. Is this why our friend Mr. Faust has been so tight-lipped? Or perhaps the folks in Arkansas finally realized GR is a little more appealing to live in than Bentonville? We could spin some interesting tails w/ this one...

[GRDadof3]

I'll keep the red carpet in the closet. Is this why our friend Mr. Faust has been so tight-lipped? Or perhaps the folks in Arkansas finally realized GR is a little more appealing to live in than Bentonville? We could spin some interesting tails w/ this one...

Let's not go so far as to say the Walton's are relocating to this neck of the woods. And we won't see One Walton Place in Faust's plans. But as GRGyp mentioned, they may be about to undergo an aggressive expansion plan in the Great Lakes area.

[Kayak1]

Let's not go so far as to say the Walton's are relocating to this neck of the woods. But as GRGyp mentioned, they may be about to undergo an aggressive expansion plan in the Great Lakes area.

How much more aggressive can they be? There is a Wa-Mart in every town and most are getting converted to Super Wal Marts.