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M. Brown

Say goodbye to gasoline!

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I hope it runs on salt water. There's only so much fresh water to go around (there's probably more oil than fresh water on the planet).

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made me think of "that '70s show" when hyde always talks about a car that "runs on water, man!".

IF this is true it's the most f*cking amazing news I have ever heard of in my lifetime and will change life as we know it. Why isn't this national news????

http://www.wave3.com/global/story.asp?s=4934566

There are two hurdles to a car that runs totally on aquygen. One: long-term impact on the engine. Will the water speed up rust or corrosion over time? Two: figuring out a process to tank the gas for distribution.

If in the video he simply put the water into the car, why would they have to tank it? $$$ for the oil companies that stand to lose their business? I say someone, even if not in the USA, should mass produce this.

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I hope it runs on salt water. There's only so much fresh water to go around (there's probably more oil than fresh water on the planet).

If we no longer have to worry about oil, I bet it would actually be cheaper to learn how to filter salt water to make it fresh water. Then we would have a nearly unlimited amount of fuel.

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However, you still need electricty for electrolysis to happen. It doesn't eliminate fossil fuels from the process, it merely reduces it, as the energy to make this process happen has been "genereated in bulk" at a power plant.

Consumers will pay more for electricty, but overall their energy costs will be reduced, and pollution will be reduced or eliminated in most areas. It's revolutionary and an excellent step forward, but still not the complete solution to our dependency on fossil fuels.

As far as water goes,

I doubt there would be any strain on our freshwater resources because of this. By the time we see a car mass produced with this technology, people will be recyling gray wastewater in their homes, if not already are.

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Gosh, there was a time where every schoolkid knew that electrolysis would break water into hydrogen and oxygen. All you need are two wires and some DC current (like from a 12 volt battery) to see it. We did it all the time when I was in school, but I guess there isn't a focus on basic science anymore.

The down side of this that the idiot reporter failed to pick up. is the energy required to produce the hydrogen is greater than the energy that you get when you burn the hydrogen.

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The down side of this that the idiot reporter failed to pick up. is the energy required to produce the hydrogen is greater than the energy that you get when you burn the hydrogen.

I doubt it considering it said in one of the articles that if you made an engine 100% water powered, it would take 4 ounces of water to go 100 miles, and I forget the improvement with the hybrid but it was also a bit more than a 12 volt battery would be able to handle.

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I doubt it considering it said in one of the articles that if you made an engine 100% water powered, it would take 4 ounces of water to go 100 miles, and I forget the improvement with the hybrid but it was also a bit more than a 12 volt battery would be able to handle.

You are clueless as to what I am talking about. :lol: He does not have a water powered car, he has a hydrogen powered car. What is being missed here is the amount of energy that it takes to separate the hydrogen from the water so that it can be burned. This is snake oil advertizing at its best and demonstrates to me the media will print anything without checking into the story first.

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You are clueless as to what I am talking about. :lol:

I think I got it. :lol: Combustion engines work because with a little bit of energy, in the form of a spark, it creates much more energy when the gasoline ignites, pushing the pistons. With this process mentioned, a great deal of energy creates less energy.

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You are clueless as to what I am talking about. :lol:

I was simply parroting what was said in those articles. I really don't like your attitude, and you'll only make enemies by talking down to people. I'm not saying I know that this is for real. I am not an engineer and have no knowledge of the process by which he extracts the gas. Based upon what is said in the articles posted and the video, this thing is a major technological breakthrough, though I have no clue if this is real or not.

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I think I got it. :lol: Combustion engines work because with a little bit of energy, in the form of a spark, it creates much more energy when the gasoline ignites, pushing the pistons. With this process mentioned, a great deal of energy creates less energy.

We were posting at the same time. Read above. He is not burning water as water can't be burned. He is using electrolysis to breakdown water into hydrogen and oxygen. He is collecting the hydrogen gas. This HHO gas that he says he has is just marketing. HHO = H20 = water. i.e. water gas, its a clever play on words, but nothing like that really exists in chemistry.

His gas is simple hydrogen which will burn extremely fast because it likes to recombine with oxygen to form water. It's basic chemistry. This is why they don't use hydrogen in blimps any more, it explodes.

Again what is being missed is that he is using electricity to produce the hydrogen in the first place. (he briefly admits to it in the video) One will find the amount of electricity needed to produce hydrogen this way is far higher than the amount of energy that you get back when you burn the hydrogen. It might be worth asking. "what is your electricity bill"? The answer won't be a good one.

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Yeah, this is no amzing technology, electrolosis has been known for many years and is a popular school science project all you need to do it at home (inneffeciently) is a beaker, two test tubes, some wire and a battery. The actual hydrogen cars will not take water, instead the gas station you go to will be performing electrolosis on the spot in mass amounts, the only way its feasable, and your car will receive pure hydrogen. The problem is the safety, hydrogen has to be in a selaed strong tank, and extracting the stuff more efficiently from water.

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The problem is the safety, hydrogen has to be in a selaed strong tank, and extracting the stuff more efficiently from water.

Aside from that. The real problem is that it takes more energy to produce hydrogen from water than you get back by burning it. Are they going to build 5000 nuclear power plants to energize all of these hydrogen stations?

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In theory hydrogen is great, in reality it is notfeasable, yet. There are technologies in research and development that will fix these problems, but they are many years off, and may never come at all. I think the best solution to our energy problem are the methane hydrates found under the oceans.

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Let me just add in that people have been wrong before. We are all so stupid as to not see something that is right under our noses. True, a lot of times when you hear fantastic stories like this they turn out to be not true, but how many great inventions were laughed at when they came out? Pennicillan was right under our nose, in the garbage. Why did it take us so long to figure out gravity? It's such a simple concept now, but isn't Newton considered one of the greatest minds of the past 1,000 years partly for realizing what gravity is? The inventor of the poloroid camera came from my hometown, and went door to door around town trying to sell stock in his "instant camera" company. The vast majority of the people in town laughed in his face. The few people who didn't became millionaires. The local high school, the Norwich Free Academy, built their current library with donations from this man's estate. Getting off topic, I'm actually pretty proud that my high school educated quite a few other insanely successful people; billionaire Sidney Frank actually recently donated enough money to build a new music building.

I do not know the specifics of this and recognize that there's a very good chance it's not for real, but he claims to have invented a system to convert 4 ounces of water into hydrogen that will take you over 100 miles using a 12 volt battery. That right there sounds pretty fantastic.

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Let me just add in that people have been wrong before. We are all so stupid as to not see something that is right under our noses. True, a lot of times when you hear fantastic stories like this they turn out to be not true, but how many great inventions were laughed at when they came out? Pennicillan was right under our nose, in the garbage. Why did it take us so long to figure out gravity? It's such a simple concept now, but isn't Newton considered one of the greatest minds of the past 1,000 years partly for realizing what gravity is? The inventor of the poloroid camera came from my hometown, and went door to door around town trying to sell stock in his "instant camera" company. The vast majority of the people in town laughed in his face. The few people who didn't became millionaires. The local high school, the Norwich Free Academy, built their current library with donations from this man's estate. Getting off topic, I'm actually pretty proud that my high school educated quite a few other insanely successful people; billionaire Sidney Frank actually recently donated enough money to build a new music building.

I do not know the specifics of this and recognize that there's a very good chance it's not for real, but he claims to have invented a system to convert 4 ounces of water into hydrogen that will take you over 100 miles using a 12 volt battery. That right there sounds pretty fantastic.

There's also the saying "If it sounds to good to be true....."

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Gotta wonder what might happen with the whole money thing... Remember the movie Chain Reaction where they tried to use water to make hydrogen fuel, and all hell broke loose?

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Gotta wonder what might happen with the whole money thing... Remember the movie Chain Reaction where they tried to use water to make hydrogen fuel, and all hell broke loose?

They wren't making hydrogen fuel, they were attempting fusion. And from what I understand the movie was scientifically innaccurate, I seriously doubt there will ever be a fusion reactor in a giant waterbottle and I dout one could cause a massive explosion. I do like that movie though...

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While we're on the topic of gas... does anyone else come across people who insist that you're a moron if you buy a hybrid? I mentioned buying one to some of my more hickish friends (i live in rural CT) and they thought I was stupid. I like the accord, but the affordable civic hybrid is what I'd probably try to buy. I have heard of people who come across more road rage when driving a hybrid. My only qualm about buying one is socially; being lumped into the same group as the self-righteous "i'm better than you" liberal types. Obviously, this really isn't going to stop me. The reason I want to get one is so I'm not polluting the environment so much, not to save money on gas like many of the anti hybrid people like to rationalize it as.

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We are all so stupid as to not see something that is right under our noses.

Well no. High school physics says it won't work. If you could get more energy out of hydrogen than the energy it takes to separate it from water in the first place, then you could make a perpetual motion machine. Of course this is impossible, though many have claimed they have done so over the decades.

Burning something is nothing more than combining an element with oxygen in a chemical reaction to produce heat.

Maybe you remember the First Law of Thermodynamics....

"Energy can be changed from one form to another, but it cannot be created or destroyed......"

Now water is nothing more than two hydrogen atoms combined with an oxygen atom. Water has the special property that if you apply a current to it you can force these atoms apart. Think of pushing a ball up a hill.

When you burn hydrogen, you are simply recombining it with oxygen to produce water again. That is when you get the energy back that you put in in the form of heat. Think of the ball falling back down the hill. The heat you get from this can never be more energy than the electricity used to break it apart in the first place. And it is infact less, because there are losses due to mechanical issues such as friction, resistance in the wires, etc.

The guy is selling snake oil.

The power to run his water vehicle is really coming from whatever produced the electricity in the first place.

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There are loopholes in quantum physics to get around the whole "energy can't be created or destroyed" deal, it's the underlying concept in fusion, start a reaction that produces more energy than what is put into it, it's something I don't personnaly understand very well but it is a very interesting concept.

While we're on the topic of gas... does anyone else come across people who insist that you're a moron if you buy a hybrid? I mentioned buying one to some of my more hickish friends (i live in rural CT) and they thought I was stupid. I like the accord, but the affordable civic hybrid is what I'd probably try to buy. I have heard of people who come across more road rage when driving a hybrid. My only qualm about buying one is socially; being lumped into the same group as the self-righteous "i'm better than you" liberal types. Obviously, this really isn't going to stop me. The reason I want to get one is so I'm not polluting the environment so much, not to save money on gas like many of the anti hybrid people like to rationalize it as.

Actually, the general consensus now is that the way the EPA rated MPG overemphasized the efficiency of hybrids. The new MPG data hurts the hybrids quite a bit from what I've heard. So basically they are a waste of money. If your interested in saving on gas and emmisions, save a few thousand dollars and few dirty looks and get a little four cylinder (or if you prefer power, both the Dodge Magnum and Charger have V-8's that switch to running on four cylinders until it becomes neccasary to use all eight).

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Actually, the general consensus now is that the way the EPA rated MPG overemphasized the efficiency of hybrids. The new MPG data hurts the hybrids quite a bit from what I've heard. So basically they are a waste of money. If your interested in saving on gas and emmisions, save a few thousand dollars and few dirty looks and get a little four cylinder (or if you prefer power, both the Dodge Magnum and Charger have V-8's that switch to running on four cylinders until it becomes neccasary to use all eight).

Is there a link to this? I saw something where one of the morning TV shows drove across the country with different cars... and the prius had the best mileage hands down. Maybe it's because it's so small. I don't know. I wish the urban areas in this country had decent transit, like what European cities have.

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There are loopholes in quantum physics to get around the whole "energy can't be created or destroyed" deal, it's the underlying concept in fusion, start a reaction that produces more energy than what is put into it, it's something I don't personnaly understand very well but it is a very interesting concept.

Haha, you are correct, you don't understand it. Get back to me when someone proves the First Law of Thermodynamics is invalid.

There is nothing wrong with fusion with the laws of thermodynamics. Fusion releases energy that was expended when the elements were formed in the first place. Fusion, is the forcing of two atoms of one element together to form another element. Specifically the sun and our fusion bombs work by forcing two atoms of a special rare form of hydrogen (deuterium or tritium) together to form helium. You get left over parts in this process in the form of a neutron(s) and energy in the broken atomic bonds that used to hold them together. Nuclear fusion is not a renewal resource because supplies of deuterium and tritium are very rare. The sun will eventually burn out, BTW.

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Is there a link to this? I saw something where one of the morning TV shows drove across the country with different cars... and the prius had the best mileage hands down. Maybe it's because it's so small. I don't know. I wish the urban areas in this country had decent transit, like what European cities have.

This is very true. The EPA does not measure gas mileage of vehicles. What they do measure are tail pipe emissions (EPA = Environmental Protection Agency) because it is their job to certify that cars don't pollute which has been their mission since they were formed in the 70s. They "compute" the gas mileage of vehicles by looking at the amount of burned and unburned gases coming out of the tail pipe and using a formula that takes into account the amount of fuel burned and the weight of the car.

These formulas were derived 30 years ago and are not suited for vehicles like a hybrid. Hence, they predict much higher mileage than what is seen by drivers. Hybrids do best on city streets since they recover energy in the brakeing process. They actually get worse gas mileage on the highway than an equivalent convential car due to the extra weight of all the equipment on board.

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