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JT Boy

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^^It was in Popular Mechanics and it is still substantially more expensive than fossil fuels. Unless there is a radical breakthrough in obtaining hydrogen, it is a technological dead end.

Thats the one. Now, the point that I gathered from that was not that hydrogen somehow uses less energy to make, etc. BUT that it is becoming less expensive. Just like any technology, it will take time to make its production costs decrease, but I think there will come a day that it is more effecient to produce. And like Corgi said, regardless of the practicality of this fuel source, the government is starting to invest more in it and Columbia will benefit.

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There is a ton of research going on with regards to fuel cells. Many different ideas are being put to the test. Bush has allocated over $600 million for fuel cell research through the Hydrogen Fuel Initiative in the past 3 years which is awesome.
Your realize this is far less money than the Clinton administration was spending on alternative energy programs before it was all cut in 2002. And in 2007, Bush cut $70M from this hydrogen program. For a country that faces fundamental problems with energy as the United States does, spending that basically amounts less than 3 days war spending on Iraq on alternative energy research is pretty disgraceful.
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From what I understand and what I've been told by family and friends involved in research the funding for 07 will actually increase in the areas of nuclear, coal, wind, solar, and hydrogen power.

The only cut in sciences in the budget I am aware of is in biological and environmental sciences of about 80 million dollars. The rest is all increases and realignments.

--

Also the 2020 figure is for mass production (all speculation of course.)

The Advanced Energy Initiative aims to reduce America
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Forgetting the politics behind this, I think that we would get a lot bigger bang for the buck if we put a lot more focus on consumption. That is, in reducing energy consumption. Changing over to hydrogen or biodiesel or whatever isn't going to buy much if we are still building cities that rely exclusively on the automobile to move people around. This is kinda of like making a diet for an overweight person that switches from french fries to potato chips. It really doesn't address the issue at hand.

While the hydrogen powered hybrid bus is an interesting curiosity for Columbia, it isn't going to do much to change the above fact. What the city needs is a comprehensive plan to build a more livable city that focuses on rapid transit in the future as one of the methods to achieve this. In doing this, it may also help to reduce the amount of oil that is imported by this country.

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Forgetting the politics behind this, I think that we would get a lot bigger bang for the buck if we put a lot more focus on consumption. That is, in reducing energy consumption. Changing over to hydrogen or biodiesel or whatever isn't going to buy much if we are still building cities that rely exclusively on the automobile to move people around. This is kinda of like making a diet for an overweight person that switches from french fries to potato chips. It really doesn't address the issue at hand.

While the hydrogen powered hybrid bus is an interesting curiosity for Columbia, it isn't going to do much to change the above fact. What the city needs is a comprehensive plan to build a more livable city that focuses on rapid transit in the future as one of the methods to achieve this. In doing this, it may also help to reduce the amount of oil that is imported by this country.

That is part of the City's comprehensive plan (the Town & Country Plan). You do have a point though... but it will take more than Columbia to make any significant impact. There is are several sprawling neighbors to the north that have to do much more than Columbia.

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Oh I agree with you, more needs to be done with regards to improving our current consumption habits. And you are right about this current administrations actions towards the environment by continually cutting environmental and energy efficiency programs which would benefit us in the near term. I was just pointing out that funding overall has increased in R&D in key areas for long term prospects.

Keeping politics out of discussions of the budget are almost impossible. :P Looking over the budget one can see that this current administration is definitely in bed with big business. But at the same time it's not like research is being totally shut down. Personally I would increase our R&D spending 10-fold in all sciences.

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Yes, far more can be accomplished by reduction of demand as oil will be driving our economy for years to come.

While I think hydrogen is a dead end (I worked on alternative fuels proposals back in the late 80s and early 90s), by no means should research end. I do think it is a shame that it is being bandied about as the passkey to our energy independence when there are many other potential alternatives that could provide more immediate and cheaper alternatives. Even those pale to the potential of fossil fuels.

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  • 4 weeks later...

From the latest edition of the Free Times:

Ready to make an enormous time commitment by serving on a committee to aid Richland County in developing a regional transportation plan? Of course you are! Here's the deal: If you want to serve on the 33-member panel (residents only; no elected officials), plan on making a year-and-a-half commitment beginning in January. An ordinance chartering the commission says it will "study the long-range transportation needs of Richland County, including the bus system and other modes of public transit." If they didn't have you at "bus system," the committee also will assess highway and road improvements to alleviate congestion and develop incentives for public transit-friendly development. The committee's membership is scheduled to be finalized Dec. 19 and its final report is due to County Council in May 2008. Richland, Columbia, Lexington County, Cayce and West Columbia will select members. Call 576-2068 for an application.
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I just think they would need to be tied in to increasing tourism, particularly downtown, in order to be well-received in light of the failed trolley system. With the new Hilton and other downtown hotels, the baseball stadium, and Innovista, I think a solid case could be made for the feasibility of a potential streetcar system.

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I have been in favor of trolleys forever...REAL trolleys, not the ones on wheels. I would certainly ride them if the routes were expansive enough. Imagine a trolley route from downtown to Williams-Brice? Wouldn't it be an awesome treat to ride trolleys to the games? An expansive downtown and in-town system would allow people to tek them to basketball games, baseball games, the rest of the vista and five points. It would be so much fun.

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As to the guy that doesn't own a car, Boston and NYC have a rental car company called ZipCar. Rather than the traditional method of having a central site for renting cars, they leave the cars scattered over the city, in parkiing sites that zipcar rents. For instance, there might be four or five cars parked in every garage in the city. To get a car, you jump online, and the company tells you where the nearest car is. You take the bus or the T to the parking location and you have your car to use for as long as you need it. The car comes with a credit card to be used for gas. I have a friend that lives in Beacon Hill in Boston, and he uses the service once or twice a month, and loves it. Zipcar

As far as bus stop enclosures, how much does an enclosure cost? $2k or so?

Part of the problem with Columbia is that you almost have to drive or ride to get where you need to be. I live near Decker, and the trip to the nearest grocery store is almost 2 miles. That's too far if you want your icecream to remain frozen in August. This seems to be the issue all over Columbia, and that is faulty zoning. The old zoning methodlolgy of placing industrial in one corner of the city, retail in another corner, and separating residential from everything is just lame. It's nice to see places like Village at Sandhills pop up, where I could potentially spend 90% of my time ( I work just across Two Notch from VAS) without driving anywhere, but then they price the residential out of the ballpark for the majority of the people that would actually work there, completely defeating the purpose.

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I have been in favor of trolleys forever...REAL trolleys, not the ones on wheels. I would certainly ride them if the routes were expansive enough. Imagine a trolley route from downtown to Williams-Brice? Wouldn't it be an awesome treat to ride trolleys to the games? An expansive downtown and in-town system would allow people to tek them to basketball games, baseball games, the rest of the vista and five points. It would be so much fun.
In another thread Krazee refered to Youngstown, I could talk about Valenciennes (~ 40,000 people, 400,000 in its urban area) a city deeply affected by the industrial crisis, in particular the iron and steel industry. Valenciennes lost inhabitants. Patiently, the mayor renovated the downtown and built a second campus. Now, the core get inhabitants. But what links the new buildings ? What bring people from the outskirts to the center, what give more life to Valenciennes, what is now the symbol of this revival ? The tramway.

Besides, the neighbouring city, Douai will have its own tramway, all the French cities want its tram network ! The tram has something magic. It would be perfect for Columbia. For those who don't like the power lines, note that the Bordeaux's tram uses ground-level power supply. It's more expensive of course. http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/tramway_de_Bordeaux

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That's one of the fundamental differences between European cities and American cities: the way they think about transit. Part of the envisioned "American dream" is personal transportation, particularly as status symbols. It will really take something drastic, even more than what we're currently seeing in the U.S., to cause a significant shift in the way we think about these things.

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That's one of the fundamental differences between European cities and American cities: the way they think about transit. Part of the envisioned "American dream" is personal transportation, particularly as status symbols. It will really take something drastic, even more than what we're currently seeing in the U.S., to cause a significant shift in the way we think about these things.

In France we call it the "tout-voiture", the all-car. the critics isn't about the personal transportation (the car) but the "obligation" to go in car and endure the consequences like air or noise pollution (the all-car). the all-car corresponds to the period 50's-80's, the same when the last old tramways were suppressed (exept in Lille, Marseille and Saint-Etienne). German cities are well equiped in tram, the largest have both a subway and a tram network, the variety in transportation in appreciated.

Now, Los Angeles has a subway. Delirium ! I count on you to give a tramway to Columbia. A petition ? ;)

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^I've heard about the bordeaux tramway before. it uses a new power source that doesn't require overhead canternaries. It migiht be a little soon for Columbia though. Transit in this country, particulartly in the South, is not as well recieved as in other places. Building something like that would require more desnity downtown first. I think it can happen though... it will just be several decades away.

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More good news!!! A regional government group is looking at ways to redevelop about 50 abandoned industrial sites in the Midlands as future commuter rail stations. The Central Midlands Council of Governments has identified 22 possible rail station sites that could serve three future commuter rail and high-speed transit lines: Columbia to Newberry, Columbia to Camden and Columbia to Batesburg-Leesville. Look as if there are very much on the ball for a commuter rail. Also what I found to be amazing . Its recent commuter rail study estimated a 43 percent population jump between 2000 and 2035

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