UNC Charlotte Football

[AuLukey]

While you may dismiss it, that amount might make the differenct between someone of more limited means being able to get an education or not. We should not be increasing what it costs someone to attend school, to give a free education to a football player. As I said earlier, if the fans of football want to have it then let them pay for it, but don't force it on everyone else.

I know that everyone's financial situation may not be the same; however, I am paying my own way through college via student loans that are in my name only(my parents aren't paying for it and their names are not on the loan) and paying my bills by working a job off campus. People in financial situations that hold them back from attending college are normally eligible for grants and scholarships if they are accepted into the university. Whether or not they have the time for both school and work is another story. I have several friends that are from lower income families that aren't paying any money for tuition or books and their scholarships were not based on acedemic achievement in high school, but merely by their family's financial situation.

I know that my student loans increase every year based on increase in tuition and my credit rating (or so I've heard.) So that increase of $200 on top of whatever the tuition may rise by will be adjusted accordingly in the aid.

[NcSc74]

I do agree with your point about populous states are generally the sources of the most successful schools; but also keep in mind that NC's population is gaining steam on some of the competition. However, the starting quarterbacks for both Georgia and Florida are from North Carolina. To be specific, they are both from Independence High, if one high school in our state is an indicator of some of the talent our state can provide, it's IHigh. However, we all know one high school is not enough to feed a university team.

Just as an added fact, and not to argue your point, the Florida-Georgia game coming up next week will have 12 players from North Carolina on the field, of which four are from Charlotte. A lot of NC's talent isn't staying in state. But nobody ever said Charlotte would have a winning record for the first decade. Heck, look at the Bobcats, and that's major league.

Also, as for competing with Cincinatti, up until last year, Charlotte played both the Bearcats and Louisville in Conference USA in basketball. Louisville is now one of the top ranked teams in NCAA Football. Something happened.

And yes met, I include myself as I said I have a biased opinion later in that very post. And yes, I've seen some opinions made on your part as well, for example "most of the nation's population doesn't care about college football."

Yeah don't forget about fast Willie Parker the starting running back for the Steelers or J.Peppers. There is talent in this state. Down east and western NC produce loads of talent. Remeber it only takes about two or three outstanding college FB players to make a bad team good, and a good team great. Look at Wake Forest this year. They are 6-1 but none of them stars. They just have one or two good players and the rest are average. I am telling you guys don't sell our state short. We have 8mil+ and we can't put together one team to stay compeitive over a span of 5-10 years. There is no excuse. Boise state is undefeated right now. You mean to tell me the there is more talent in Idaho than NC. No there isn't. Our schools can't get the states top talent to sign with them. Instead they head off to VT, UT, UGA, UF and now USC. I for one want to see Charlotte to have a team. Maybe we can have a program that will dominate and finally keep talent in state.

[nowensone]

Populous states have nothing to do with successful sports schools, at least in terms of football and basketball that I am familiar with. Florida and California are probably the only real exceptions to this, but if you look at the championship teams and your general schools, you see a lot of Nebraskas, Oklahomas, Alabamas, and so on for football, and NC, Kentucky, Kansas, Conn., etc. for basketball. I was going to throw Texas in as an exception, but mainly for baseball, they were in a 30 year dry spell until last year for football, and I can't remember the last time A&M won a title.

[NcSc74]

Populous states have nothing to do with successful sports schools, at least in terms of football and basketball that I am familiar with. Florida and California are probably the only real exceptions to this, but if you look at the championship teams and your general schools, you see a lot of Nebraskas, Oklahomas, Alabamas, and so on for football, and NC, Kentucky, Kansas, Conn., etc. for basketball. I was going to throw Texas in as an exception, but mainly for baseball, they were in a 30 year dry spell until last year for football, and I can't remember the last time A&M won a title.

In terms of the number of available recruits yes it does. Granted Nebraska does have decent talent for football. However they do rely on Texas also for players as does Oklahoma. One of the best schools for keeping in state talent is VT. Look at there roster and you can see a model that any school in NC should shoot for. My point is sit looks as if NC has no talent. That is not the case. We produce the same amount of talented players as Virginia which is a state of similar population. The only difference is both of there major universities take a good number of our 4 and 3 star recruits. On the other border you have the SEC schools taking the more prized 4 and 5 star players. Cruise over to each teams home page and look at their rosters and you will see what I mean. So what does that leave UNC, NCSU etc...1 and 2 star players that have to be supplemented with players from out of state. At some point someone has to realize that just because a dude is from Florida does not mean he is the next Clinton Portis or Ed Reed and so on.

[DanRNC]

One reason alumni giving is so low at UNCC is their paltry graduation rate (49%). Maybe they should focus on improving that.

[peaceloveunderstanding]

One reason alumni giving is so low at UNCC is their paltry graduation rate (49%). Maybe they should focus on improving that.

Indeed. Raising standards for admission would help raise the the graduation rate, help in the school pride department, and help in building a better reputation.

Sacrificing quality to grow bigger is rather silly.

[nowensone]

In terms of the number of available recruits yes it does. Granted Nebraska does have decent talent for football. However they do rely on Texas also for players as does Oklahoma. One of the best schools for keeping in state talent is VT. Look at there roster and you can see a model that any school in NC should shoot for. My point is sit looks as if NC has no talent. That is not the case. We produce the same amount of talented players as Virginia which is a state of similar population. The only difference is both of there major universities take a good number of our 4 and 3 star recruits. On the other border you have the SEC schools taking the more prized 4 and 5 star players. Cruise over to each teams home page and look at their rosters and you will see what I mean. So what does that leave UNC, NCSU etc...1 and 2 star players that have to be supplemented with players from out of state. At some point someone has to realize that just because a dude is from Florida does not mean he is the next Clinton Portis or Ed Reed and so on.

OK, yes, the populous states definately produce more players (raw numbers), as they should since they have more people to begin with. I do see how you meant what you stated - that NC pretty much always sends it's talent elsewhere, but I don't see football at UNCC changing that. The only thing that can change that is to step up the numbers big time from charlottealum49's assumptions, and certainly an on-campus stadium, far more expensive coach, a serious marketing program, as well as years and years of loyalty building and fundraising efforts to get alum and corp. donations trickling in at necessary speeds. And a few other schools in the state have already been making these kinds of efforts to build a football dynasty (I'm mainly thinking of UNC main and NCSU) and are not yet successful, which I would argue is because they are still too new at it.

One reason alumni giving is so low at UNCC is their paltry graduation rate (49%). Maybe they should focus on improving that.

Just curious, when a student goes to UNCC for their first 2-3 years and then transfers to another school for the actual degree, does that count against the graduation rate? I ask because everyone I know with one exception that has gone to UNCC has used it as a "stepping" school, not sure if that is just coincidence or is an actual trend.

[monsoon]

One reason alumni giving is so low at UNCC is their paltry graduation rate (49%). Maybe they should focus on improving that.

I don't think this has much to do with it as UNCC is a tough school academically that is fairly easy to get into. It however has a number of degrees that are difficult to get a degree in. I believe the graduation rate for engineering for example, something like 18%. The dropouts usually end up going to easier schools.

[DanRNC]

I don't think this has much to do with it as UNCC is a tough school academically that is fairly easy to get into.

Actually, most of the underperforming schools in the UNC system had these same statistics whereas UNC and NCSU had graduation rates of 84% and 71% respectively. It may be true that these schools have lower admission standards and a lot of students can't handle the coursework once admitted. The point is, however, that these low graduation rates mean that these schools produce fewer alumni leading to reduced alumni giving.

[monsoon]

Honestly, I don't know if adding majors in basket weaving is something that makes much sense to UNCC. Throughout this discussion, nobody, and I mean nobody, has provided any proof that one can't get a good quality education at UNCC. I think it is bad policy to dumb down a school so more clueless people can get a degree.

[AuLukey]

Honestly, I don't know if adding majors in basket weaving is something that makes much sense to UNCC. Throughout this discussion, nobody, and I mean nobody, has provided any proof that one can't get a good quality education at UNCC. I think it is bad policy to dumb down a school so more clueless people can get a degree.

I agree, although the only way to really help out that graduation rate is to increase standards of admission. It might cut back UNCC's expansive growth, but it would help the college's reputation a little. I know they have slowly begun to increase their expectations as they are now higher than they were when I applied. Although I still would be able to get in based on performance in high school, I know a lot of people that started in my class that transferred to other schools because the coursework at Charlotte was too hard for them. Also, I know that admissions standards have begun to go up as well as a lot of people with decent GPA's in high school but little extracurricular involvement aren't able to get in anymore like they used to. That's not fact, just based on two of my friend's younger siblings who applied and couldn't get in.

[AuLukey]

Hope returns to the cause.

Ben Comstock, UNCC student body president, has changed his platform for pushing for a football team. The new approach is to actually create a way for students to voice their opinion and get everybody on the same page before trying to bring the issue to the appropriate "authorities." While not a huge step, I'm glad he is living up to the platform he originally had campaigned with.

Niner Nation Article

EDIT: Not to bother with a bump, but the CO just listed another story about this only five days later that the student senate will be voting to have a student poll about having a campus-wide formal poll on the matter of whether to increase student tuition to help pay for both male and female sports (including football.)

Edited November 10, 2006 by aussie luke

[kickazzz2000]

Heres an article from the News and Observer about Applachain States recent success at the 1-AA level of College Football...

http://www.newsobserver.com/122/story/521273.html

Visibility is up, giving rates are up.

[AuLukey]

On a side note, I read in the paper today that they are increasing semester tuition $200+ to help improve graduation rates and help fund the student union. Where's the funding for a football team? We already have a student union (albeit a pretty crappy one.) I'd support a football team before I'd utilize a student union after I graduate!

Edited December 15, 2006 by aussie luke

[jednc]

Heres an article from the News and Observer about Appalachian States recent success at the 1-AA level of College Football...

http://www.newsobserver.com/122/story/521273.html

Visibility is up, giving rates are up.

This article supports what many of us have been saying in this thread. There are no guarantees, but this would be a likely scenario at UofC (oops, UNCC...that's a different thread) if they had a football program started. Then, if they become successful, look for a repeat of this scenario where the visibility is raised to an even higher level.

[dubone]

I have a relative who went to Appalachian State. I have literally not heard him mention his school once, but now that they are doing well in football, he is very proud of his school. There is very little that becomes a topic of conversation like that outside of football.

I'm still mostly neutral on whether UNCC should have a team, but still believe that should really work hard to increase their giving rates and alumni connections to the school.

[monsoon]

I have a relative who went to Appalachian State.

That is a bit odd as everyone that I have ever known that went to that school has had very strong ties as alumni to that place and there is almost no mention of football.

[dubone]

Yeah, I agree that he is not representative, just an example that I wanted to share.

[AuLukey]

Either somebody at the O is really into 49er's football, or the fact that they have two articles about the discussion of football on campus today is just a coincidence.

Article 1: they will decide to study it today

Article 2: the decision not to make a decision

in usual 49er's fashion, the board of trustees decided to wait until February to make a decision on whether or not to study the impacts (both positive and negative) of football at UNCC.

[monsoon]

I don't think it is a coincidence. There have been a number of articles over the past few days that seem to be regurgitations from UrbanPlanet.

[Max Power]

in usual 49er's fashion, the board of trustees decided to wait until February to make a decision on whether or not to study the impacts (both positive and negative) of football at UNCC.

The meeting last week was actually just a "retreat" and they weren't allowed to vote on anyything. At the next real meeting (in the middle of February), the board will vote on whether or not to proceed with the football study.

Football would pose huge challenges (financial and otherwise), but I think it would be a great step for the University.

[atlrvr]

The best example ever of why college football is a benefit to a city is on the front page of the CBJ, and is the catalyst behind Charlotte getting a new 19-story office tower for NASCAR is due to a chance conversation at a college football game.

Two men, one from Lauth Properties and one from NASCAR started talking about possibilities for a new office complex near Charlotte while watching a the Florida Gator's play in Gainesville. They promise to stay in touch, and a couple of years later those plans mature into the office tower that breaks ground in two weeks.

Could this have happened without college football....sure, perhaps, but bringing two people together with something in common outside of business, that would likely never cross paths elsewise, is a great way for ideas, partnerships, etc to be formed.

[AuLukey]

While not a solid argument, it's an argument nonetheless, so I'll go along with it. College football, bringing people together.

[AuLukey]

In UNCC football news, according to the O, there will be a formal, student-wide poll placed for two weeks in the middle of February. The student senate unanimously approved the poll which I imagine will be available through the school's intranetwork webpage to maintain that only current students can vote. It's too bad I won't be at Charlotte anymore once football is finally reborn at Charlotte, but I'm glad I get the chance to vote for it. I feel confident that with so many people on campus talking about football on a daily basis, the vote should be skewed in favor of football much like the informal SGA poll before it. And not only is this poll about whether or not to build a football team, but about the willingness to pay extra student fees to help make it a possibility. Thus, it will be a poll that makes people think before they vote.

CO article

[Justadude]

It's pretty sad that a football team would be so high on the list of priorities for a public university. I understand that it's important for marketing purposes, but I honestly doubt that the academic profile of the undergrad program is going to rise because they added a football team; if anything, you're more likely to see at least a brief decline in the graduation rate. In the long-term, you're attracting kids who make their choices based on sports programs instead of academic factors; is that really what you want in a public university?

Personally, I'd much rather see hundreds of millions of tax dollars go into improved dorms, better professors, smaller classes, higher-tech equipment, and a more aggressive marketing campaign. Sports are an extracurricular (remember this is a school, not a semipro sports academy), and should be pretty close to the bottom of the priority list.