Project Thread/New Construction/Photo du jour/Const. CAMs

[archilove]

When I moved to Nashville the L&C was being built. I always liked to take company up to the observation deck for a view of the town. In later years my brother-in-law, who was head of the state water quality control department, had an office on the 31st floor with 30 floors of bureaucrats under him. 

[urbanplanet17]

10 hours ago, wreynol4 said:

I wouldn't go that far...

Understood. It's a matter of perspective.

True, Nashville doesn't have the supertall skyscrapers or crowns on its high rises. That said, what Nashville will have is an fairly expansive area with solid infill and street walls made up of 15 - 45 story buildings. 

Meanwhile, when looking at Charlotte, most of its high rises are centered along College St. and Tyrone St. between 3rd and 6th streets only (go just a block beyond this area and you run into a ton of low rises and surface lots).

Edited August 22, 2017 by urbanplanet17

[markhollin]

Midtown massing looking west from 17th floor of Renaissance Hotel:
 

[nashvylle]

The Rhythm's facade is awful. Was it never completed? 

[titanhog]

The only thing I see in that photo is a huge swath of land ready for some incredible new development.  Hmmm...calling Mr. Beaman.

[markhollin]

AT&T looking upward from intersection of 3rd Ave. North and Commerce Street:
 

[urbanplanet17]

As you all have probably noticed, I was in Nashville the past couple of days for the eclipse.

I'll be quick and to the point, you guys have an awesome town. I feel the vibe right now (with all of the positivity and rapid growth / developments) is likely what 1970s Atlanta was like. It certainly feels nothing like a city of less than 2 million people. If anything, I would best describe Nashville as a city that punches well above its weight in many ways. In fact, I found out (out of pure coincidence) the manager at the hotel I stayed at is a native Detroiter and he doesn't regret making the move down to Nashville at all. He spent quite a bit of time raving about the city.

I paid a visit to Hattie B's and the Hot Chicken was great (fiery, but great). The diagonol cross walks on Broadway were a very nice touch (never seen anything like that). And yes, I learned the stories were true about cranes being everywhere (you couldn't turn a corner without spotting one). The traffic didn't seem nearly as bad as many Nashville residents make it out to be though, at least on I-65 headed north of the city. The bottlenecks were fairly congested, but before getting to them, things seemed to be smooth sailing.

All of that said, I do have some constructive criticism that I'd like to share.

1. The traffic flow in downtown would be so much better if every street north of KVB, with the exception of Commerce, Broadway and Demonbreun, was converted to a one way. I'm sure the way the streets are now was from back when Nashville was still a sleepy southern town, but now I think doing this would be for the better.

2.This may be more of a criticism for the State of Tennessee, but for the love of god, *PLEASE* improve your street and highway signage. Downtown and Midtown (on West End) are fairly well covered with signage, but beyond that, things leaves a lot to be desired. In every other big city I've visited, there would plenty of fair warning about approaching entrances / exits or destinations and what side of the road one should be on. I did have GPS, which helped, but it didn't stop me from still getting lost or going completely out of a way a few times yet.

3. Having paid parking and no parking zones downtown is great and all (with everything being within walking distance and centrally located). But IMO, I think it's overkill in parts of Midtown. From what I observed, establishments in that part of the city already tend to suffer from every limited parking (I'm guessing due to zoning requirements) and they probably lose quite a bit of business when potential customers can't find a place to park.

 

[jmtunafish]

From Sky5 this morning (which kind of looks like a Sim City screen shot):

And from yesterday:

Edited August 24, 2017 by jmtunafish

[jmtunafish]

1 hour ago, urbanplanet17 said:

2.This may be more of a criticism for the State of Tennessee, but for the love of god, *PLEASE* improve your street and highway signage. Downtown and Midtown (on West End) are fairly well covered with signage, but beyond that, things leaves a lot to be desired. In every other big city I've visited, there would plenty of fair warning about approaching entrances / exits or destinations and what side of the road one should be on. I did have GPS, which helped, but it didn't stop me from still getting lost or going completely out of a way a few times yet.

You are not the first person to notice this, and I totally agree.  With three major interstate all converging in downtown plus 440 just outside of downtown, there's a lot of mergers and exits that seem to appear from out of nowhere and with very little warning.  It can be aggravating for those who aren't familiar with our spaghetti-like network of roads and freeways.

As for the rest of your post, thank you for coming to our city and for giving us your honest feedback.  I'm not a native Nashvillian, either (not even a native Tennessean; I'm a Florida boy who's half French and was raised in Hong Kong) but I love Nashville and Tennessee as if I've lived here all my life.  It's a beautiful city that's growing up nicely.

Edited August 23, 2017 by jmtunafish

[Pdt2f]

30 minutes ago, jmtunafish said:

 

This looks like it's from the "large-city-sleepily-waking-up" montage from the beginning of '80s movies (Blues Brothers, Wall Street, maybe one of the Lethal Weapons)

[MidTenn1]

48 minutes ago, urbanplanet17 said:

2.This may be more of a criticism for the State of Tennessee, but for the love of god, *PLEASE* improve your street and highway signage. Downtown and Midtown (on West End) are fairly well covered with signage, but beyond that, things leaves a lot to be desired. In every other big city I've visited, there would plenty of fair warning about approaching entrances / exits or destinations and what side of the road one should be on. I did have GPS, which helped, but it didn't stop me from still getting lost or going completely out of a way a few times yet.

Not sure if you are referring to interstate highway signage, but that was done per national standards for location of advance warning, interchange guidance and confirmation. In fact the interstate signage, in my opinion, is positively brilliant!!!  

However, there are confusing interchanges where exit ramps are counter intuitive (first exit to the right actually goes left, second one actually does go right), but I find if you trust the signs rather than your gut, you'll get to your destination. 

Some challenges in Nashville include directing traffic to Briley Parkway..how do you sign that? It loops around the city in a loop and is neither north-south or east-west. So the signs have a cardinal direction, although who knows what north-south is at any particular spot? TDOT did put signs up for "Opryland" on I-40 at the airport, although technically there is no Opryland. However, it is now a neighborhood and a destination more meaningful than 'just north on Briley Parkway'.

[MontanaGuy]

I can very much relate to what Urbanplanet17 said about getting lost while driving in Nashville.  I've lived here almost ten years now but I got completely lost on Sunday trying to find a booth that sold those solar eclipse glasses near the Parthenon when I took a wrong turn that made me completely lose my bearings.  I agree that signs could be better in many places but I also think that the hilly topography has resulted in a city of curving roads that skews your sense of direction and not being able to see a long distance because of those hills in many places blocks off the taller landmarks that help you know where you are.  I couldn't even tell which direction downtown was and if I was getting closer or further away from the Parthenon area.  I did finally find the place but I would just suggest that Nashville reminds me of the Seattle area where I lived for almost twenty years where I would also occasionally get lost in unfamiliar areas because of those hills.  I lived in Phoenix before Nashville and Denver before that but never got lost because the streets are laid out neatly like a checkerboard with main streets forming a grid pattern.  We could never do that here so I ordered a standalone GPS to hopefully give me a little assistance when this happens in the future.  I love this town though and this is an exciting time to live here with all of the booming real estate and major projects sprouting up everywhere!

[urbanplanet17]

2 hours ago, PHofKS said:

Not sure if you are referring to interstate highway signage, but that was done per national standards for location of advance warning, interchange guidance and confirmation. In fact the interstate signage, in my opinion, is positively brilliant!!!  

However, there are confusing interchanges where exit ramps are counter intuitive (first exit to the right actually goes left, second one actually does go right), but I find if you trust the signs rather than your gut, you'll get to your destination. 

Some challenges in Nashville include directing traffic to Briley Parkway..how do you sign that? It loops around the city in a loop and is neither north-south or east-west. So the signs have a cardinal direction, although who knows what north-south is at any particular spot? TDOT did put signs up for "Opryland" on I-40 at the airport, although technically there is no Opryland. However, it is now a neighborhood and a destination more meaningful than 'just north on Briley Parkway'.

I'm specifically referring to the signs directing you to the highway entrances / exits.

A good example is the interchange at the Shelby Avenue / KVB bridge. You see plenty of signs telling you the freeway is coming, but you don't know which lane you should be in. Common sense would suggest the left lane and making a left turn, yes? Well, as you come around the bend at posted speeds, a tiny little sign with an arrow on the far right side of the street suddenly appears out of nowhere directing you to I-24 / I-65. By this time, it's too late to jump over a bunch of lanes in traffic to enter the on-ramp and you have to go up several blocks in order to turn around and come back.

Edited August 23, 2017 by urbanplanet17

[BnaBreaker]

3 hours ago, jmtunafish said:

From Sky5

And from yesterday:

Getting major Los Angeles vibes from this shot with the hills and the expressways leading to downtown...obviously the scale is a bit different as the LA skyline is probably twice as tall and twice as long, but still... excellent 'big metropolis' shot.

[CenterHill]

2 hours ago, PHofKS said:

Not sure if you are referring to interstate highway signage, but that was done per national standards for location of advance warning, interchange guidance and confirmation. In fact the interstate signage, in my opinion, is positively brilliant!!!  

My issue with the TDOT Interstate signage is that it's fairly uninformative for drivers who don't already know their way around this city.   The current signage does nothing to help you get to specific parts of town, like Downtown or Midtown or East Nashville or Green Hills.    You see this more specific interstate signage as you navigate through many other cities. 

For example, we have signs that give directions to "Nashville" when you are already in Nashville (here's I-40 approaching downtown just before the 440 split).   Hmm, I want to go to Green Hills, which is in Nashville.   Should I bear left at the split?    

 

Or here, I-65 at Wedgewood.   Hmm, I want to go Downtown and I can see the skyline.   Which one should I choose?   

 

Hey, I just landed and picked up my rental car and driving in I-40 (Fesslers Lane) to my hotel downtown.    Uhhh.....Siri help!   

[urbanplanet17]

31 minutes ago, CenterHill said:

My issue with the TDOT Interstate signage is that it's fairly uninformative for drivers who don't already know their way around this city.   The current signage does nothing to help you get to specific parts of town, like Downtown or Midtown or East Nashville or Green Hills.    You see this more specific interstate signage as you navigate through many other cities. 

For example, we have signs that give directions to "Nashville" when you are already in Nashville (here's I-40 approaching downtown just before the 440 split).   Hmm, I want to go to Green Hills, which is in Nashville.   Should I bear left at the split?    

 

Or here, I-65 at Wedgewood.   Hmm, I want to go Downtown and I can see the skyline.   Which one should I choose?   

 

Hey, I just landed and picked up my rental car and driving in I-40 (Fesslers Lane) to my hotel downtown.    Uhhh.....Siri help!   

That's a fair point. I noticed the same thing when I drove down to Nashville. I had a pretty good idea of how to get downtown after doing a ton of research. But for someone who knows nothing about the city, what you mention would be frustrating as well.

Edited August 23, 2017 by urbanplanet17

[MLBrumby]

1 hour ago, urbanplanet17 said:

I'm specifically referring to the signs directing you to the highway entrances / exits.

A good example is the interchange at the Shelby Avenue / KVB bridge. You see plenty of signs telling you the freeway is coming, but you don't know which lane you should be in. Common sense would suggest the left lane and making a left turn, yes? Well, as you come around the bend at posted speeds, a tiny little sign with an arrow on the far right side of the street suddenly appears out of nowhere directing you to I-24 / I-65. By this time, it's too late to jump over a bunch of lanes in traffic to enter the on-ramp and you have to go up several blocks in order to turn around and come back.

Amen!

Edited August 23, 2017 by MLBrumby

[archilove]

This is in response to the grid layout comment-as a matter of practicality grid layouts on flat terrain are a good thing. But from an aesthetics point of view they are very boring. Maybe its because I've lived here a long time, but Nashville's streets don't affect my sense of direction.

[Titans10]

You should email those photos of the signboards to TDOT, that is a very valid point that should be addressed. 

[PruneTracy]

2 hours ago, CenterHill said:

My issue with the TDOT Interstate signage is that it's fairly uninformative for drivers who don't already know their way around this city.   The current signage does nothing to help you get to specific parts of town, like Downtown or Midtown or East Nashville or Green Hills.    You see this more specific interstate signage as you navigate through many other cities.

Per the MUTCD, destinations on Interstate interchange guide signs (not exits) are based on and limited to a very specific list of control cities. Long-time Nashville residents may recall when, in the mid-90s, the closest control city on I-65 south of Nashville changed from Birmingham to Huntsville. Those signs were modified by TDOT over time to reflect the new destination.

It's important to note here that Interstates are really intended for inter-city, not intra-city, travel. It may help residents and tourists coming in from the west side of town to see that I-440 leads to Green Hills whereas I-40 leads to the Gulch, but for truckers or other long-distance travelers trying to get to the East Coast (or even to Knoxville or Chattanooga), that's not very informative. I-440 wasn't built to be an access road to the Mall at Green Hills, it's a bypass around the CBD to I-24 and I-40.

I will say that the new hotness is arrow-per-lane guide signs that help clarify some of the issues regarding which lane goes where, as shown below:

These are supposed to be used on all new or reconstructed freeways over the older (but still included as an option) diagrammatic signs.

But, I can assure everyone here that the signs around Nashville, and traffic signs in general, get studied to death. There are reasons a lot of these are placed where they are, why they look a certain way, etc. Lots of research, testing, and good old trial-and-error for the past eighty-two years.

[donNdonelson2]

At Adventure Science Center today to see a planetarium show. Had to snap a photo from the dining area of the building. It has been decades since my last visit here-it has grown into a great facility.

[TNinVB]

4 hours ago, BnaBreaker said:

Getting major Los Angeles vibes from this shot with the hills and the expressways leading to downtown...obviously the scale is a bit different as the LA skyline is probably twice as tall and twice as long, but still... excellent 'big metropolis' shot.

I agree. It reminds me of the popular view of L.A. that you see form Mulholland Dr. with the 101 freeway in the foreground. 

[MidTenn1]

Been traveling to Atlanta today, so I've been unable to respond to later posts.

A general comment I would give is the interstate signing, as suggested before is basic and not intended to give much local guidance or direct you to Joe's Bar. There are some specific destinations that are high traffic generators on signs, however. But at some point people looking for local destinations can look at maps, which are everywhere, to determine which neighborhood is served by which Interstate. Why would TDOT sign Green Hills and not West End, North Nashville, Germantown, East Nashville, etc., etc. You have to keep the message and at three lines or less. People are driving 60 miles an hour through a maze of appearing and disappearing lanes with other two-ton pieces of metal weaving about at the same speed and the distractions of billboards and commercial signs interfering with a driver's ability to cognitively discern which route gets them to the general  area they are seeking. The Transportation Engineering discipline has long since discovered that giving motorists simple, clear messages that guide the motorist from a general point to the next general point is the most efficient and safe way to manage the operation of the highway.

In the above three pictures, the first is fairly self explanatory if you want downtown.

The second probably could use an extra panel to route you downtown.

The third...either way gets you downtown.

Left, right signs at interchanges are a difficult problem. TDOT has addressed this on some occasions, but it's often a case of too much information if you put two options to the intersecting interstate on one sign. Usually, the left (or right) turn sign can be seen if you look up the road.

I will be touring Atlanta tomorrow and will use a map and GPS to find my destination after using the signs (LOL at Atlanta's signs with all this construction) to get me downtown.

 

Ok. Off to the ballgame. Enough said on this subject.

[TNinVB]

I was in town a few times over the last couple of weeks to pick up and drop off my mom. She visited VB for a couple of weeks. One thing I noticed that was very annoying was the condition of the interstates in the inner loop near downtown. Good lord can TDOT repave it already?? Also, on my drive to Nashville from VB I took a new route instead of the usual I-64 to I-81 South then to 40 West. I took Hwy 58 to 85 South into the Triangle in North Carolina and then 40 West. It is the most beautiful drive in the mountain around Asheville and before Knoxville. One thing that really stood out to me is how nice the interstate is around the Triangle (Durham, Burlington, Winston-Salem) and the interchanges are landscaped very nicely. Even the concrete barriers in the middle of the interstate had landscaping (mostly trees and shrubs) and there were patches along the side of the interstate with sunflowers that were in bloom. It was very impressive. I wish TDOT would do something like this in Nashville or around Tennessee in general. Don't get me wrong, there is some beautiful scenery along the interstates in Tennessee, but out interchanges around the metro areas are in need of some major upkeep. Just my two cents...

[urbanplanet17]

I didn't expect my comment to generate such an interesting conversation, lol.

It was just my unsolicited opinion. It may be a state-by-state thing as far as how general or specific the highway signage is. In Detroit, for example, there are very detailed signs along I-94 as people come in from the airport as far as how to get to the New Center Area, Wayne State, Downtown, Ford Field / Comerica Park, etc. And on Detroit's surface streets, there are frequently one or more signs that will read something like "Westbound I-94, keep right" as one approaches a freeway interchange.

Edited August 23, 2017 by urbanplanet17