Belk to purchase Parisian

[mallguy]

Still, Bayer is enforcing this portion of the lease because it's a Belk store going in. If Parisian had sold to Lord & Taylor, or Nordstrom, or even Dillard's, this portion of the operating agreement wouldn't have gone to the lawsuit level.

I agree 100%.

My shopping center lease lawyers think that Belk can respond by just screwing over Bayer by ceasing to operate a "first-class" store in 2011, which is what the lease likely would allow, based on recent news articles.

Also, I don't think landlord consent to a store nameplate change is just a technicality; it is extremely important for landlords to have some say-so over what types of stores are in their centers, in order to promote a desired tenant mix.

[samson123]

I know it seems wrong and stupid for Bayer to sue Belk, but the summit is no ordinary shopping center. The average person spends way more at this center than most malls all over the country.The Summits surrounding demographics are amazing, within a 3 mile radius the AVERAGE income for 17,000 households is $115,000 a year, 5 mile radius 47,000 households income is $105,000 a year, and that's just close in. These aren't your average shoppers, these are people that get what they want and if they can't get it in Birmingham they will drive to Atlanta or order it online. This clint el does want Belk. To them Belk=Sears . Personally I think Bayer knows it could lure Nordstrom very easily if the Parisian space was empty. So why not try to stop Belk , can you blame them, hmmm Belk or Nordstrom. Besides Belk will bring the whole place down a level so they have to try something . For the record bed bath beyond, carmike , bruno's were all put in place before they knew how much summit shoppers spend. Every new phase at the Summit pulls in more swanky stores than the last phase. .

[kayman]

I know it seems wrong and stupid for Bayer to sue Belk, but the summit is no ordinary shopping center. The average person spends way more at this center than most malls all over the country.The Summits surrounding demographics are amazing, within a 3 mile radius the AVERAGE income for 17,000 households is $115,000 a year, 5 mile radius 47,000 households income is $105,000 a year, and that's just close in. These aren't your average shoppers, these are people that get what they want and if they can't get it in Birmingham they will drive to Atlanta or order it online. This clint el does want Belk. To them Belk=Sears . Personally I think Bayer knows it could lure Nordstrom very easily if the Parisian space was empty. So why not try to stop Belk , can you blame them, hmmm Belk or Nordstrom. Besides Belk will bring the whole place down a level so they have to try something . For the record bed bath beyond, carmike , bruno's were all put in place before they knew how much summit shoppers spend. Every new phase at the Summit pulls in more swanky stores than the last phase. .

Well put sir, and welcome to UrbanPlanet, Samson123. I believe what a lot of people from outside of the region fail to realize about The Summit is it became upscale by accident. The center was originally planned to be just a typical regional retail center, but it was an open air village. However, when the demographics of the area and the average income level of the typical Summit shopper was realized, then L&T, Nordstrom, Saks, and even N&M was throwing their hats into the ring to get a spot at the center. ***To the outsiders*** It was hilarious how many articles that was in the Birmingham News and Birmingham Business Journal from 1999 to 2001 on how the scouts for those upscale retailers was begging Bayer to give them a spot in Phase II which Saks later got. The center may have the typical mall retailers, but from what I've been hearing that as soon as their lease expires, Bayers has given them the boot. In the next couple of years, there will be more and more phasing out of typical retailers and being replaced with more higher end ones.

[mallguy]

From the current Birmingham Business Journal: the suit does appear to be about a lease that requires Bayer's consent for Parisian to assign the store space to Belk:

Article extract:

Scott says semantic arguments aside, the suit amounts to a lease dispute, specifically Parisian's intent to assign its lease to Belk and Bayer's prerogative to deny consent.

"Belk (is buying) Parisian, and there will be no Parisian once that deal is final, but Parisian is still the tenant on the lease, and in order for that lease to remain effective, Parisian will have to assign that lease to Belk," Scott says.

"It appears that Bayer will refuse to have the lease assigned to Belk because Belk does not satisfy its definition of the type of tenant required by the lease, and they are absolutely legally justified in that assertion. It is by no means remotely frivolous."

[kayman]

From the current Birmingham Business Journal: the suit does appear to be about a lease that requires Bayer's consent for Parisian to assign the store space to Belk:

Article extract:

Scott says semantic arguments aside, the suit amounts to a lease dispute, specifically Parisian's intent to assign its lease to Belk and Bayer's prerogative to deny consent.

"Belk (is buying) Parisian, and there will be no Parisian once that deal is final, but Parisian is still the tenant on the lease, and in order for that lease to remain effective, Parisian will have to assign that lease to Belk," Scott says.

"It appears that Bayer will refuse to have the lease assigned to Belk because Belk does not satisfy its definition of the type of tenant required by the lease, and they are absolutely legally justified in that assertion. It is by no means remotely frivolous."

That's what I've been saying from jump. It is Bayer's right and perrogative to deny Belk the lease if they want to. They have major plans to turn the center in an entirely high-end retail center, hotel, and office complex and if they don't see Belk fit then that's they business not Parisian and Belk to determine. As the saying goes people, it is all business nothing personal.

[TRoberts]

That's what I've been saying from jump. It is Bayer's right and perrogative to deny Belk the lease if they want to. They have major plans to turn the center in an entirely high-end retail center, hotel, and office complex and if they don't see Belk fit then that's they business not Parisian and Belk to determine. As the saying goes people, it is all business nothing personal.

But also as that very same article says, it may come down to semantics. What is considered first-class retail in places like New York, Miami, even Atlanta may not be first-class retail everywhere. It ultimately hinges on what people "think" about or their perception of a store as to whether it's first-class.

I don't think anyone would argue that Belk's Southpark store could be considered first-class. However, Belk's Jasper, AL store would hardly be considered first-class.

The same goes for Nordstrom, Neiman Marcus and all the others. They have different classes of stores. I hardly doubt that any of those names would put a true first-clas or A Class or Class 1 (or whatever they happen to call it) in Birmingham, AL. They may do a watered down B Class or C Class store but you're not going to get the same type Nordstrom or Neiman Marcus in Birmingham as you would in larger metropolitan areas.

And when you get down to semantics, Parisian isn't exactly considered first-class (in my opinion) in some of it's locations. The Gadsden, AL store is a retrofitted McRae's and quite honestly, the Belk there is more desirable than the Parisian's.

Anyway, as the article starts, it's really going to come down to opinion and semantics. What is one's "perception" of first-class? And I think everyone knows the argument of "Well Bed, Bath, & Beyond; Gap; Pier 1; Old Navy; etc. and others are not first-class, why are they allowed to remain in the Summit? Are their leases going to be terminated at some point? Is Bayer going to refuse to renew their leases?"

[Alababy]

I found it interesting that in one article, Bayer is seeking a non-jury settlement on this. Don't recall which areticle it was in.

Sunday's paper included three editorials from people saying that the suit seems silly, and at least one of them said they would avoid the Summit from now on. One of them, however, was a bit more back-handed, as the writer said the Summit was too expensive, and she shopped thrifts stores, too. (Honey, the Summit doesn't want you if you admit to thrift shopping.)

Interesting how this will all play out.

[StevenRocks]

I think they should do a jury trial. Consensus is a good thing.

[mallguy]

I think Bayer isn't doing a jury trial because it wants quick resolution on this.

[StevenRocks]

It needs to go to jury though. What better way to gauge what a "first class" department store is on a legal level than to ask the jurors to consider the reasoning on both sides?

[mallguy]

It needs to go to jury though. What better way to gauge what a "first class" department store is on a legal level than to ask the jurors to consider the reasoning on both sides?

I'd think that a jury might be more favorable to Bayer. If a judge is the stereotypical 55-year old man, he is probably not much of a shopper.

[HSVTiger]

I'd think that a jury might be more favorable to Bayer. If a judge is the stereotypical 55-year old man, he is probably not much of a shopper.

Bayer could argue they want an "upscale" Lowes or Home Depot.

[StevenRocks]

I'd think that a jury might be more favorable to Bayer. If a judge is the stereotypical 55-year old man, he is probably not much of a shopper.

I'm not sure if a jury would favor any particular side, and I'm not sure if being a shopper would make much difference in this case.

[Alababy]

Things are looking up...Belk Riverchase is getting in TONS of new women's shoe lines. The ones they put out last night included Cole Haan and Calvin Klein. Sweet!

[StevenRocks]

That's great news on the shoes. Belk has the resources to pull in better brands.

[DigitalSky]

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/15661722.htm

The deal is sealed.

[MurfRez]

There is a Summit out west anchored by Dillard's. If that doesn't make this suit pointless, I don't know what does.

Some of the Parisian stores did indeed fill the void between a mid range department store and say a Nordstrom, but many didn't. The same with Belk. Macy's and Dillard's as well.

Belk is going to go after the demographic that shops the local store. They aren't going to put the same merchandise in Florence or Decatur that they will in Summit. They would be stupid to lose the business of those customers when they have the proven ability to market to them(SouthPark). They are also retaining some of Parisian's best people to improve on Ladies' shoes and clothing.

Birmingham held on to its locally named store longer than most cities did. It's just a sign of the times. Like it or not, Dillard's, Macy's, and Belk are simply the names weathering the consolidation of the middle range department store industry.

If a city is lucky enough to have a Nordstrom, Bloomingdale's, Neiman's, or in your case Saks, they should consider themselves lucky.

[EvanK]

But also as that very same article says, it may come down to semantics. What is considered first-class retail in places like New York, Miami, even Atlanta may not be first-class retail everywhere. It ultimately hinges on what people "think" about or their perception of a store as to whether it's first-class.

I don't think anyone would argue that Belk's Southpark store could be considered first-class. However, Belk's Jasper, AL store would hardly be considered first-class.

The same goes for Nordstrom, Neiman Marcus and all the others. They have different classes of stores. I hardly doubt that any of those names would put a true first-clas or A Class or Class 1 (or whatever they happen to call it) in Birmingham, AL. They may do a watered down B Class or C Class store but you're not going to get the same type Nordstrom or Neiman Marcus in Birmingham as you would in larger metropolitan areas.

And when you get down to semantics, Parisian isn't exactly considered first-class (in my opinion) in some of it's locations. The Gadsden, AL store is a retrofitted McRae's and quite honestly, the Belk there is more desirable than the Parisian's.

Anyway, as the article starts, it's really going to come down to opinion and semantics. What is one's "perception" of first-class? And I think everyone knows the argument of "Well Bed, Bath, & Beyond; Gap; Pier 1; Old Navy; etc. and others are not first-class, why are they allowed to remain in the Summit? Are their leases going to be terminated at some point? Is Bayer going to refuse to renew their leases?"

Amen! The Parisian store here sux. In fact, it isn't doing so well, but Belk is and always has been a strong brand in this town. People here expected Parisian to bring in their "higher scale" merchandise to a city of waaay less than 100,000 people, but that didn't happen. The Parisian store here does NOT carry all the same merchandise as the ones down the road in Birmingham. The day the store opened under the Parisian nameplate, people were disappointed, and immediately turned around and went back to Belk. They might as well have been at the opening of a new JC Penny. It got about the same reaction.

They basically just ripped out everything that had the McRae's name on it, plastered Parisian all over everything, and called it a day. They made a few cosmetic changes to the store, but nothing that would make you want to call and tell your momma about.

Go in Parisian here, get a cashier right away. Go into Belk, stand in a line. Belk is very strong up here. Always has been. They've been in this town now for nearly 40 years, and the people here are loyal to the brand.

[kayman]

Amen! The Parisian store here sux. In fact, it isn't doing so well, but Belk is and always has been a strong brand in this town. People here expected Parisian to bring in their "higher scale" merchandise to a city of waaay less than 100,000 people, but that didn't happen. The Parisian store here does NOT carry all the same merchandise as the ones down the road in Birmingham. The day the store opened under the Parisian nameplate, people were disappointed, and immediately turned around and went back to Belk. They might as well have been at the opening of a new JC Penny. It got about the same reaction.

They basically just ripped out everything that had the McRae's name on it, plastered Parisian all over everything, and called it a day. They made a few cosmetic changes to the store, but nothing that would make you want to call and tell your momma about.

Go in Parisian here, get a cashier right away. Go into Belk, stand in a line. Belk is very strong up here. Always has been. They've been in this town now for nearly 40 years, and the people here are loyal to the brand.

[kayman]

Parisian staff gone by March

Oh yes, and mediocrity begins. For you Belk lovers, why I don't like Belk, Belk Kitchin's is the reason. The textbook example as to why I don't like that chain, horrible and cheaply made clothing, horrible customer service, and atrocious return policy. I would waste my money with a chain that has that reputation in my book.

[StevenRocks]

For you Belk lovers, why I don't like Belk, Belk Kitchin's is the reason.

[EvanK]

Uh, no offense but that is Gadsden, a city that is not exactly the wealthiest secondary market in the state. I wouldn't expect a high-end location in a region like that. Honestly, I don't know what Saks, Inc. was smoking when they decided to convert that location from McRae's to Parisian.

[kayman]

What about Kitchin's Withit?

[StevenRocks]

My sister shopped there too, and she said she have bought better quality clothes at a trade-day or a Swap-meet. Sorry, in my family, we all think the chain sucks.

Also, all of my female co-workers (women between the ages 25 to 45) are laughing at the idea of Parisian converting to Belk, and it actually being a nice store. They said they don't care if they do have a "nice upscale" store in Charlotte, they said they won't shop there. They said they would rather spend their money at Macy's or Dillard's, and at Gus Mayer before they shop there for nice clothes. Most agree with the idea, that Belk should have kept the Parisian nameplate for the upper-end stores like The Summit and Riverchase. One particular close female friend, said she would will drive to Atlanta if she want to do serious shopping or order online from Nordstrom. In general, Belk is NOT well like here in Alabama, period. It is seen as a second-hand store like a thift store where you buy "grandma clothes" for dirt cheap. I wouldn't be a bit of surprise if Belk winds up selling these stores just like the ones in Indiana and Michigan.

[kayman]

Get over it, please.