Hartford Beltway.. Good that it was never built?

[HartfordTycoon]

I think placing some form of high speed public transit in the median or HOV lane would make excellent sense. Most of the railroad right-of-ways travel through suburban neighborhoods and cross streets etc, while having a train travel along an interstate highway would not create added NIMBY issues nor added safety concerns.

You could easily have train stations at or near exit ramps or simply have the train travel up and down the existing HOV on/off ramps.

Thats makes a lot of sense. Many many people oppose reactivating the inactive rail lines due to safety and noise concerns.

[mikel]

Thats makes a lot of sense. Many many people oppose reactivating the inactive rail lines due to safety and noise concerns.

They honestly don't have a leg to stand on though. They live near rail lines. And most of the rail lines in the Hartford area are still active for freight. I've seen trains going down Wethersfield and Rocky Hill and across the swing bridge in Middletown. They go over the rail bridge in the north meadows in Hartford and over to East Hartford and Manchester. And they obviously go down to Newington. Sorry folks, you live near a rail line, you should have expected trains!

[MadVlad]

Right,like the people that move in across the street from Bradley in Windsor Locks then complain about the noisy planes....

[robm324]

Right,like the people that move in across the street from Bradley in Windsor Locks then complain about the noisy planes....

Exactly, some people have rocks in their heads. People move into the areas surrounding Bradley because of the slightly lower housing costs....then complain about the air traffic noise....well folks, there was a reason that your house was more affordable....

[Bill Mocarsky]

I think placing some form of high speed public transit in the median or HOV lane would make excellent sense

Here is my idea for a high speed transit line that I call METROHART.

East of the river it would run in the HOV lanes. The eastern terminus would be located at the junction of I-84 and I-384 near Manchester Community College. Above the station, spanning I-384 would be a large commuter parking garage that also serves as a hub for shuttles to UCONN, Buckland Hills circuit routes and other regional bus routes. In addition to a place to park and lock bicycles, bike rentals would be available for those that wish to explore the adjacent bike trail system.

[drc72]

Right,like the people that move in across the street from Bradley in Windsor Locks then complain about the noisy planes....

There is no pleasing everybody.

[blink55184]

Here is my idea for a high speed transit line that I call METROHART.

East of the river it would run in the HOV lanes. The eastern terminus would be located at the junction of I-84 and I-384 near Manchester Community College. Above the station, spanning I-384 would be a large commuter parking garage that also serves as a hub for shuttles to UCONN, Buckland Hills circuit routes and other regional bus routes. In addition to a place to park and lock bicycles, bike rentals would be available for those that wish to explore the adjacent bike trail system.

I may have mentioned this last time you posted your idea, but what about a few more blocks and having a downtown manchester stop?

[Luca Brasi]

Nice idea Bill. Could you incorporate a north/south line as well? The rail lines run under the Convenmtion Center and run north out by the airport. What better way to sell conventions than to give travelers a way to step off their planes, onto a train and get off at the CC. The tracks then run south past Coltsville and down along 91.

[beerbeer]

To reroute I-84 it would only take 4 miles of new highway.

The existing route into the city would become I-384 and dead end near the Capital/Aetna. The rest of the route could be return to the ciy street grid.

This is not a perfect solution as it would tax the Charter Oak Bridge. The river crossing and the appraoches would have to be rethought. But it is the simpliest solution to the reuniting downtown East Hartford with downtown Hartford.

[runawayjim]

Right,like the people that move in across the street from Bradley in Windsor Locks then complain about the noisy planes....

we get those people in warwick... they move into a house right under the approach area and then beotch about the noise.

Nice idea Bill. Could you incorporate a north/south line as well? The rail lines run under the Convenmtion Center and run north out by the airport. What better way to sell conventions than to give travelers a way to step off their planes, onto a train and get off at the CC. The tracks then run south past Coltsville and down along 91.

a north south line would be hugely beneficial, not just for the conventions, but for anyone travelling through bradley (and of course that line should go all the way to new haven).

[somad]

Sure there would have been sprawl... but I can't help but think that if those highways were built a ton of developments would've immediately followed. There absolutely could have been some positives to all these roads, and a bigger presence on the national stage would have been one.

Another good question would be... what would the state be like if all the 1960s highways were built. Look at this 1964 map and all the highways that Eastern CT would've had. This state could have been drastically different than it is today.

[MadVlad]

To reroute I-84 it would only take 4 miles of new highway.

The existing route into the city would become I-384 and dead end near the Capital/Aetna. The rest of the route could be return to the ciy street grid.

This is not a perfect solution as it would tax the Charter Oak Bridge. The river crossing and the appraoches would have to be rethought. But it is the simpliest solution to the reuniting downtown East Hartford with downtown Hartford.

Ouch, Newington gets hammered in that proposal, but I like it....

[drc72]

Ouch, Newington gets hammered in that proposal, but I like it....

I wonder how many houses would be sacrifised through eminant domain?

[Bill Mocarsky]

To reroute I-84 it would only take 4 miles of new highway.

This is not a perfect solution as it would tax the Charter Oak Bridge. The river crossing and the appraoches would have to be rethought. But it is the simpliest solution to the reuniting downtown East Hartford with downtown Hartford.

Route 15 in Wethersfield would probably need to be upgraded. Is there room?

So far, 3 of the alternative routes we discussed would use the Charter Oak Bridge.

I think the Charter Oak would be ideal for I-84 (with a little upgrading of course).

It is already part of the 91 / 84 interchange and has a seamless connection in East Hartford.

The existing route into the city would become I-384 and dead end near the Capital/Aetna. The rest of the route could be return to the ciy street grid.

All 3 of the alternatives could dead end as you mentioned, freeing the Bulkeley Bridge from the interstate.

What would you do with the Canyon (the segment of I-84 that is below grade between Main and High streets)?

IDEA 1

I have thought of extending Connecticut Boulevard to Asylum Hill, or even to where the existing (I-84) route dead ends.

A rail based transit line that crosses the river via the Bulkeley Bridge could run in the canyon under CT BLVD.

IDEA 2

Another option would be to use the canyon as an underground parking garage.

At street level, CT BLVD (like idea 1) would provide excellent access to the interstates.

[MadVlad]

Idea 2 is what I was thinking, make it all parking and build some nice buildings above it...

[Bill Mocarsky]

I may have mentioned this last time you posted your idea, but what about a few more blocks and having a downtown manchester stop?

Blink, what route would you propose?

I was thinking, in the very least, the multi modal transportation depot I envision would also function as a hub for transit around Manchester. Manchester Bus routes (or light rail) would feed into this hub rather than take the loooooong trip to Hartford.

I think it would be very important for the route that connects this hub to Hartford to be fast and efficient.

[Theophrastus Bombastus]

Actually, I think (and there may be some empirical evidence out there) that a true beltway would have helped to control sprawl, as it would have been mainly contained in and around the beltway footprint, instead of out helter-skelter in all directions like what actually happened. Unless of course we got to be like San Antonio which is now on their THIRD beltway - that place is the sprawl-king of all the cities I've seen.

[beerbeer]

Connecticut does NOT have a sprawl problem. It's a joke. Northern Virginia has a sprawl problem. What Coonnecticut hasd is a bunch of idiots who have latched onto a buzz word.

[runawayjim]

Connecticut does NOT have a sprawl problem. It's a joke. Northern Virginia has a sprawl problem. What Coonnecticut hasd is a bunch of idiots who have latched onto a buzz word.

have you been to fairfield county?

[somad]

Connecticut does NOT have a sprawl problem. It's a joke. Northern Virginia has a sprawl problem. What Coonnecticut hasd is a bunch of idiots who have latched onto a buzz word.

I don't know about that... as runawayjim mentioned we have fairfield county, which is mostly built on sprawl from NYC (i'm not saying it's a bad thing for us entirely, but it is there). Also, CT has the Berlin Turnpike and Manchester, and if you look at population density maps central CT isn't exactly a model metro area for density (yes, it's definately not the worst but not the best by any means). I'm not trying to start a pissing contest or anything, sprawl is all over the country. Boston, with a great core and an extensive commuter rail and subway system, has sprawled out beyond belief. It's the way things go in America these days and the biggest reason I'm nervous about seeing the Utopia project fully built in this part of the state.

[drc72]

have you been to fairfield county?

I have to agree, Fairfield county has plenty of sprawl.

[runawayjim]

I don't know about that... as runawayjim mentioned we have fairfield county, which is mostly built on sprawl from NYC (i'm not saying it's a bad thing for us entirely, but it is there). Also, CT has the Berlin Turnpike and Manchester, and if you look at population density maps central CT isn't exactly a model metro area for density (yes, it's definately not the worst but not the best by any means). I'm not trying to start a pissing contest or anything, sprawl is all over the country. Boston, with a great core and an extensive commuter rail and subway system, has sprawled out beyond belief. It's the way things go in America these days and the biggest reason I'm nervous about seeing the Utopia project fully built in this part of the state.

don't forget milford/orange and wallingford... and what 85 in waterford/new london is turning into...

[somad]

don't forget milford/orange and wallingford... and what 85 in waterford/new london is turning into...

85/cross roads in Waterford was designed for sprawl with 85 widened betweeen 95 and 395 and the cross road to 95 (Bob's, Walmart)... and every town in Eastern CT seems to think that big box shopping plazas are the way to go.

[HartfordTycoon]

Connecticut does NOT have a sprawl problem. It's a joke. Northern Virginia has a sprawl problem. What Coonnecticut hasd is a bunch of idiots who have latched onto a buzz word.

I agree with you. What we have, even in Fairfield County is pretty healthy development. We need better transportation options, ie mass transit. The real problem is this small town mindset that we live in small quaint new england land and we don't need subways, heavy rail, commuter rail, etc. Houston has sprawl. Atlanta has sprawl. Like you said Northern VA has sprawl. Endless ugly sprawl. We don't have that.

[mikel]

Connecticut does NOT have a sprawl problem. It's a joke. Northern Virginia has a sprawl problem. What Coonnecticut hasd is a bunch of idiots who have latched onto a buzz word.

Um, Connecticut has huge sprawl. Have you been to any other country? In a metro the size of Hartford, the entire population would be living in the city of Hartford and maybe spread a little bit into the next suburbs. There wouldn't be anyone in Canton, Ellington, Cromwell, Suffield, etc. except farmers. Our sprawl is disgusting. So, we're not as bad as Houston and Virginia, still we shouldn't be proud. No sprawl problem in Connecticut, sheesh are you blind?