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The population boom in the Triangle


willrusso

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That is tight. I can't believe it. Looks like I'll be buying a house either off Capital Blvd. or in Brier Creek. Those areas will continue to boom, I'll get a return on the investment.

Suspiciously that area in between Raleigh, Cary in Garner seems almost void of development south of Tryon Rd. I'm suspicious as to why seems like it would be prime real estate.

I really hope the rail takes off. We could use it now and especially in the future. I would anyway.

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That is tight. I can't believe it. Looks like I'll be buying a house either off Capital Blvd. or in Brier Creek. Those areas will continue to boom, I'll get a return on the investment.

Suspiciously that area in between Raleigh, Cary in Garner seems almost void of development south of Tryon Rd. I'm suspicious as to why seems like it would be prime real estate.

I really hope the rail takes off. We could use it now and especially in the future. I would anyway.

The area around Lake Wheeler is set for low density residential use, mostly (~1 acre lots) to protect the watershed for the lake. The same is true around Jordan Lake and Falls Lake. You can find the land use plans at the various government web pages, e.g. http://www.townofcary.org and http://www.wakegov.com/default.htm

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http://www.newsobserver.com/content/news/g...0051004map.html

I found these interactive maps really interesting:

Click on "Jobs and Population, 2002" to see the curent density.

Click on "Growth in Jobs and Population" to see the growth only between 2002 and 2030.

Click on "Jobs and Population, 2030" to see their projected density.

They are really projecting a lot of job growth in RTP, but I have a feeling it is in part to sell TTA (since they came up with this model). What surprises me the most is the job growth projected from US 1 North (Wake Forst area), and US 1 South (Cary). And Western and NW Wake County are going to sprawl out of control, in part due to 540.

The job growth is in RTP/center of the Triangle because of its centralized location. That is why Lenovo will stay there, this is why Credit Suisse went there. That is where most of the new Phrama companies are. A company can pull from Durham, Chapel Hill, Raleigh, Cary, Wake Forest, F-V and even farther east and even farther west.

As much as I hate it, if I was moving a company to the trangle and wanted to pull from the local workforce for professional and basic/professinal jobs, I would go to the RTP area also.

Great for the area but hell on your downtown !!

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Looks like Hillsborough is going to have a bit of a boom. Of course that's expected anyway as sprawl creeps up towards it from the south, east, and west....

I was in Hboro a few weeks ago and noticed the OLD Wal-Mart still has the 'Wal-Mart' sign up... can anyone explain that?

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^^it is, one presumes, in keeping with the pace at which Hillsborough seems to move in general, which, as I have said in previous posts, is usually somewhere around 5 - 15 miles/hr below the speed limit. :lol:

As a resident of Hillsborough, I think the boom is inevitable. We love it there, and I guess others are discovering it's heretofor well-kept secrets. I don't know them personally, but I just hope the folks making decisions will allow growth to happen in a way that does not erase the town's character.

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Isn't there talk of condos being built in downtown Hillsborough as well as Weaver Street Market?

yes, but Weaver St. apparently hasn't gotten its act together enough to make it happen yet. It went from "this fall" to "next spring" to "next year" to "someday" in the press. Which is too bad. We'd be able to quit driving to Whole Foods in Durham or Chapel Hill for our produce. Maybe we can convince Earth Fare to open up there instead. One would think there'd be plenty of marketshare for a store like that in H'boro.

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  • 1 month later...

They redefined metro areas in 2003 and it is based on commuting patterns. Raleigh looks small because it has to share the region with Durham which has its own metro area.

Durham, NC Metropolitan Statistical Area,2004

  • Chatham County - 57,023

  • Durham County - 239,733

  • Orange County - 117,515

  • Person County - 36,944

  • Total - 451,215

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It's completely backwards to classify Raleigh and Durham as individual metro areas. Particularly here where RTP would wind up in both separate metros, and a substantial proportion of the population works in and around there, creating an artificial industry center for each city.

Then again, we all already know that, so what am I saying? :)

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Raleigh and Durham were split from the same MSA due to commuting patterns. Actually having the split indicates that a majority of the populating lives close to where they work. Also keep in mind that RTP is located within the Durham MSA. So I'd wager that most of the commuters who live in Raleigh but work in "Durham" are actually working in RTP specifically.

The CSA of course still contains the Raleigh and Durham areas. It is important to know which figure you have if you're doing comparisons. This is the 1.4 (or whatever) million figure you see so often.

MSAs and CSAs are computed using the exact same criteria for all metropolitan areas.

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Bah, they will be forced to change it back the way it way. What a dumb move. Commuting patterns yeah, whatever.

Well umm... that's like really how it works. Like for real. There's no "forcing" of anything involved and it isn't a conspiracy against the Triangle.

A metropolitan statistical area (MSA) is defined by commuters, and using the new definitions that were applied nationwide a few years ago, Raleigh and Durham were separated into their own MSAs. Greensboro and Winston-Salem were also separated. A lot of MSAs were seriously modified in size all over the country.

However the census bureau created the combined statistical area (CSA) which is defined using a much smaller slice of commuters, and it serves to show the bigger picture regarding economic dependence, etc. Raleigh and Durham are part of the same CSA, and indeed the population figure is larger than the old MSA I believe.

The CSA number describes a region just like the old MSA number did... perhaps even better than the old MSA number. Now the MSA number is much more functional and helps to describe the component nature of a region much more accurately. In the end, the same people live here and everywhere else... it is just a numbers game... but it is a numbers game played everywhere, so everyone is on equal footing.

All of these definitions are based on county lines. This is good and bad. If you want to see big population numbers, remember that everyone in Johnston County is included in Raleigh's MSA count even if they never go to Raleigh... that's just an example. However if you have a large central county and a minimal amount of sprawl leakage into surrounding counties by percentage, then those counties may not have the numbers to make it on the list.

The fact that Raleigh and Durham were split into separate MSAs is a good sign... it indicates that most of the population lives reasonably close to where they work, and that Triangle area sprawl doesn't penetrate too much into the surrounding area.

Everyone gripes about how sprawled the Triangle is, but we're nothing compared to Charlotte, Nashville, or Atlanta. In terms of square mileage, the Triangle's CSA is almost the same size as Charlotte's MSA (around 3500 square miles each). The Triangle's problem is that the urban cores are microscopic... the whole area is like a bunch of big suburbs. Perhaps this is why people unknowingly assume that the Triangle sprawls like no other.

Charlotte and Nashville both saw a decrease in MSA population (fewer counties counted in each), but Atlanta saw an increase in MSA. Which one do you think has the worst sprawl and traffic problem? :) Of course all three saw an increase in CSA population. Overnight Charlotte could be described as a place with over 2 million people.

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Well umm... that's like really how it works. Like for real. There's no "forcing" of anything involved and it isn't a conspiracy against the Triangle.

A metropolitan statistical area (MSA) is defined by commuters, and using the new definitions that were applied nationwide a few years ago, Raleigh and Durham were separated into their own MSAs. Greensboro and Winston-Salem were also separated. A lot of MSAs were seriously modified in size all over the country.

However the census bureau created the combined statistical area (CSA) which is defined using a much smaller slice of commuters, and it serves to show the bigger picture regarding economic dependence, etc. Raleigh and Durham are part of the same CSA, and indeed the population figure is larger than the old MSA I believe.

The CSA number describes a region just like the old MSA number did... perhaps even better than the old MSA number. Now the MSA number is much more functional and helps to describe the component nature of a region much more accurately. In the end, the same people live here and everywhere else... it is just a numbers game... but it is a numbers game played everywhere, so everyone is on equal footing.

All of these definitions are based on county lines. This is good and bad. If you want to see big population numbers, remember that everyone in Johnston County is included in Raleigh's MSA count even if they never go to Raleigh... that's just an example. However if you have a large central county and a minimal amount of sprawl leakage into surrounding counties by percentage, then those counties may not have the numbers to make it on the list.

The fact that Raleigh and Durham were split into separate MSAs is a good sign... it indicates that most of the population lives reasonably close to where they work, and that Triangle area sprawl doesn't penetrate too much into the surrounding area.

Everyone gripes about how sprawled the Triangle is, but we're nothing compared to Charlotte, Nashville, or Atlanta. In terms of square mileage, the Triangle's CSA is almost the same size as Charlotte's MSA (around 3500 square miles each). The Triangle's problem is that the urban cores are microscopic... the whole area is like a bunch of big suburbs. Perhaps this is why people unknowingly assume that the Triangle sprawls like no other.

Charlotte and Nashville both saw a decrease in MSA population (fewer counties counted in each), but Atlanta saw an increase in MSA. Which one do you think has the worst sprawl and traffic problem? :) Of course all three saw an increase in CSA population. Overnight Charlotte could be described as a place with over 2 million people.

Very cool information, Thank you! I didn't realize that there were many people out there that share the love of population statistics,(like myself). Especially for the Raleigh area!

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