Downtown Raleigh Condos

[Cary NC]

The land cost so much DT that the developer has to raise his prices to make a return on his investment, plus the cost of steel, concrete and other building materials has risen in the past year. That is why the prices are so high IMHO.

[nadcock]

The land cost so much DT that the developer has to raise his prices to make a return on his investment, plus the cost of steel, concrete and other building materials has risen in the past year. That is why the prices are so high IMHO.

Heard on NPR the other day that the cost of lumber was at an all time low for the past few years. Thats just lumber but they said that the rest of the construction materials could also see a dip...

[RaleighRob]

...but what about something that would bring a more conservative crowd downtown?

Not to start a flamewar, and certainly no offense to anyone, but why would we want that? Downtown (and Inside-The-Beltline-Raleigh, in general) is a liberal oasis in a county full of alot of conservative people. If I want to be around conservative people, I get heaping doses of it in North Raleigh, Cary, Garner, Wake Forest, Apex, Morrisville, HollySprings, etc.

Let us alternative folks keep our downtown...it's all we got.

Otherwise we'd hafta drive to Durham, Chapel Hill or Carrboro to get any culture.

[Raleigh Kid]

Not to start a flamewar, and certainly no offense to anyone, but why would we want that? Downtown (and Inside-The-Beltline-Raleigh, in general) is a liberal oasis in a county full of alot of conservative people. If I want to be around conservative people, I get heaping doses of it in North Raleigh, Cary, Garner, Wake Forest, Apex, Morrisville, HollySprings, etc.

Let us alternative folks keep our downtown...it's all we got.

Otherwise we'd hafta drive to Durham, Chapel Hill or Carrboro to get any culture.

I think you took what i said wrong i didn't mean to start a political war when i said conservative i didn't mean republican i meant conservative as in the type of people who don't drink and hang out at bars or go to clubs but the type of people who read or just like to eat. There aren't enough resturants downtown.

[cophead567]

i get what both of you (^ and ^^) are saying. of course its a different lifestyle when you compare living in suburban cart to living in or near downtown. some people choose one or the other so i think it'll naturally work out that people who want to take it easy, something less lively, will move to a quieter north raleigh, cary, etc community, while others (which i'm sure includes almost everyone on this forum) want to be around something livelier. i'm interested to know, are the people buying the downtown condos from the area moving downtown? or are they people that are re-locating, and choosing DT as their first choice in location?

DT is pretty much the cultural hub of the area, so the best way to attract more people and visitors is to go out and support it. support the music venues, go to the art shows, musuems, do what you can and as more people support it, it grows. more bars and restaurants are great, but i think people would go downtown for a restaurant as well as the downtown atmosphere, glenwood south being the perfect example, that street is ALIVE at night, especially on the weekends. i think its a slow process, but we'll see growth in all aspects DT.

i support it all

[RaleighRob]

I think you took what i said wrong i didn't mean to start a political war when i said conservative i didn't mean republican i meant conservative as in the type of people who don't drink and hang out at bars or go to clubs but the type of people who read or just like to eat. There aren't enough resturants downtown.

Well that's cool, I understand. I'm trying to think of a better word for it than conservative, but all I can come up with is "straight-laced" but that too has negative connotations. Man, we need a thesaurus.

[reed]

The Dawson does seem like a bad example beacause like the Hudson it is one of those projects that people are staying away from. I was looking into the RBC building and those units are already pretty much all reserved! Now I wonder how many of those reservations will stick and how many are actually people who are going to live there for a few years. I definately think there has been a lot of hype pushed by investors that has made the prices shoot through the roof and I agree that in comparison to other areas Raleigh really doesnt have that much going on in downtown proper. And not much is going to start happening if you don't provide housing opportunities for those hip young people that make a city move. On the current track we are going to have a bunch of well-to-dos that go to work and then come home to their plush condo...maybe go out to eat....but what else...

I am really interested to see if 712 Tucker can keep to its promise of those cheaper prices.

There are only 5 unsold units left in the Dawson. Most of these are the very large, expensive floor plans. There are a couple of additional units for sale, but they are currently lived in. Several units have already sold for the 2nd time, as some homeowners left town for work related relocations. Each unit that has been re sold has made a handsome profit. My next door neighbor paid a considerable amount above the original sale price less than six months after the building opened. And, a friend upstairs made over $20K on the sale of his condo after living there for less than a year.

The "loser floorplans," ie, the larger units that were split into smaller, more affordable ones, are almost (if not completely) full.

[dmccall]

The "loser floorplans," ie, the larger units that were split into smaller, more affordable ones, are almost (if not completely) full.

Thanks for the update!

[ChiefJoJo]

So long as there is growth in the area, you'd have to think there will be demand for DT condos, despite the increased supply coming online in the next 2 years or so. It's not just the current market but the projected market in 2-3 years when any new projects will be finished.

I was at a party on Sat night and told a woman that I lived DT, and she mentioned that so much was going on down here now and what a smart move it was for me... when I moved in 2 1/2 years ago into my tiny place, some people thought I was nuts, now everyone thinks I'm a genius for making the move. There is a tremendous difference in the perception of DT living compared to a couple of years ago, and I believe this will help translate into continuing demand for new condos.

The only negative for DT Raleigh is that the major employer, state govt, does not pay enough for most workers to afford to be close to their jobs. Now, if TTA were to be built, you'd have a guaranteed 20-30 min auto-less commute from DT Raleigh to RTP, and thousands of high-paying jobs.

[RaleighRob]

The only negative for DT Raleigh is that the major employer, state govt, does not pay enough for most workers to afford to be close to their jobs.

Exactly...I've been screaming this for five years now!

Build some big apartment buildings with modest rental rates and market them to the state government workers, you'd fill up in a minute!

Oh well. Maybe someday someone will listen.

[c_harmons]

The problem I think is landowners are buying the hype and raising their prices. Developers have to pass along that cost in the condos.

Only until the press starts admitting the downtown revival is rocky at best will people start to consider more reasonable prices.

Every week there is a new announcement, but we have to wait until we see which ones will really be built.

And I can tell you, not all of them will.

[Jones_]

pretty highrise skyscrapers (and a handful of certain realtors) are to blame for land prices being what they are. First Union and BB&T pay over a million an acre in 1991 and everyone holds out for their million an acre, even if it takes 15 years to get it. Five years ago Hudson was still around that price for the land but now with all teh public investment and places like teh Dawson kick starting things after the recession, prices are approaching 3 million an acre downtown. Downtown Raleigh bypassed organic growth in most corners, so no, you will never see new construction that gives both decent square footage and affordable rents that is not built by the City. There is likely already pressure for Capital Apartments, Cameron Court, Boylan Apartments, Grosvenor Gardens and Raleigh Apartments to undergo changes as their 550-650 a month per unit hardly seizes all the potential income that their land holds.

[RaleighRob]

There is likely already pressure for Capital Apartments, Cameron Court, Boylan Apartments, Grosvenor Gardens and Raleigh Apartments to undergo changes as their 550-650 a month per unit hardly seizes all the potential income that their land holds.

Oh dear lord no. The few places downtown that normal working people can actually afford! I certainly hope nothing happens to them...we need more places like those (although somewhat better maintained than a few of them are)...not less!

[reed]

Oh dear lord no. The few places downtown that normal working people can actually afford! I certainly hope nothing happens to them...we need more places like those (although somewhat better maintained than a few of them are)...not less!

Agreed.

I lived in Capital Apts years ago and absolutely loved the place. I do know that White Oak was considering turning the place into condos but decided that they wouldn't make enough profit after all the renovations required to get the place up to downtown "luxury" standards.

Also, the church next door bought the building years ago and would never give a straight answer regarding their future plans for the building. Some speculate that they might want to tear it down for expansion or additional parking.

[RaleighRob]

Also, the church next door bought the building years ago and would never give a straight answer regarding their future plans for the building. Some speculate that they might want to tear it down for expansion or additional parking.

I think that's a historic property though?? Tearing it down would certainly bring a good deal of protest from historical buffs, I would hope.

[reed]

I think that's a historic property though?? Tearing it down would certainly bring a good deal of protest from historical buffs, I would hope.

oh, definitely. It was built in 1917 I believe.

We had somewhat of a homeowner's association that would meet w/ them and they stated that they were looking at several possibilities for the site. This was 5 or 6 years ago, so I'm not sure what they've decided... although they have been making some improvements to the building, which is a good sign.

[Jones_]

Agreed.

I lived in Capital Apts years ago and absolutely loved the place. I do know that White Oak was considering turning the place into condos but decided that they wouldn't make enough profit after all the renovations required to get the place up to downtown "luxury" standards.

Also, the church next door bought the building years ago and would never give a straight answer regarding their future plans for the building. Some speculate that they might want to tear it down for expansion or additional parking.

White Oak....missing the ball yet again... Condos are fine (although I acknowledge the need for rental apartments too) and keeping them to 100-150k each would be preferred...who needs luxury? New cabinets, refinished floors and moldings. Maybe tighter windows and new HVAC....you're talking 15kish per unit, based on a friend of mine doing exactly that to a 1500 sqft house up in Franklinton.

[bullcity76]

The land cost so much DT that the developer has to raise his prices to make a return on his investment, plus the cost of steel, concrete and other building materials has risen in the past year. That is why the prices are so high IMHO.

Are land prices cheaper in Atlanta? The developers may be allowed to build taller to capture costs so why not here (Raleigh/Durham)? They have varying unit sizes...some smaller than 600-700 sq. ft 1BR and studios. I haven't seen that in projects here. The avg. prices are $200+ sq. ft. Some of the smaller units in ATL have "appreciated" to $140-160K. This is what gave Midtown Atlanta such an enormous population boost.

I think we get fed a lot of BS by our developers in the Triangle.

[ChiefJoJo]

Capital Apartments is actually where the party was on Saturday. Apparently you can rent a 1200 sf unit for around $800 or so--something like that. Ten foot ceilings (or so), hardwoods throughout... it's a great old building. I'd hate to see anything happen other than a minor refab with new fixtures, wiring, plumbing, paint, that type of thing.

[ncwebguy]

I know there aren't many condos there, but you can get a lot for your money on the east side of downtown. Sure most of that is investigated by the vice squad of RPD, but property values are a lot lower than the rest of ITB. People thought I was crazy five years ago for buying my house, some think I still am nuts, but I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. Someone drove by last night and asked my neighbor and I questions about the area.

You might need to put in some "elbow grease" bringing property up to code, but you end up with a house you feel a part of.

If anyone wants a tour, feel free to private message me. I'm not a real estate agent (or even know any), but like showing off the area.

[uptownliving]

A friend of mine used to live on the East Side of downtown...a block over from the Federal Courthouse in a nice restored home. Great place for parties and had no problem walking from his place to the bars and stuff downtown. All that is just memories now...he is out in Cary

[RaleighRob]

A friend of mine used to live on the East Side of downtown...a block over from the Federal Courthouse in a nice restored home. Great place for parties and had no problem walking from his place to the bars and stuff downtown. All that is just memories now...he is out in Cary

He left downtown for Cary?!?!?! Why in the....

Oh. Let me guess. He joined the "Married with Children" club?

[carynative]

Does anyone have any idea what a 100-200K condo would look like. i.e. how small would it be, would there be any ammentities, etc. ? I'm just wondering if they are so small that they'd be undesireable and therefore they aren't buidling them.

[RaleighRob]

Does anyone have any idea what a 100-200K condo would look like. i.e. how small would it be, would there be any ammentities, etc. ? I'm just wondering if they are so small that they'd be undesireable and therefore they aren't buidling them.

I guess alot would depend on the building...but we have so little in Raleigh at this time to really give us a good idea.

I think I saw online the Cotton Mill had a 880 sqft loft going for 189k.

There's a 985 sqft condo in Washington Square (just north of Glenwood South) at 188k.

To get any cheaper you have to go to the "outer rim" from downtown, like Cameron Village area...and even those are still in the upper 100s for the smaller units.

[Jones_]

Does anyone have any idea what a 100-200K condo would look like. i.e. how small would it be, would there be any ammentities, etc. ? I'm just wondering if they are so small that they'd be undesireable and therefore they aren't buidling them.

Martin Place (on Martin St) is fairly stripped down with no amenties except a garage has its smaller units around 160k (I want to say 900 sqft) and the larger 1200 sqft ones around 200k....could be slightly off on the prices (they were built in the year 2000) but they generally were around 160/sqft.