Traffic Congestion and Highway Construction

[urbanlover568]

Just now, QCxpat said:

Here's some data from RENT Cafe comparing Seattle rents with Charlotte rents:

Average rent in Seattle is $2,141 per month and average size of rental units is 697 square feet.

Average rent in Charlotte is $1,242 per month and average size of rental units is 944 square feet.

Due to the exorbitant cost of housing in Seattle, just 45% of residents own their homes, while in Charlotte 59% of residents own their homes.

Links:  

https://www.rentcafe.com/average-rent-market-trends/us/wa/seattle/

https://www.rentcafe.com/average-rent-market-trends/us/nc/charlotte/

 

I pay $1,300/mo. But you go by what rentcafe says  Seattle is densifying rather than suburban living explosion. People want urban lifestyles  here and that's what being built. Light Rail exploding everywhere in all directions. Seattle is by far a more bike friendly and transit city. I don't want to compare cities here really. Charlotte is great and awesome and can see why people want to live there. My choice was for a more urban lifestyle. But again,  Charlotte is getting there, just slower. 

[kermit]

4 hours ago, jednc said:

 Part of the reason we're being asked to double pay is because politicians keep dipping into the gas tax revenue.

for what? (other than transit which, in theory, keeps cars off the roads)

We are never going to move past cars (which seems kinda urgent) if every American is forced to subsidize them. We might actually be able to reduce our reliance on them if drivers paid the true cost of their two ton metal boxes (which includes road maintenance and construction as well as air quality, enforcement, the military cost of fuel, accident charges and the cost of real estate used to store those metal boxes free of charge when away from home. )

Schools are a public good (we all benefit from an educated population), we also all benefit from fire protection in the form of lower homeowners insurance rates. Roads benefit no one other than the people who drive on them. As people drive more, quality of life is diminished for everybody -- drivers need to pay to remediate that.

Edited September 4, 2019 by kermit

[SgtCampsalot]

3 hours ago, kermit said:

Roads benefit no one other than the people who drive on them. 

I have colleagues who always respond to this statement by saying that roads allow every single person with any kind of business to receive customers, shipments of goods, and their general livelihood. They let people get to their jobs and thus provide for their families. Roads are the life blood of our economy.

The system seems so entrenched I don't truly know how to respond to that.

Edited September 4, 2019 by SgtCampsalot

[kermit]

On 9/3/2019 at 10:52 PM, SgtCampsalot said:

I have colleagues who always respond to this statement by saying that roads allow every single person with any kind of business to receive customers, shipments of goods, and their general livelihood. They let people get to their jobs and thus provide for their families. Roads are the life blood of our economy.

The system seems so entrenched I don't truly know how to respond to that.

That is a mighty fine strawman they created. Nobody is suggesting we do away with cars, only that they pay their true costs.

We already have plenty of road capacity for deliveries -- as long as the deliveries are  not at rush hour. The success of businesses like Superica and Hawkers shows us that roads aren't necessary to get customers in some parts of town. I don't use a road to get to my job (along with about 25,000 other light rail riders). That sort of extremist "we gotta have roads to survive" talk is just empty hyperbole.

Granted there aren't many places in Charlotte where businesses can succeed without drivers (other than Southend or Uptown) but more transit certainly makes more of that possible. The claim that no businesses can be successful without roads (new or expanded or well maintained) is BS. 

Americans are generally unable and unwilling to imagine a world where they are not car dependent but there are plenty of examples which prove that it is possible -- even in Charlotte.

Edited September 5, 2019 by kermit

[KJHburg]

From yesterday hopped on the express lanes to beat some back up traffic then hopped back on the free lanes.   1st photo why I hopped on the express lanes for a couple of miles. 

[kickazzz2000]

I just wanted to come here to say, independence is so embarrassingly awful between Harris and 485.  What was the point of all that construction if were going to just sit on this mess?

[southslider]

^creates more demand for future toll lanes to be built as only option to bypass all those stop lights

[tozmervo]

6 hours ago, kickazzz2000 said:

I just wanted to come here to say, independence is so embarrassingly awful between Harris and 485.  What was the point of all that construction if were going to just sit on this mess?

Do you miss the days of sitting in mess from Sharon Amity to 485?

[davidclt]

On 9/6/2019 at 9:09 PM, KJHburg said:

From yesterday hopped on the express lanes to beat some back up traffic then hopped back on the free lanes.   1st photo why I hopped on the express lanes for a couple of miles. 

Don't forget, for HOV 3+, even if you don't have the pass with the HOV switch, there is an app you can download, NC Quick Pass HOV. Set it 15 minutes before you drive the HOV lanes to enable your vehicle for 3+ occupancy (based on transponder number) for:

• 1 hour
• 4 hours
• Rest of today
• Remaining weekdays the week
• The next 7 days

[Scribe]

On 9/7/2019 at 5:49 PM, kickazzz2000 said:

I just wanted to come here to say, independence is so embarrassingly awful between Harris and 485.  What was the point of all that construction if were going to just sit on this mess?

The old bridges right before CarMax need to be replaced in the next phase, so this section is going to get much worse before it gets better.

But, all that construction stopped just short of Harris Blvd, it used to go back all the way to Albermarle Rd.

[lit]

18 hours ago, Scribe said:

The old bridges right before CarMax need to be replaced in the next phase, so this section is going to get much worse before it gets better.

But, all that construction stopped just short of Harris Blvd, it used to go back all the way to Albermarle Rd.

There are plans out there somewhere to extend Harris along the creek behind the Honda dealership all the way to Village Lake. There will just be one interchange for Harris, Margaret Wallace, and Village Lake. This, of course, will destroy at least half of the Shopping Center across from Village Lake.

[Matthew.Brendan]

 

Something like this?

[tozmervo]

That's a bit different from the original CIP plans, which had Harris connecting across to Dwight Street - that can be seen on the UP development map. Connecting to Village Lake makes more sense to me. Is there a page with the Harris realignment?

[NCMike1990]

6 hours ago, tozmervo said:

That's a bit different from the original CIP plans, which had Harris connecting across to Dwight Street - that can be seen on the UP development map. Connecting to Village Lake makes more sense to me. Is there a page with the Harris realignment?

NCDOT has a page with maps here.

Harris realignment

 

[tozmervo]

Ah, no doubt Harris will traverse Campbell Creek with the grace of the Linville Viaduct.

[t_money]

I doubt this is the right topic but saw this article and thought it would be appreciated here.  Feel free to move it if needed.

https://geoffboeing.com/2019/09/urban-street-network-orientation/

Polar graphs of street network orietations.  Guess which city was 'least ordered/gridded'? 

Pretty interesting stuff with a link to the journal article that the data came from as well in the post.

 

Edit for typos

Edited September 11, 2019 by t_money

[southslider]

^See, Charlotte couldn't be any more different from Atlanta 

 

Edited September 11, 2019 by southslider

[KJHburg]

I don't understand that depiction of Atlanta streets.  They do not seem that gridded to me sure some are in midtown and downtown but everywhere else in the city they are like charlotte's 

Edited September 11, 2019 by KJHburg

[t_money]

The article does say it is city proper and not metro area, so that may have something to do with it?

[videtur quam contuor]

He posted it on his blog July of last year and it received quite some attention at that time and I posted it here, somewhere. His name Boeing makes it impossible to search for with the limited search function for this site. Boeing is everywhere in the results but as airplanes and such.

He has a great idea and it becomes understandable when one reads his methodology.

(It must be quite a life to have an extremely uncommon name but for one other person with worldwide historic fame to share it)

[jednc]

On 9/3/2019 at 7:11 PM, kermit said:

for what? (other than transit which, in theory, keeps cars off the roads)

We are never going to move past cars (which seems kinda urgent) if every American is forced to subsidize them. We might actually be able to reduce our reliance on them if drivers paid the true cost of their two ton metal boxes (which includes road maintenance and construction as well as air quality, enforcement, the military cost of fuel, accident charges and the cost of real estate used to store those metal boxes free of charge when away from home. )

Schools are a public good (we all benefit from an educated population), we also all benefit from fire protection in the form of lower homeowners insurance rates. Roads benefit no one other than the people who drive on them. As people drive more, quality of life is diminished for everybody -- drivers need to pay to remediate that.

There are so many people in America that just don't agree with this attitude about cars though. They would have to be the majority because even many who live in cities are very car oriented. If this is a cost that the majority of people are willing to bare, then it's a legitimate cost. For the record, I'm very pro-transit as an option, but I can't imagine not owning and driving a car. Still, if I had transit options to get to work and a majority of the places I need to go, I would use it very often. I guess I should also clarify, when I say transit, I mean trains.

I know this site attracts many who would wholeheartedly disagree with me, but this site really doesn't represent the mainstream attitudes of Americans. In some ways, that's a shame.

[kermit]

21 hours ago, jednc said:

There are so many people in America that just don't agree with this attitude about cars though. They would have to be the majority because even many who live in cities are very car oriented. If this is a cost that the majority of people are willing to bare, then it's a legitimate cost. 

Don’t agree with what attitude about cars? That they are massively subsidized or that they cause huge environmental and social impacts? 

Either way I would suggest that people need to understand these facts before they can form an opinion on them. It my experience that it’s only a  tiny portion  of Americans who have any idea that roads aren’t totally paid for with gas taxes or that the reason why  alternatives to auto-oriented suburb are expensive is largely because the must be built in an auto reliant way (parking minimums, suburban zoning, etc.).  We can’t begin to reduce auto dependence until people recognize its full costs. That isn't going to happen if we don't speak up and put these facts in people's faces.

I am honestly not trying to be dismissive of your perspective, just trying to discuss it. I appreciate your position and what you share here (there are not many Lake folks here). Having said that, how would we be better off if “UP” had more mainstream views?  I think one of the best things we (UP) has done is to illustrate how 95% of mainstream views are hostile to urbanism. Aren’t we all here to discuss the virtues of cities after all?

Edited September 12, 2019 by kermit

[nakers2]

17 hours ago, t_money said:

I doubt this is the right topic but saw this article and thought it would be appreciated here.  Feel free to move it if needed.

https://geoffboeing.com/2019/09/urban-street-network-orientation/

Polar graphs of street network orietations.  Guess which city was 'least ordered/gridded'? 

Pretty interesting stuff with a link to the journal article that the data came from as well in the post.

 

Edit for typos

Dammit you beat me to it. 

[Madison Parkitect]

17 hours ago, t_money said:

I doubt this is the right topic but saw this article and thought it would be appreciated here.  Feel free to move it if needed.

https://geoffboeing.com/2019/09/urban-street-network-orientation/

Polar graphs of street network orietations.  Guess which city was 'least ordered/gridded'? 

Pretty interesting stuff with a link to the journal article that the data came from as well in the post.

 

Edit for typos

Would have loved to see how he depicted Seattle's two twenty-degree turns in its grid.

[KJHburg]

Here is the widening starting on I-485 south with additional lane to Providence Rd in each direction and 1 express lane in each direction from 77 to US 74. 

This is near Rea Road today on I-485.

. https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/i-485-express-lanes/Pages/default.aspx