Historic Congaree Vista Developments

[CorgiMatt]

I'm not sure what stage of the architectural process the rendering with the gray color came from, but that most definitely is not anything like what the DDRC approved, and I was there. It has to be a prior rendition, the one the DDRC made them change.

[Captain Worley]

Does the current one look better? That gray thing is terrible looking. It looks like facade is peeling away.

[emerging.me]

Does the current one look better? That gray thing is terrible looking. It looks like facade is peeling away.

I give them props for trying to be a little edgy and modern -- the Vista really does need more things like that despite what the old-school design purists think -- but this just isn't the best design. It looks like some kind of concrete parasite has latched on to one side of the building.

Secondly, I would be thrilled if they built an aloft or an element hotel on Lady St. Both are excellent Starwood brands with COOL modern style! The bar at either would be a great hangout.

[krazeeboi]

Interesting, CorgiMatt. Someone might want to do a bit of investigating.

No thoughts on the parking garage? I know it isn't exactly a groundbreaking design, but it doesn't look horrible either.

[CorgiMatt]

With the version of the Miller-Valentine buidling rendering that was approved, glass replaces the gray stucco where the building overlooks the alley, and the upper two or three floors on the front are mostly glass with some brick work, and they seem to be set back even further.

From the pictures of the parking garage, assuming it is the rendering that was approved, I can't tell where the retail would be. Overall it looks a bit parking garage-ish to me, but I like the brick and the scale.

[krazeeboi]

Thanks for the info, Matt. That's actually good to know; I would much prefer to see something that emphasizes glass a bit more in its composition along Gervais.

As far as the garage goes, I believe the retail would be in the building adjacent to the garage in the last rendering.

[Spartan]

I like the Center Vista project. I can't see the front door on the street retail, but I assume thats just an issue with the rendering. It has a good scale and will fit in nicely with the Vista's theme, but still enough of a variety to prevent bordem ala-Cary, NC. The only problem I have with it is that I kinda of what to see a centerpiece to the Vista, or at least something that stands out as an icon. Right now the best example is the Adluh Flour building. I was hoping for something that people could perhaps relate to. There's still hope for the future though

As for that parking deck, who vomited up that design? Bricks are great, but where's the retail? Actually, which side is Lady and which side is Lincoln? I'm assuming that grey building is actually facing Lady St, with Lincoln runing along side to long part of the garage. This thing doesnt even attempt to blend in. Where are the lessons learned with the Five Points building on garage design? They could have at least taken a look at Greenville's Spring Street Garage with the Bookends on a mid-point between a fully enclosed garage and a partially concealed garage.

[emerging.me]

As for that parking deck, who vomited up that design? Bricks are great, but where's the retail? Actually, which side is Lady and which side is Lincoln? I'm assuming that grey building is actually facing Lady St, with Lincoln runing along side to long part of the garage. This thing doesnt even attempt to blend in. Where are the lessons learned with the Five Points building on garage design? They could have at least taken a look at Greenville's Spring Street Garage with the Bookends on a mid-point between a fully enclosed garage and a partially concealed garage.

So true! Who designs a parking garage that actually looks like a parking garage in this day and age? Definitely needs more of a pedestrian storefront emphasis.

[krazeeboi]

Spartan, the grey building faces Lady (which will be mixed-use), and the long part of the garage faces Lincoln. I would be nice to see the garage developed like other city garages, with retail space along the length of the garage; that would help to spread some of the activity in the Vista along a north-south axis. I do agree that somehow, it needs to be a bit more multi-use, but I don't think the design is awful. Let's face it, the Vista isn't deviating from the traditional, conservative brick theme anytime soon. I really do like the Spring Street garage in Greenville a great deal, but I think the city might think it a bit too "extragavant" for this section of the Vista. However, something like this on King Street in front of Marion Square in Charleston could work:

[Spartan]

Thats another good example, Krazee. That one has the retail and it the mixed use compenent that we should have in Columbia. But even that one has enough architectural detail to make it belnd in and not look like another boring parking garage (like the one on Queen St for example). Thats really what I like about the Spring Street garage in Greenville. Its still an obvious garage, but it looks nice and it looks unique. It doesn't matter what they do with this with regards to a mixed-use component. I just think that there is no excuse for such a generic parking garage design in the Vista (the arts district no less).

[krazeeboi]

^You have a point. This is from the description outlined on Quackenbush's (the architectural firm that designed this) website:

The City of Columbia selected a site for a new 650 car garage in the heart of the Vista. The garage will occupy the majority of the block, while a parcel along Lady Street will be available for future development. The garage design was strongly influenced by the "warehouse" context of the Vista and the efficiency and rhythm of the structural pre-cast concrete system. Thin brick inserts in the pre-cast panels recall the unique brick detailing of the surrounding historic buildings and provide pedestrian scale to the overall structure. The stair and elevator towers are unique elements on the garage corners along Lincoln Street.

I think that if the "windows" were done with a bit more flair, that might make this a bit more distinctive. I hope it turns out better once constructed.

[CorgiMatt]

Actually, I prefer the simplistic look. The window treatments on the Charleston garage pictured are too busy for my tastes, especially in historic Charleston. I like the columns, though. Architecture approved for the vista will recall what is there already, so don't expect things to get too far off the mark as far as simplistic vs. showy or opulent design is concerned.

Edited September 23, 2007 by CorgiMatt

[Spartan]

I just think there is a difference between simplistic and generic. You can have a simple design that is stil architecturally pleasing. This appears to lean towards generic. As always, I will wait for the final product before I decide what I really think about it. I'm just not very optimistic yet.

[krazeeboi]

I just sent out a few emails to get some further info on some stuff we've been discussing here.

I did find out that the Center Vista detailed renderings with the partial gray facade are indeed outdated. Not sure if any updated ones are available, but I did ask the developers; I'm waiting on a reply.

I expressed some of the concerns about the Lincoln Street garage aired here to Mayor Bob, specifically about the Lincoln Street side not have any retail spaces, and he said he'd look into it.

I also requested renderings of the SpringHill Suites at Lady and Huger from the Sree hospitality group.

[TheCarolinaKing]

cool...thanks

[Spartan]

Wow thanks for the leg work, Krazee!

[krazeeboi]

Yeah, I was bored and I really like renderings...LOL.

[krazeeboi]

Looking at the DDRC's agenda for this upcoming Tuesday, Oct. 2. it appears as though the design of the SpringHill Suites at Huger and Lady will be coming up for approval. It kind of threw me off, because it's listed as 1313 Pulaski on the agenda, but that tract is bounded by Pulaski to the east.

[waccamatt]

Looking at the DDRC's agenda for this upcoming Tuesday, Oct. 2. it appears as though the design of the SpringHill Suites at Huger and Lady will be coming up for approval. It kind of threw me off, because it's listed as 1313 Pulaski on the agenda, but that tract is bounded by Pulaski to the east.

Krazee, it's interesting that you posted that info this morning. On my way to work this morning, I noticed that land clearing had begun for the other hotel development on Huger Street at the corner of Richland Street near Riverfront Park. I'll keep everyone posted on the progress of that project.

[krazeeboi]

I'll hold you to that.

[krazeeboi]

Since extended-stay hotels typically adhere to suburban standards when it comes to architecture, I just thought that I'd browse the internet and see if any, in any city, had an urban form. The best I could find was the one coming to the Old Dominion University campus in Norfolk, and it's also a SpringHill Suites:

That would be a perfect fit for the Vista.

[krazeeboi]

OK, here are some renderings.

SpringHill Suites:

I like this. I wish it had an architectural feature that would give it some flair (like the corner feature in the rendering in the post above this one), but I like the overall design. It looks like something from DT Charleston.

Center Vista:

It looks like two different types of brick would be used here: one for the retail portion at the front, and one for the office portion. I also like the "glass wall" portion of the facade (looks MUCH better than the gray facade in the earlier renderings). All in all, a good fit for Gervais.

[mainstreeter]

OK, here are some renderings.

SpringHill Suites:

Center Vista:

Man - I think everything in the Vista is starting to look the same. I would like to see some flair - but the design group at the city might not accept that I guess?

Edited October 18, 2007 by krazeeboi

[Spartan]

I think that trying to remain a warehouse district in form (but not in function) limits much of the architectural possibilities in the Vista. The design standards have done a lot of good in the short term, but I wonder if in the long term they are going to limit potential opportunities?

[emerging.me]

I think that trying to remain a warehouse district in form (but not in function) limits much of the architectural possibilities in the Vista. The design standards have done a lot of good in the short term, but I wonder if in the long term they are going to limit potential opportunities?

I think the city and DDRC would be open to designs that are fresh and creative, yet in keeping with the Vista vibe... the problem is likely that there are so few developers around here that have the awareness, interest and ability to bring something truly cool to the table. It goes back to my constant complaint about how traditional everything is here.

Also... I do like that Springhill design. It's very clean and simple. Although I do wish the developers had gone with one of their original plans for an aloft there.

Edited October 18, 2007 by emerging.me