SkyHouse Charlotte, Publix and 10Tryon Tower in 4th Ward

[Niner National]

It has never left a bad impression on me. When I saw it for the first time I went home to research it. I thought it was cool.

[ah59396]

It has never left a bad impression on me. When I saw it for the first time I went home to research it. I thought it was cool.

Agreed. Tearing it down or even worse, renovating it, makes me think "lacks character" or "cookie cutter". I think it looks oddly medieval. Charlotte needs some weird.

[kermit]

I am also in the camp that says we are much better off with the burned shell than without. Wile I am a big fan of the McColl center I gotta say I miss the days when both buildings were burned shells -- it added a very picturesque foreground to the background of corporate blandness that is and was the skyline.

The other gut reaction I had to the burned shells was that they somehow (ironically) represented Charlotte's great potential.

[MilZ]

I think it would be a cool centerpiece for an uptown park... Something the general public could walk through. I doubt it moving it a couple blocks would be practical though.

[Guest]

I think it would be a cool centerpiece for an uptown park... Something the general public could walk through. I doubt it moving it a couple blocks would be practical though.

Would be cool if they used it like Squires Castle in Cleveland. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squire's_Castle

[CLTProductions]

Would be cool if they used it like Squires Castle in Cleveland. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squire's_Castle

Yeah except that is in a park, in the suburbs...this is downtown in what is a soon to be (hopefully), pretty built up and modern area.

Edited March 31, 2014 by Jayvee

[Guest]

Yeah except that is in a park, in the suburbs...this is downtown in what is a soon to be (hopefully), pretty built up and modern area.

Well aware of it, almost got married there. I mean as a microcosm.

[Dale]

Charlotte doesn't need another park Uptown. It just needs a river!

[dubone]

McColl center is an art community.  They have kept the burnt out parsonage as a memorial.    Not as interesting as memorials like in K-damm in Berlin but still more interesting and conversational than an asphalt lot.  

 

I do hope they eventually decide to rebuild a roof for it, though, and use it as facility space for the institute but tearing it down with out a plan for using the land for a better purpose would be absurd.

[DMann]

McColl center is an art community.  They have kept the burnt out parsonage as a memorial.    Not as interesting as memorials like in K-damm in Berlin but still more interesting and conversational than an asphalt lot.  

 

I do hope they eventually decide to rebuild a roof for it, though, and use it as facility space for the institute but tearing it down with out a plan for using the land for a better purpose would be absurd.

The real issue is that the space was too far removed from the church, and the space provided would have been too small to be useful.  There was initial talk of a Starbucks there, but the street walk up traffic would not support that location.

[New Name]

I think the narrative of the McColl center is priceless in Charlotte. Church-Fire-Abandoned-Rebuilt-Corporate Art. What could be more Charlotte?

[dubone]

Well, perhaps over time it will be a better location for a small out building.  With SkyHouse going in, the value of the location for retail is getting better.

 

It would be nice if they could do an art and wine and coffee bar like Twenty-Two in Midwood, to showcase some the artists but draw people as a bit of a destination location that is art- and culture-related.  I'm sure it's hard to overcome the initial construction and design costs unless they can trust that the market will be there.  

 

If Hal Marshall ever converts from county services and homeless central to a real development, it will help the market for retail in this area.   Until then, 1/2 the foot traffic will continue to be poor and homeless walking between the Wall and the freeway areas that are not as policed.

[CLTProductions]

If Hal Marshall ever converts from county services and homeless central to a real development, it will help the market for retail in this area.   Until then, 1/2 the foot traffic will continue to be poor and homeless walking between the Wall and the freeway areas that are not as policed.

This area just needs some serious rehab if they want to fill this building. I know it has been discussed on here before, but there is absolutely no way I am paying $1200+ for an apartment in this area. Surrounded by a sketchy motel, a dated looking old folks home, homeless people, etc....no way when I can spend the same and live at Post Gateway or Uptown

Edited March 31, 2014 by Jayvee

[atlrvr]

I have a strong suspicion that the motel will be demoed long before the first Skyhouse resident moves in.

[dubone]

This is all part of the transition at the edges.   A few blocks away in the direction of historic 4th Ward, you have a stable neighborhood where people easily pay 1200-2000, and homes are worth $0.5m and up.  In the direction of The Square on Tryon, you have very valuable commercial real estate and high value job centers and institutions.   This is a major project in my mind as it starts the process of investing to convert a bad area to better in conjunction with the building of the $1B transit line with a station in the area.  

 

Levine a major reason the area has been kept down, as his massive land area has been kept out of almost all proper urban land uses for decades.     The county has kept their land which is also detrimental to the area as it is a magnet for the poorest people who then mill around and damage property, litter, panhandle, etc.   

 

I still blame Levine, as it has been hard for the county to rally to sell the Hal Marshall land for much value with they are surrounded by desolation.   However, there is hope for development momentum shifting to this area.   But it requires all good news on all the fronts that are being rumored:

 

• Skyhouse will finish and begin leasing
• The Lynx 9th Street station will open, and the city will build more of 10th Street to connect it to the 1st and 4th Ward neighborhoods
• Levine needs to finally take his first baby-step into civilizing the asphalt desert wasteland with the park and apartment building he has committed to build, which seems more plausible lately than ever before.
• Grubb needs to close on the purchase and removal of the City (Days) Inn slum motel
• Grubb needs to bring some office jobs further north on Tryon with his spec office tower 

[CLTProductions]

I do agree that Skyhouse will absolutely be the first step in completely changing the area (and that we will see the slum motel be torn down before Skyhouse is done). I guess it is just going to be rough at first, and I hope that doesnt slow momentum to revive the area. Is there actually anything in the Hal Marshall Annex or is it just a bum hangout?

 

I do agree Levine definitely deserves a lot of the blame, but it looks like he is finally going to move in the right direction. I just don't understand that guy, he is almost universally hated, laughed at by citizens and the media for his horrible management, yet he still does nothing. I guess it is nice to have F U money.

 

 

I have a question: Is there a map I could look at that shows who owns what tracts of land uptown? I am not really familiar with just what Levine, etc... owns, and where exactly there is the worst crime/homeless population. Just not too familiar with that part of uptown. Judging by the fact there is basically NOTHING in the areas bordered by 7th, College, 11th and Caldwell, I will assume thats all Levine, but I really have no idea.

Edited March 31, 2014 by Jayvee

[MilZ]

 

 

I have a question: Is there a map I could look at that shows who owns what tracts of land uptown?.

http://polaris3g.mecklenburgcountync.gov/#/08002105

[CLTProductions]

http://polaris3g.mecklenburgcountync.gov/#/08002105

Thanks!

[dubone]

https://mapsengine.google.com/map/edit?mid=zFzxexr7Xo7I.koDBzwXlUTh4

 

I haven't used the new maps engine yet, so let me know if this is doesn't work.

 

 

Here is the land that Levine owns (9th Street Investors and 7th Street investors).  

 

The block I have drawn separately in white (9th-8th-Brevard-Caldwell) is currently owned by the county, but would be swapped for the park land once Levine builds it.  

 

Then the land in red is the county land called "Hal Marshall" that draws a lot of homeless to the neighborhood.  The county used to put on a big effort to sell it for a development project, but they never closed with their selected buyer because the financial crisis hit.  

 

You can see clearly what two entities are holding the area back considerably.  

[CLTProductions]

https://mapsengine.google.com/map/edit?mid=zFzxexr7Xo7I.koDBzwXlUTh4

 

I haven't used the new maps engine yet, so let me know if this is doesn't work.

 

 

Here is the land that Levine owns (9th Street Investors and 7th Street investors).  

 

The block I have drawn separately in white (9th-8th-Brevard-Caldwell) is currently owned by the county, but would be swapped for the park land once Levine builds it.  

 

Then the land in red is the county land called "Hal Marshall" that draws a lot of homeless to the neighborhood.  The county used to put on a big effort to sell it for a development project, but they never closed with their selected buyer because the financial crisis hit.  

 

You can see clearly what two entities are holding the area back considerably.  

Excellent thank you for this, yeah its terrible how bad this is. Really illustrates what a bum Levine is, it truly amazes me he continues to just sit on all this land. The apartments that are (supposedly) being built soon, those are going to be along the tracks, 9th, 11th and Brevard right??

Edited April 2, 2014 by Jayvee

[uptownliving]

I wholeheartedly agree that Skyhouse is going to be a catalyst for further development for N Tryon. Also remember that Center City Partners has brought together the North Tryon Planning Group that will bring this area to the attention of developers with hopefully a good plan.

 

Something however that is always going to be a challenge for this part of town is the homeless. The Urban Ministry Center (the homeless shelter and services center) is located here so the concentration of homeless is always going to be higher here than other parts of downtown. The redevelopment of the area will put more people on the streets so the homeless will become a smaller percentage as time goes on and not so obvious.....but they will still be there. They are not going away. So I hope this is something that is addressed in the North Tryon Planning Group.

[CLTProductions]

I wholeheartedly agree that Skyhouse is going to be a catalyst for further development for N Tryon. Also remember that Center City Partners has brought together the North Tryon Planning Group that will bring this area to the attention of developers with hopefully a good plan.

 

Something however that is always going to be a challenge for this part of town is the homeless. The Urban Ministry Center (the homeless shelter and services center) is located here so the concentration of homeless is always going to be higher here than other parts of downtown. The redevelopment of the area will put more people on the streets so the homeless will become a smaller percentage as time goes on and not so obvious.....but they will still be there. They are not going away. So I hope this is something that is addressed in the North Tryon Planning Group.

But isn't that a concern anywhere really? In any city, as development continues they just get pushed further out. That center is on the other side of the loop correct? Just will take a bit of time and better policing of the area. OR, is it possible to get the Center to move??? Could it be planned that a new center would be built somewhere else??

 

This is definitely a concern, and it will definitely be bad at first, but I think long-term it will be fine, hopefully....Greyhound doesn't help the situation either.

Edited April 2, 2014 by Jayvee

[nonillogical]

I don't think getting the Urban Ministry Center to move is realistic or a good idea, though we probably need another such center elsewhere too. It is functional in part because of its central location, and moving it out to a more suburban location will just diminish its effectiveness and keep many homeless sleeping on the street rather than there. Aside from being a bad move for helping the homeless, it would probably also be very bad PR for the city. Speaking from experience of living in Tryon House near the larger homeless gatherings at Hal Marshall, vs my experience in other larger cities, I don't think we have it that bad to be honest. I agree that getting more diverse development in the area and more foot traffic will make for less of a harsh divide and improve the perception of not just the area but the homeless too. 

[CLTProductions]

I don't think getting the Urban Ministry Center to move is realistic or a good idea, though we probably need another such center elsewhere too. It is functional in part because of its central location, and moving it out to a more suburban location will just diminish its effectiveness and keep many homeless sleeping on the street rather than there. Aside from being a bad move for helping the homeless, it would probably also be very bad PR for the city. Speaking from experience of living in Tryon House near the larger homeless gatherings at Hal Marshall, vs my experience in other larger cities, I don't think we have it that bad to be honest. I agree that getting more diverse development in the area and more foot traffic will make for less of a harsh divide and improve the perception of not just the area but the homeless too. 

Yeah i was more or less kidding about moving the center. And having been to most major cities in the U.S. Charlotte's homeless population is not bad AT ALL, you cant walk a block in Cleveland without passing at least 2

[MazzoMedia]

oh how exciting, the first crane just arrived at Skyhouse!  checkout their webcam.