SkyHouse Charlotte, Publix and 10Tryon Tower in 4th Ward

[js4life]

IMO Publix & HT can survive uptown. The only thing I don't see is a 40,000 ft store, especially since Publix will have a store in SouthEnd & HT is going in the redeveloped Segefield center & both will have easy access via the Blue line. Whole Foods at Cresent makes more sense to me because it would likely pull from a wider demo & is far enough away from it's other locations

[Dale]

On a side-note: does Charlotte have more grocery store chains than any other city in the US ? It's amazing, the variety.

[Guest]

On a side-note: does Charlotte have more grocery store chains than any other city in the US ? It's amazing, the variety.

Probably not. There are plenty of places with more variety. 

 

I have to ask though, and I asked this in a different forum but...

 

After The Colony, The SkiSlope Church Redevelopment and the Trinity Partners project are completed SouthPark will have the following grocery stores in a mile radius. 

 

* Flagship Harris Teeter

* Flagship Publix

* A Southern Season

* Earthfare 

* Whole Foods 

* Reid's 

Not to mention the other grocery stores within a 2 mile radius.

 

So why so much panic for 3 grocery stores downtown. 

Edited December 23, 2014 by Guest

[nonillogical]

Probably not. There are plenty of places with more variety. 

 

I have to ask though, and I asked this in a different forum but...

 

After The Colony, The SkiSlope Church Redevelopment and the Trinity Partners project are completed SouthPark will have the following grocery stores in a mile radius. 

 

* Flagship Harris Teeter

* Flagship Publix

* A Southern Season

* Earthfare 

* Whole Foods 

* Reid's 

Not to mention the other grocery stores within a 2 mile radius.

 

So why so much panic for 3 grocery stores downtown. 

When I visit my family in Cary I always marvel at how most intersections have at LEAST 2 grocery stores, but some have 4, one on each corner. Surprisingly, they are almost always busy. Not saying this is a good thing at all because I actually find it a little disturbing, just provides some perspective. 

 

And to the point about variety, we didn't really have any to speak of until Publix started coming to town, we were completely dominated by HT. The Triangle has every chain we have plus Kroger, Lowes Foods, a few Winn Dixies still I think, a lot more Whole Foods and Fresh Markets, and generally nicer Food Lions that can compete with the HT/Publix/Lowes tier. 

[15895]

So is Publix actually interested or are the developers just trying to recruit Publix? Hopefully our retail czar can assist in making it happen.

If Publix does build, I hope it has a balcony like the Plaza-Midwood Harris Teeter. That way the office workers have somewhere nice to sit & eat.

I wonder what retail the actual skyhouses on Church can support assuming Publix gets built. I'd guess nothing to exciting: fast food, restaraunt, dry cleaners.

[Dale]

On further thought, can't imagine any city topping CLT for variety. Off the top of my head: HT, Publix, Lowes, Fresh Market, Food Lion, Trader Joe's, Food Lion, Aldi's, Bi-Lo. Again, just off the top of my head. I lived in LA for a brief spell and they had basically three chains out there.

[tozmervo]

With nearly a quarter of local marketshare, you left out the biggest grocer of them all  

[Dale]

With nearly a quarter of local marketshare, you left out the biggest grocer of them all

 

I was deathly afraid there would be a geek explosion if I did that.

[unccmyway]

On further thought, can't imagine any city topping CLT for variety. Off the top of my head: HT, Publix, Lowes, Fresh Market, Food Lion, Trader Joe's, Food Lion, Aldi's, Bi-Lo. Again, just off the top of my head. I lived in LA for a brief spell and they had basically three chains out there.

Can't forget Whole Foods and Earth Fare.

[js4life]

South Charlotte has one if the highest median income areas in the southeast & has shown it can support all these stores. I don't see HT building a large store even if Publix does simply because the PM,Myers Park, Dilworth & Sedgefield stores are accessible to many of the neighborhoods close to Uptown. Now I could see them put another express store in NoDa

[atlrvr]

Though I still think a smaller format is what makes sense for this site, given the high-rise boom in 3rd ward, I do think getting a grocer at this site will become an imporant differentiator.

 

While I believe the urban migration trend is real, and demand is deep....The Bearden, Catalyst, Element, and Mint Tower as well as the mid-rises going up there are really forming a neighborhood, while Skyhouse is really on the edge.  A grocery at Skyhouse would go a long way in making that project highly competitive.

 

I do think BofA will sell their land behind Dance Theatre in the next couple of years if the economy can maintain and these projects continue to be successful, though I wouldn't mind seeing another mid-rise condo project like 400 N Church on that block. 

 

I believe the long term plan for the Dance Theatre is to develop a bigger staging area as an addition on the rear, but still 1/2 the block would be available for other development.

[Spartan]

The only people who will shop at a grocery store on N. Tryon are people who live at Lake Norman and drive north from uptown and Third/Fourth Ward residents-the same people who already shop at Harris Teeter. There isn't enough business for both.

I don't think that the uptown employment numbers have hit 100k yet.

How do suburbanites really shop for groceries though? I feel like people tend to drive to and use stores that are geographically closer to their home. Unless it's more of a destination place like Whole Foods it doesn't make sense that North Meck commuters would start using that store all the time.

I think the rapid population increase in and around uptown is enough to justify more grocery stores on its own. The trend will definitely continue even if there is a bubble burst on apartments. People want to live in center city and there is a crapload of room to grow. Even if there isn't enough to support two stores today, there will be eventually.

On a side-note: does Charlotte have more grocery store chains than any other city in the US ? It's amazing, the variety.

South Charlotte has variety.

When I visit my family in Cary I always marvel at how most intersections have at LEAST 2 grocery stores, but some have 4, one on each corner. Surprisingly, they are almost always busy. Not saying this is a good thing at all because I actually find it a little disturbing, just provides some perspective.

And to the point about variety, we didn't really have any to speak of until Publix started coming to town, we were completely dominated by HT. The Triangle has every chain we have plus Kroger, Lowes Foods, a few Winn Dixies still I think, a lot more Whole Foods and Fresh Markets, and generally nicer Food Lions that can compete with the HT/Publix/Lowes tier.

Yeah but in Cary there are like 3 intersections due to the fact that the entire city is cul-de-sacs and collector streets.

[dubone]

So is Publix actually interested or are the developers just trying to recruit Publix? Hopefully our retail czar can assist in making it happen.

If Publix does build, I hope it has a balcony like the Plaza-Midwood Harris Teeter. That way the office workers have somewhere nice to sit & eat.

I wonder what retail the actual skyhouses on Church can support assuming Publix gets built. I'd guess nothing to exciting: fast food, restaraunt, dry cleaners.

 

So far it has not ever been confirmed that Publix is interested, only that Grubb was trying to pitch them on coming here.   

 

With Levine's involvement with Publix, I feel like he will ride in like a Knight of Ni and 'ni' the whole thing and it will get scuttled.   He will of course want them to build a Publix on his First Ward land and then fail at it, and Grubb will end up like he did in Elizabeth Ave, with nothing, despite initial interest and discussions with a grocer. 

[Prodev]

I had heard that Publix was taking the deal through their real estate committee a few weeks ago, but I don't know what the outcome of that was. The are planning their new 20k urban format and the parking will be shared with the Skyhouse deck. 

[go_vertical]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned much is that grocers aren't as concerned with nearby population numbers on opening day as much as they are concerned with them more like 3 to 5 years down the road. Usually when a new supermarket opens up there is a "honeymoon" period so to speak. Some people may drive past their usual store to check out the new guy in town thus resulting in slightly inflated sales. It isn't uncommon for sales to take a year or more to normalize to something they can comfortably project. Remember, a grocery store is a 20-30 year investment at least.

So, even if a Publix isn't announced until the first of the year then we could comfortably say a mid to late 2016 opening. A year-ish of settling into the neighborhood and that puts us around late 2017. Now it isn't so far fetched to think Publix would be more concerned about where the 'hood is in 2019/2020. By this time Skyhouse 2 is done and Levine' apartments, God willing, are in full swing not to mention anything that may pop up between now and then.

[DCMetroRaleigh]

So true, Whistle. Just remember that Harris Teeter opened 5 years ago in DC's NoMa neighborhood when that area was undeveloped and underpopulated. At that time, people wondered if NoMa could support such a large grocery store that catered to more affluent shoppers than the historic demographics of that area. Five years later, HT is the centerpiece of one of the fastest growing and developing urban neighborhoods in the country, and HT is credited as having foresight to get there before everyone else.

[CLTProductions]

http://m.bizjournals.com/charlotte/print-edition/2014/12/19/grocers-lining-up-for-locations-market-share.html

Our collab with biz journal continues

[15895]

http://m.bizjournals.com/charlotte/print-edition/2014/12/19/grocers-lining-up-for-locations-market-share.html

Our collab with biz journal continues

It's a subscriber article. The bit I read has nothing to do specifically with Skyhouse

[CLTProductions]

Tying it into the grocery discussion. That doesn't have much to specifically do with Skyhouse either. Just the land

[15895]

Tying it into the grocery discussion. That doesn't have much to specifically do with Skyhouse either. Just the land

I'm sorry if I'm being slow... Did the article mention Anythin specific about the land or was it something minor like a hyperlink "We mentioned last summer Publix was looking into Grubb's Skyhouse property on North Tryon"?

Edit: Or did the article mention anything about any potential or existing uptown grocers? Maybe it's time a cave in and just subscribe...

Edited December 26, 2014 by AirNostrumMAD

[HopHead]

If you look at the webcam now, you can see that the Days Inn is nothing but a little bit of rubble. You can also see how big that partially underground parking deck is going to be. Yea, they definitely needed to get rid of that thing. 

 

http://oxblue.com/open/SkyHouseApartments

[ArtieP]

Skyline with Skyhouse (north end)

[15895]

Skyline with Skyhouse (north end)

Great view! Skyhouse has a big impact on he silhouette here

[HopHead]

Random question about SkyHouse... Does anyone know if Novare has stopped with building any new Skyhouse apartment towers? Outside of the rumored Tower 2 here and the one in Nashville they seemed to of stopped with announcing more new buildings. Personally, I'm far more excited about the other towers here like the Mint and Bearden projects that will be breaking ground soon, so I'm not necessarily worried about Skyhouse 2. Just curious if they were going down the path of a different model...

[Guest]

Random question about SkyHouse... Does anyone know if Novare has stopped with building any new Skyhouse apartment towers? Outside of the rumored Tower 2 here and the one in Nashville they seemed to of stopped with announcing more new buildings. Personally, I'm far more excited about the other towers here like the Mint and Bearden projects that will be breaking ground soon, so I'm not necessarily worried about Skyhouse 2. Just curious if they were going down the path of a different model...

Its been since September when Skyhouse Main was announced for Houston.