Charotte 8th Most Dangerous city for Violent Crime in USA

[monsoon]

Why was my post deleted?

The thread title (and many of the articles in the press) portray Charlotte as the 8th worst in absolute terms, when a closer look reveals that Charlotte is 8th worst in it's own arbitrarily defined category of cities >500K.

[monsoon]

..... I don't know the answer, someone help, but I wonder what these same stats would tell if you considered metro areas and not city limit cores.

[dubone]

I think the higher crime in Charlotte is starting to ring true for me. Crime has increased quite a bit uptown in recent months and years. I am starting to think that the management is partly to blame, and there should conceivably be an outcry to change the police commissioner.

There is also a major shift happening culturally. I think certain demographic segments are having serious problems raising their children. The school system issue and the crime issue seem to be related in this way, as certain neighborhoods create both criminal teenagers, and illiterate teenagers, who create discipline and test score issues for the schools which happen to pull them in. I have zero solutions to this problem, but it seems cultural to me, where there is almost a loss of recognition for what is bad behavior. My wife is a teacher, and she'll call some parents about how it is unacceptable that their child is swearing at the teachers and peers every day. And the parents don't even agree or see any problem with it, and get mad that their kids are disciplined (ie. kicked out of class) for it. That hateful and disrespectful behavior always escalates and I think is a precursor to the criminal behavior.

I must say, social problems aside, there is an issue that has come up in many recent crimes downtown that I know of. That problem is the lack of prosecutors. The police will arrest a criminal for commiting some serious robbery or theft, but they will be back on the streets that night and never be charged with the crime because there aren't enough prosecutors. Those same people that prey on certain neighborhoods never get punished, even if they are arrested. This tends to create some apathy among the police, in my view, and certainly more resolve by the criminals. So while I think there is some terrible parenting going on, we ought to have enough DAs to throw the bad parents' children into jail for their actions.

Also, some of the hedging that people are doing, about the actual ranking and city limits and all that don't ring true to me. The comparisons to Raleigh's metro are fair, and these are hard facts of actual crimes. There isn't much fluff here, or funny stats from what I can see. Raleigh has less crime. Why? We really need to figure that out, or all the other investments in this city will go to waste.

If my family is ever made victims of a serious crime, I'm outta here.

[browngeo]

I can't agree more with what you posted Dubone...

Well written, very well written.

[davidals]

I think the higher crime in Charlotte is starting to ring true for me. Crime has increased quite a bit uptown in recent months and years. I am starting to think that the management is partly to blame, and there should conceivably be an outcry to change the police commissioner.

There is also a major shift happening culturally. I think certain demographic segments are having serious problems raising their children. The school system issue and the crime issue seem to be related in this way, as certain neighborhoods create both criminal teenagers, and illiterate teenagers, who create discipline and test score issues for the schools which happen to pull them in. I have zero solutions to this problem, but it seems cultural to me, where there is almost a loss of recognition for what is bad behavior. My wife is a teacher, and she'll call some parents about how it is unacceptable that their child is swearing at the teachers and peers every day. And the parents don't even agree or see any problem with it, and get mad that their kids are disciplined (ie. kicked out of class) for it. That hateful and disrespectful behavior always escalates and I think is a precursor to the criminal behavior.

I must say though, that social problems aside, there is an issue that has come up in many recent crimes downtown that I know of. That problem is that there are not enough prosecutors. That means, the police will arrest a criminal for commiting some serious robbery or theft, but they will be back on the streets that night and never be charged with the crime because there aren't enough prosecutors. That means, those same people that prey on certain neighborhoods never get punished, even if they are arrested. This tends to create some apathy among the police, in my view, and certainly more resolve by the criminals. So while I think there is some terrible parenting going on, we ought to have enough DAs to throw the bad parents' children into jail for their actions.

Also, some of the hedging that people are doing, about the actual ranking and city limits and all that don't ring true to me. The comparisons to Raleigh's metro are fair, and these are hard facts of actual crimes. There isn't much fluff here, or funny stats from what I can see. Raleigh has less crime. Why? We really need to figure that out, or all the other investments in this city will go to waste.

If my family is ever made victims of a serious crime, I'm outta here.

[dubone]

Just to be clear, though, the demographics are a bit of a mystery to me. It is way beyond the simplistic racial correlation. I feel like the demographics might have more to do with absent fathers, parental drug users, parents without any college education, etc. It may be that in this region there are more blacks that fit those categories, as there is definitely a correlation between predominantly black neighborhoods and crime. But I definitely don't perceive this to be a racial problem, but rather some other more complex cultural or demographic issue. So I'm not trying to be politically correct but rather more precise.

[cinco]

very nice points by all.

here's the deal in charlotte... this police chief's time is up - he needs to go. we need someone more agressive in that position as well as harder prosecution. i was estatic to hear about CMPD public relations guy, keith bridges, decided to resign this past summer. i had the misfortune to talk with him one time and was met with one of the most defensive public persons i've spoken with.

in the blog that metro posted is a thug who has been terrorizing a neighborhood for years, he was even charged with a murder and let go... that guy should be rotting in prison at this moment. he reigns in the belmont neighborhood, which unfortunately is plagued with crime... even as some are trying desperately to turn the area around. i have often wondered why the CMPD doesn't locate a huge precinct right in the heart of belmont... ? it seems that would be a start in disrupting the criminal flow... @ least in e. charlotte. the police presence in many areas is weak.

i'm pretty charged up... i'm going to send some letters of discontent tomorrow.

[monsoon]

I don't think the problem lies as much with enforcement (police) as it does prosecution (court system). I think the police in this city do a pretty good job, but that job, as Dubone pointed out, is negated when the courts choose to drop the case and/or let people out of prison early. I think the focus should be more on Peter Gilcrist, the district attorney, who ultimately decides which crimes get punished in this county.

[browngeo]

It appears to be a three headed problem with the police, prosecution, and lack of self responsibility from both parents and children in some of these neighborhoods.

I don't know the actual numbers but compared to the other cities that I have spent considerable time in - Chicago, Indy, San Fran, Phoenix there just seems to not be enough police in this city. At first I thought it was Ok because Charlotte has a small town feel that seemed very safe but after back-to-back 4th of July festivities, a car jacking on our street, and latest crime ranking, I begining to think the city is really understaffed.

[cinco]

I don't think the problem lies as much with enforcement (police) as it does prosecution (court system). I think the police in this city do a pretty good job, but that job, as Dubone pointed out, is negated when the courts choose to drop the case and/or let people out of prison early. I think the focus should be more on Peter Gilcrist, the district attorney, who ultimately decides which crimes get punished in this county.

[monsoon]

In line with the lack of good parenting comments made above, it appears an adult was assaulted today in Wilson Middle School. Information here.

[Miesian Corners]

Morgan-Quitno is widely criticized for putting dangerous crimes such as rape and murder in with car break-ins and more minor crimes, then dividing and doing a simplistic comparison with other cities. Most criminal justice demographers don't agree with MQ studies and say that their methodology in all of their products is seriously flawed.

Case in point, in their Smartest States study, Tennessee rose 11 places in 2005. Did the state suddenly have an influx of PhDs? How does the level of education change that drastically in one year?

Does that mean Charlotte is a safe city? No, but I certainly don't think its more dangerous than Houston or Jacksonville. What's really funny is that in terms of metro areas, Morgan Quinto says that Florence and Myrtle Beach (SC) are more dangerous than Miami-Dade and the Charlotte-Gastonia-Concord MSA.

[dubone]

Even if the MQ methodology is not properly reflective of Truth, it can at least be considered to be internally consistant for some value in comparisons. If the minor crimes are included, then they are included for all the cities. I doubt the reality is that Raleigh has more serious crimes, but less total crime. The comparison should still be cause for serious civic introspection.

Either way, our city was just on national spotlight for being a dangerous city. That will hurt perception in a world where these types of studies spur break-room discussions that affect people's choices on where to live. I can see a conversation where people say, I should leave Philadelphia because of the crime, and maybe join some friends that are moving to Charlotte. But after seeing that Charlotte is on the top X list for crime risk, they might reconsider.

[Miesian Corners]

^I don't know dub, Miami is still booming...so are Nashville, Dallas, Washington, Atlanta, and Myrtle Beach.

Their methodology makes no sense. How can we be in the top 10 in cities over 500,000, yet we don't make the top 25 overall (but Orlando and Cincinnati are in the top 25 of most dangerous and they both have populations of 100,000-499,000 yet don't show up in that particular list)?

[uptownliving]

I don't think the problem lies as much with enforcement (police) as it does prosecution (court system). I think the police in this city do a pretty good job, but that job, as Dubone pointed out, is negated when the courts choose to drop the case and/or let people out of prison early. I think the focus should be more on Peter Gilcrist, the district attorney, who ultimately decides which crimes get punished in this county.

[kickazzz2000]

^I don't know dub, Miami is still booming...so are Nashville, Dallas, Washington, Atlanta, and Myrtle Beach.

Their methodology makes no sense. How can we be in the top 10 in cities over 500,000, yet we don't make the top 25 overall (but Orlando and Cincinnati are in the top 25 of most dangerous and they both have populations of 100,000-499,000 yet don't show up in that particular list)?

[Miesian Corners]

^That's not what I'm saying. I can't figure out why smaller cities are in the top 25 most dangerous overall, but Charlotte which is listed so high as a city with more than 500K, isn't in the list of the top 25.

[bhcharlotte]

There is definately something off with these statistics, besides the fact certain cities didn't participate such as Chicago (sure there are others). Anyway Charlotte Meck. is a sprawling area not a centralized population they probally included commercial thefts, breakins etc. one of charlottes most common crimes b/c of all the construction. anyway lived here my entire life, uptown 90% of the time, very rare to feel threatened at all ***EL Paso was one of the safest yet what 20% of america's drug supply slips thru there, dosen't seem right? As someone else pointed out, been to Jacksonville Fl. numerous times and have yet to find a relatively "safe" area yet it makes top 10 (safest) on the same list, nah

[monsoon]

^That's not what I'm saying. I can't figure out why smaller cities are in the top 25 most dangerous overall, but Charlotte which is listed so high as a city with more than 500K, isn't in the list of the top 25.

[peaceloveunderstanding]

Charlotte's metro crime rate is also pushed up by Gastonia. That city has a surprising amount of crime for its size.

Gastonia, a city of 67,000, in 2004, had:

7 homicides

40 Rapes

273 Robberies

427 Assaults

1,258 Burglaries

4,600 Thefts

548 Auto Thefts

---

There seems to be a trend in this thread to deny that Charlotte has a crime problem. It does indeed have a problem, and while the violent crime is mostly limited to select regions, and demographics, it's imperative that something be done. First, an accountable police chief needs to be brought it. Second, community policing needs to be abandoned. Third, we need to optimize, add judges, add prosecutors to the courts system. Finally, we need to arrest and imprison for small offenses, like graffiti or vandalism - nail the career criminals before they do something that results in the death, or injury, of an innocent.

[Vitamin_N]

I don't think the problem lies as much with enforcement (police) as it does prosecution (court system). I think the police in this city do a pretty good job, but that job, as Dubone pointed out, is negated when the courts choose to drop the case and/or let people out of prison early. I think the focus should be more on Peter Gilcrist, the district attorney, who ultimately decides which crimes get punished in this county.

[Neo]

There is also a major shift happening culturally. I think certain demographic segments are having serious problems raising their children. The school system issue and the crime issue seem to be related in this way, as certain neighborhoods create both criminal teenagers, and illiterate teenagers, who create discipline and test score issues for the schools which happen to pull them in. I have zero solutions to this problem, but it seems cultural to me, where there is almost a loss of recognition for what is bad behavior. My wife is a teacher, and she'll call some parents about how it is unacceptable that their child is swearing at the teachers and peers every day. And the parents don't even agree or see any problem with it, and get mad that their kids are disciplined (ie. kicked out of class) for it. That hateful and disrespectful behavior always escalates and I think is a precursor to the criminal behavior.

My wife is also a teacher and regularly talks about how a student/teacher conference got nowhere. The parents seem to think she is out of line for disciplining the kid (6th grade). It is evident that many of these kids grow up without discipline at home and simply turn to crime, or rather grow up thinking it is the norm. Perhaps this is more evident in Charlotte due to the appearance of the state of CMS. Perhaps parents no longer trust CMS to handle a situation and completely disregard any attempt in doing so.

Or perhaps it has spun out of control and we simply have enough population of those who could care less about turning away from crime and trying to be an example to the community of how much good can come from society.

[Neo]

I don't think the problem lies as much with enforcement (police) as it does prosecution (court system). I think the police in this city do a pretty good job, but that job, as Dubone pointed out, is negated when the courts choose to drop the case and/or let people out of prison early. I think the focus should be more on Peter Gilcrist, the district attorney, who ultimately decides which crimes get punished in this county.

I think you hit the nail on the head. It is most definately an issue witht he court system much more than with the enforcement of the laws. If the court system will simply let a case go then why bother with the enforcement? It isn't the enforcement that offered the opportunity for the 42 arrests for this one guy but the court system that allowed it to happen.

Unfortunately "life in prison" is not truly life in prison. You could commit murder in broad daylight and make a deal with the DA to lessen the consequences. This country doesn't make deals with terrorists so why should we make deals with people in our own country who do much of the same crimes? If you murder, assist in murder, rape, etc. there should be absolutely no deal and life in prison should be just that, LIFE in prison.

All over this country young people are seeing that they can literally get away with murder so it is a viable option for them. It is unfortunate but very true, and it is one of the biggest issues plaguing this country to date.

[Charlotte_native]

Just to be clear, though, the demographics are a bit of a mystery to me. It is way beyond the simplistic racial correlation. I feel like the demographics might have more to do with absent fathers, parental drug users, parents without any college education, etc. It may be that in this region there are more blacks that fit those categories, as there is definitely a correlation between predominantly black neighborhoods and crime. But I definitely don't perceive this to be a racial problem, but rather some other more complex cultural or demographic issue. So I'm not trying to be politically correct but rather more precise.

[SmellyCat]

Unfortunately, ignorant people usually breed ignorant children. And what's worse is, you can't reason with an ignorant person (parent) because there's no way to make them understand. Unless, perhaps, you use puppets and crayons to drive your point home. And even that's a longshot.