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The skyline thread


Flash

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I was there for the implosion of that bldg many years ago--too bad FCB didn't decide to rebuild there. My understanding is that Progress' second bldg would be right across Davie St where Cooper's BBQ is located and NOT in the old FCB location. I believe Progress owns the Coopers Bldg, etc., and may decide to build in the not too distant future.

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Is there a rendering of this once planned FCB building somewhere on this website? With all of this discussion about this rendering, it would be great to actually see what we never got!

It definately is sad to see that such a beautiful, historic midrise is gone from that location. It's depressing to walk by and see an unused grassy area.

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Is there a rendering of this once planned FCB building somewhere on this website?  With all of this discussion about this rendering, it would be great to actually see what we never got! 

It definately is sad to see that such a beautiful, historic midrise is gone from that location.  It's depressing to walk by and see an unused grassy area.

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There are pictures available here: Flash's site

I agree...that historic building was beautiful. I actually believe that there is still room for another 30 story skyscraper in Raleigh (in addition to 301 Hillsborough). It's just a matter of time before it is built.

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Considering Charlotte is a medium sized skyline, Id call it a boom. There are 16 and 36 story towers u/c with another 28 story one about to break ground. Im sure most of the additional proposals will happen, but 1 or 2 could fall through the cracks.

Living in Raleigh for a year now, I'd say the culture of development here is changing rapidly enough that we will see continued, sustained, high rise development...even if its a fairly slow pace The City is backing a 16 story hotel, which isnt bad at all. The Quorum Center met practically no resistance. What the skyline needs though, its a large corporate office tower to really make a big impact. Two Progress Plaza's location hinders it from really standing out.

Raleighs ace card will end up being density, not huge highrises.

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Raleighs ace card will end up being density, not huge highrises.

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Yes, that is why as much as part of me hurts to say this on some level, I see a 32+ story Reynolds Tower at 301 Hillsborough St way out of place there. Towers above say 20-25 stories need to be near the urban core (close to Fay St./Wilmington St./Salisbury St/Davie St/Martin St area) and there are several sites that would work very well for that purpose. We should be building more low (5-8) and midrise (10-20) buildings DT to increase residential population and density to fill in alot of the empty parking lots we have.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hey sorry I never noticed this thread...

Forumer Raleigh-NC had a poster that he received from another forumer of the FC proposal that I took several pictures of. Then I adapted the perspective of the building to various vantages to fit in.

Raleighmark, where did you aquire that old picture? Its quite amazing and disappointing that building wasn't kept, especially since First Citizens chose Hammond Road.

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I just wanted to pass along a link to an article from this mornings News and Observer about the proposed 40 story building at Crabtree and the 32 story Reynolds building.

While I am excited about the Reynilds building, I think that the Crabtree plan seems a bit over the top. 40 stories seems a bit much for this part of town and trying to sell 40 to 60 condos, priced at $800,000 to $3 million, seems like a reach. Supposedly 10 are already presold (halfway to 20 which is required for him to get funding.) I would guess he has presold these to himself and few buddies so the true viability of these condos is unknown.

According to the N&O, Reynolds has said he needs to pre-lease half the 150,000 square feet of offices before the project can begin, and expects to announce the start of the $65 million project this summer.

A related issue is the dramatic jump from zero 4 star hotels in Raleigh to 4 which are proposed or under construction.

Article...

http://www.newsobserver.com/business/story...p-8925802c.html

JB

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All this talk from people saying there isn't a market here for such things. I agree with Coker (which around Cameron Village, is a four letter word) when he said, "Raleigh has got to decide if it wants to be a city or Columbia, South Carolina's poor sister". The naysayers need to let the market decide if these projects can make it or not - not local gov't officials. This article seemed to be wrought with cynicism. Sure there were supporters but they quote the manager of the Downtown Sheraton without making any reference to the impact on their interests if these hotels are built. What kind of source is that? How are we ever to grow without thinking big. I say bring on the towers! If they sell, then let 'em.

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After reading this article, and thinking long and hard about the proposed 40-story tower at Crabtree, I've changed my views. I believe it can be a great project and I want it to succeed. Damn if I want to be Columbia, South Carolina's poor little sister. If something like this elevates us - along with 309 Hillsborough, then BUILD IT and stop talking about it. Its the talking and no action that irks me.

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Heck yeah, Absolutely. Raleigh is on the verge of moving up a rung on the countries top Cities Ladder. It time to push all the naysayers to the side and keep it moving. If the demand is there build it. I say take advantage of it now when developers are hungry to build here. We don't want to become a city where developers don't even want to try to submit proposals because they already know that they "Won't Fly in Raleigh"

I'm feeling the statement from the article>>>

"We're stepping into a new time zone and Raleigh is ready to be equated with cities such as Charlotte and Atlanta. It's going to happen."

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"We need high-quality architecture but that doesn't mean buildings that overshadow surrounding areas," said Mayor Charles Meeker. "A 40-story building would be tall for downtown but it's out of scale for a suburban location."

I agree with Meeker on this one. If it were DT, then yes, a 40-story bldg would work great, but not at Crabtree. Have we seen a rendering with the bldg in it's surroundings? I think that's what we need to see in order to get an idea of the visual impact a 40-story bldg would create.

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While we may not necessarily want to emulate Greensboro, the tallest building there is well away from the city center and, as it happens, next to the local mall. The Koury Convention Center/Sheraton Hotel is at the I-40/High Point road interchange (you've driven past it if you've taken 40 through Greensboro. The big tall white thing.) and, while it is the tallest thing for miles, doesn't look ridiculous. Then again, maybe I'm just used to it...

I'm very excited about 309 Hillsborough, I really hope that succeeds. The tower on Glenwood I have less enthusiasm about--not due to a lack of scale or any aesthetic concern, but because I think ultimately a perceived lack of market will cause the project to be scaled back or canceled altogether.

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I can't believe they actually tore that building down! Seems like FCB should have realized b4 the implosion that they weren't going to be able to follow through with the tower....

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It's a shame. But so often the mentality is to demolish first, then figure out the ramifications afterward. It does seem odd to me that 14 years have gone by and the site is still empty, though...

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Raleighmark: awesome find on that picture,  its cool to see 333 corporate with a BB&T logo atop of it.

It really is ashame that builiding was razed and nothing resulted, but hopefully something worthy will be built there.  Is it just me or does that building look almost exactly the same as another building on Hargett?

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It has a fairly close resemblance to The Commerce Building

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While we may not necessarily want to emulate Greensboro, the tallest building there is well away from the city center and, as it happens, next to the local mall.  The Koury Convention Center/Sheraton Hotel is at the I-40/High Point road interchange (you've driven past it if you've taken 40 through Greensboro.  The big tall white thing.)  and, while it is the tallest thing for miles, doesn't look ridiculous.  Then again, maybe I'm just used to it...

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Personally, I feel that the Koury Convention Center looks pretty stupid. It looks like two seperate towers have been glued together (one about 15 stories and another about 25 stories tall.) But its worst offense is that it sticks up out of a sea of surface parking. There is no context for that building. At least there are a couple mid-rises near the proposed tower at Crabtree.
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Raleighmark, where did you aquire that old picture?  Its quite amazing and disappointing that building wasn't kept, especially since First Citizens chose Hammond Road.

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Flash, I scanned it from an old photograph I took. Here's a little closer picture.

45038573.firstcitizens4.jpg

I'll try to post some others from the same time period when I get a chance.

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  • 10 months later...

A Raleighing reader responded to my metarendering with an outstanding question. What lots are available to fill the gap between RBC and Wachovia's buildings in the "money shot"? In fact, there are just two lots left that would be easy for developers. Let's first look at the area that creates the gap.

gap1_1.jpg

Pictured here is downtown Raleigh. The new convention center is blocked in aqua. The photographer for the money shot was located on S. Saunders street, just south of MLK Blvd (in the left side of the photo). The Wachovia building is shown in purple while RBC's planned tower is where the yellow box is, on Fayetteville Street. The area in which a tower would appear between these towers, in the money shot, is shown with the shaded triangle.

The best place to appear in the money shot without having to build an extraordinarily tall building is along the southern side of Davie Street, between McDowell and Salisbury Streets. (Shown as "1" map it). The second ideal place for a tower that would appear between Wachovia and RBC is actually not shown in the above photo. It is the parking lot adjacent to the history museum bounded by Wilmington, Edenton, Blount, Jones Streets (map it). This site is a prime lot ready for development, however it sits so far back from the RBC and Wachovia buildings that the building would have to be at least 40 stories in order to make an impact on the money shot.

I suppose that the intersection of Lenoir and McDowell also sits in the line of sight, however this site is well removed from the Fayetteville Street cluster, and the buildings scale would have to be a factor. (Shown as "3" map it).

Imagine what a building shaped like Nashville's new Signature Tower would look like in the Davie Street lots. Here is a rendering:

ral_with_mt_2.jpg

Not bad! Although with so many 10-30 story buildings planned for the northwest side of downtown, perhaps a new money shot angle needs to be found.

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Nice analysis Dana. I believe your site 1 should be a reasonable high rise site in the next few years. With the convention center across the street it would be perfect for a hotel/office project. But I agree with you that once all the new buildings are completed we probably need a new "money shot". I thought that the shots from the Quorum angle looked pretty good. If/when and what the Reynolds build will have a large impact on which angle is chosen. Let's just hope what ever angle it is doesnt focus on the Marriott. :sick: Can't wait for 2008.

I always enjoy and appreciate your renderings. Do you use photoshop for these and are you a professional graphics kind of guy?

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