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Grand Rapids Airport (GRR) News and Developments

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I know that this was actually discussed several months ago, but...

Even though the wave design has been used a lot lately, the wave canopy connecting the ramp and entry makes sense because it matches the wave shaped, mustard colored, metal "canopies" inside the building.

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Will a big garage encourage new routes?

What do airlines look for when they are deciding where to put a hub? Does anyone have any experience with airlines?

I don't see GRR ever becoming a Hub, especially with two of the largest hubs in the country (Detroit, and O Hare) Being so close to us. But an airline generally looks for geographical advantages first.

Edited by snoogit

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I agree, whats the point of having a hub 15 flight minutes away? Unless of course GR becomes dependent on more direct flights then what is currently needed.

Edited by Rizzo

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I would like to see southwest or jet blue come to GR

I thought I heard someone mention Jet Blue was seriously considering buying a few gates at GRR?

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Actually i thought the press reported about a year ago that southwest would like to be in GRR, but i have not heard anything recently.

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I don't see GRR ever becoming a Hub, especially with two of the largest hubs in the country (Detroit, and O Hare) Being so close to us. But an airline generally looks for geographical advantages first.

I don't think we'll be an international type hub that O

Edited by GaryP

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I don't think we'll be an international type hub that O’Hare and Metro have become, but I think we could become something like Memphis or Cincinnati. They are both lesser hubs for different airlines (I'm blanking on which). I've heard that because our two runways are crossing, airlines are reluctant to select us. In the event of a crash both runways would be shut down, whereas an airport with parallel runways can continue to operate at half capacity. Also, without great service from the major airlines I don't see why we haven't picked up a discount carrier like JetBlue or Southwest.

Another question – Where do you think GRR could support direct flights? I think we could support LA and Toronto right now.

Memphis is Northwest, Cincinatti is Delta.

The big reason I cant see GRR becoming a hub, is Northwest is the largest carrier in GRR, and with the Detroit Metro Hub there is no reason for Northwest to have a hub here. United is the second largest Airliner, and their main hub is OHare, so that rules them out. American Airlines the third largest airline out of GRR, also uses Ohare as a Hub.

Our best hope of landing a small hub would be Delta. (Even MIdwest Express is too close to really consider making GRR a hub) but as you can see the 5 state area of the Great Lakes region is well covered.

Here is a list of all the Hubs, and where they are located (source) :

ABQ Albuquerque, NM		   WN

ANC Anchorage, AK			 AS

ATL Atlanta, GA			   DL

BNA Nashville, TN			 AA

BOS Boston, MA				NW

BWI Baltimore, MD			 US

CLE Cleveland, OH			 CO

CLT Charlotte, NC			 US

CMH Columbus, OH			  HP

CVG Cincinatti, OH			DL

DAL Dallas (Love Field), TX   WN

DEN Denver, CO				UA

DFW Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX	  AA DL

DTW Detroit, MI			   NW

EWR Newark, NJ				CO

HOU Houston (Hobby), TX	   WN

IAD Washington (Dulles), DC   UA

IAH Houston (Intercontinental), TX   CO

IND Indianapolis, IN		  US

JFK New York (Kennedy), NY	TW DL

LAS Las Vega$				 HP

LAX Los Angeles			   DL US

MEM Memphis, TN			   NW

MKE Milwaukee, WI			 NW YX

MSP Minneapolis/St. Paul, MN  NW

MSY New Orleans, LA		   CO

ORD Chicago, IL			   AA UA

MCO Orlando, FL			   DL

PHL Philadelphia, PA		  US

PHX Phoenix, AZ			   HP WN

PIT Pittsburgh, PA			US

RDU Raleigh/Durham, NC		AA

SEA Seattle, WA			   AS UA

SFO San Francisco, CA		 UA US

SJC San Jose, CA			  AA

SJU San Juan, PR			  AA

SLC Salt Lake City, UT		DL

STL St. Louis, MO			 TW

SYR Syracuse, NY			  US


AA   American Airlines

AS   Alaska Airlines

CO   Continental Airlines

DL   Delta Airlines

HP   America West Airlines

TW   Trans World Airlines

UA   United Airlines

US   U S Air

WN   Southwest Airlines

YX   Midwest Express

Edited by snoogit

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I think there could be HUGE demand for short-run, small plane flights from GR to Chicago and Detroit at a low fare.

I'm talking getting the new super-efficient mini-jets and charging $100 round trip. No frills no fuss.

easyJet flys from Edinburgh to London, that's like a 2 hour flight, for $50 round trip.

Lower the price point and make the profits in volume! THAT would grow our airport.

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Lower the price point and make the profits in volume!

yeah... that's what Independence Air said before they went belly up <_<

low cost alone does not equal a biz plan... especially in the airport/airline world.

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An article in the Business Journal today had this about attracting new carriers:

"There are no extras in this capital improvement plan; there are only critical investments that will complete and add to the value of parking operations at the airport," Koslosky told the board. "The plan will also give us the opportunity to enhance air service marketing efforts, both efforts to expand service from existing carriers and to attract low-cost carriers who look to have adequate parking facilities."

http://www.grbj.com/GRBJ/Nav/Login.htm?Art...6-951018463AE9}

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low cost alone does not equal a biz plan... especially in the airport/airline world.

No it doesn't. But it's amazing that European carriers have been able to hold that price for 5+ years by focusing on volume. Southwest too. Obviously they need to effectively manage overhead (ie fuel expenses), but I don't think it's unreasonable for an uber-inexpensive flight across the state or Lake Michigan from GR. If other countries are doing it, why can't we?

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No it doesn't. But it's amazing that European carriers have been able to hold that price for 5+ years by focusing on volume. Southwest too. Obviously they need to effectively manage overhead (ie fuel expenses), but I don't think it's unreasonable for an uber-inexpensive flight across the state or Lake Michigan from GR. If other countries are doing it, why can't we?

That's correct, SouthWest is a pretty amazing case study on how to do things right in the airline industry. One of the reasons flights are so expensive is due to fuel costs. How does SouthWest do it? They have extremely good business credit, and can sign long term fixed pricing deals on fuel. Airlines like NWA, and others that have filed for Bankruptcy don't have that luxury, they have to pay market rates. That alone costs the non-fixed price airlines to lose MILLIONS immediately from the bottom line. FWIW, There was a story about this on NPR a while back, so I'm not just spewing things out of my rear.

EDIT: I also believe that the EU subsidizes part of the airline industry, I'll have to do some looking

Edited by PBJ

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No it doesn't. But it's amazing that European carriers have been able to hold that price for 5+ years by focusing on volume. Southwest too. Obviously they need to effectively manage overhead (ie fuel expenses), but I don't think it's unreasonable for an uber-inexpensive flight across the state or Lake Michigan from GR. If other countries are doing it, why can't we?

Take a flight to Lake Michigan out of GR? The lake isnt that far away :P Instead of planes It'd better to see a light rail system that links Holland, Grand Haven, Muskegon, and GR together.

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Take a flight to Lake Michigan out of GR? The lake isnt that far away :P Instead of planes It'd better to see a light rail system that links Holland, Grand Haven, Muskegon, and GR together.

I think it was Across the lake, no to the lake :blink:

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Ahhhhh I though GRR had flights direct to Milwaukee? maybe not low cost though.

They do, Midwest flies from GRR to Milwaukee about 4 times per day. Usually tickets are between $140 and $190.

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They do, Midwest flies from GRR to Milwaukee about 4 times per day. Usually tickets are between $140 and $190.

Thats cheaper then the Lake Express, although you would have to rent a vehicle...

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Thats cheaper then the Lake Express, although you would have to rent a vehicle...

Yeah, I think it's about $80 round trip per passenger and over $100 if you bring your car. Flying is definitely faster, especially from GR. By the time you drive to the ferry in Muskegon and they load everyone on, it's still a 2.5 hour ride. Flights are normally about 30 mins.

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