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joeDowntown

Grand Rapids Airport (GRR) News and Developments

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Ah, makes sense. Now if they'd be honest about their pricing and greatly improve their customer service, Allegiant would be a little better than suck-ass.

Sounds like you were burned by Allegient by the vitriol you have for them. If they were the only carrier in town I'd have beef with them too. Thankfully, that's the bonus of GRR finally adding some competitors to choose from: options.

I'm glad that they fly here; as they do add some non-stop flights.

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Allegiant's September traffic jumps 24 percent:

http://finance.yahoo...1.html?x=0&.v=1

What, do you work for them arcturus? Are you saying you support businesses with hidden fees, defaults your selections so that you pay for something you didn't ask for, and a customer service department that constantly hangs up in the middle of going through their phone system? There are a lot of companies in Michigan that have been fined for less egregious business practices.

When someone can defend that, I'll certainly listen.

Also, go back and read your own article. Their business grew because they added new routes, not because they're capturing more customers.

In other words, let me vent. They seriously need to look at the way they do things. And until then, I'm going to suggest people stay away from them.

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What, do you work for them arcturus? Are you saying you support businesses with hidden fees, defaults your selections so that you pay for something you didn't ask for, and a customer service department that constantly hangs up in the middle of going through their phone system? There are a lot of companies in Michigan that have been fined for less egregious business practices.

When someone can defend that, I'll certainly listen.

Also, go back and read your own article. Their business grew because they added new routes, not because they're capturing more customers.

In other words, let me vent. They seriously need to look at the way they do things. And until then, I'm going to suggest people stay away from them.

No I don't work for them, I'm a frequent customer. When someone bashes a business, on a public forum no less, responsible discussion should include the other side of the story. If you're going to vent, expect replies which disagree . That's life. As a business owner yourself you can relate.

My position is simple - clearly their business model is working notwithstanding your grievances. I don't disagree with your comments on business practices, nevertheless their presence overall has been a positive for Grand Rapids and beats the piss poor selection and fares we had before.

By the way, if you read the article again, load factors also increased.

Rest assured I'll defend your right to vent :)

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My update on Allegiant, after flying with them. 2 hour delay at GRR, causing me to miss my shuttle bus in Vegas and was stranded at the airport. 2 hour delay taking off from Vegas (although it was due to storms rolling in).

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My update on Allegiant, after flying with them. 2 hour delay at GRR, causing me to miss my shuttle bus in Vegas and was stranded at the airport. 2 hour delay taking off from Vegas (although it was due to storms rolling in).

That's a bummer for sure. :( I've flown with them at least 5 times now, never a problem.

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Hooray, I found the old GRR thread (by leafing through the pages)!

Couple weeks back I flew to Seattle, with plane-changes in Chicago and two different airlines. Got to see lots of different aspects of O'Hare and Sea-Tac, and of course our own GRR.

Our place badly needs updating.

The other two airports have modern-looking concourses, lots of services, artwork (gee, where can we get some art?), pretty colors, unscuffed intact seating. Ours is a boring beige form the time you deplane until you get outdoors. Nice photo mural on the new parking deck, and the Calderette at the furthest end of the one concourse is cool. But in between it's, well, bland.

Also, to comment on Metrokid's ideas, Seattle now has a year-old high-speed electric train running between downtown and Sea-Tac. The fare was $2.50, and the headways are short (30 minutes during prime time). It starts out above ground (look down at the freeway!), moves to a right-of-way down the middle of a boulevard, ends up underground in the middle of downtown. Get off, and an electric or bio-fuel bus pulls up to the same platform.

I'd use something like that here, since it cost $48 to get my car back when I returned.

Edited by Veloise

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Today Delta/Northwest and US Airways announced that they are swapping a large number of paired landing/take-off slots at LaGuardia and Washington National subject to government approval. US Airways will trade 125 paired slots at LaGuardia to Delta for 42 slots at Washington National.

How this would affect Grand Rapids is that Delta/Northwest would no longer fly their pair of non-stop flights between Grand Rapids and Washington. US Airways as part of the announcement stated that it intends to return to Grand Rapids and fly the Grand Rapids / Washington route. Hopefully when they return they will return with more than the one flight pair that Delta is dropping. I'll have to dig out my US Air frequent flyer card.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...9081202558.html

Bumped this old post because the Department of Transportation has finally approved the slots swap with the condition that the two airlines sell off eight slots at Washington National and 16 at LaGuardia in order to preserve competition. The two airlines have agreed. The main reason this had stalled so long was earlier the DOT had insisted on a greater number of slots at both airports be sold which was unacceptable to the two airlines.

So will Grand Rapids continue to have a Washington flight after Delta gives up the slot? Will US Airways return to Grand Rapids in order to fly just one flight a day? I haven't seen anything in the news stories that say. I found this seemingly credible blogger in Charlotte ( a US Airways hub) who asks the same thing, along with a lot of other things concerning the swap:

Charlotte Blog

From the blog:

"Note - Des Moines (DSM), Madison (MSN) and Grand Rapids (GRR) on the list of places US Airways said they want to serve from DCA. Delta offers a single daily regional jet flight to each of these places from DCA. US Airways doesn't currently serve MSN or GRR at all and DSM has US Airways service only to Phoenix.

Doubt you'd want to offer just a single flight a day to a city. As we've noted before, US Airways has been pretty unwilling to add service to second-tier Midwest destinations. Does this change now and they add service from DSM, MSN, and GRR to Charlotte and/or Philly as part of this? Or is the previous announcement of service to those cities just something to help get the feds to sign off on the deal with US Airways having no intention to serve those markets?"

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USA TODAY travel blog writer, Ben Mutzabaugh, wrote an interesting three part interview with GRR airport directors Jim Koslosky and Phil Johnson. They talk about what might happen with the Airtran/Southwest service along with speculation about other carriers.

The link is just of the third article but the earlier two are embedded in it:

http://travel.usatod...nterstitialskip

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USA TODAY travel blog writer, Ben Mutzabaugh, wrote an interesting three part interview with GRR airport directors Jim Koslosky and Phil Johnson. They talk about what might happen with the Airtran/Southwest service along with speculation about other carriers.

The link is just of the third article but the earlier two are embedded in it:

http://travel.usatod...nterstitialskip

Apparently Mutzabaugh wasn't done - here is one more article about GRR and Allegiant

http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/post/2011/10/grand-rapids-qanda-4/553544/1?csp=34travel

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Apparently Mutzabaugh wasn't done - here is one more article about GRR and Allegiant

http://travel.usatod.../1?csp=34travel

I should have waited another day. He's got one more article but he says this is the last one:

http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/post/2011/10/grand-rapiads-qanda5-/553868/1

The Lansing airport has been running billboards here locally regarding Frontier nonstop to D.C. Guess those won't be run anymore.

The airline in Lansing flying to DCA is Sun Country, not Frontier. Apparently Frontier only has one slot available at Washington National since they are splitting it between Grand Rapids and Madison, and flying each city just three day a week. Flying three days a week might work flying to a vacation destination but I'm not sure it will work flying to what is basically a business destination. The new managment at Frontier does some strange things.

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. . . AND THESE NEW FLIGHTS FROM FRONTIER AIRLINES TOO!!: http://www.anna.aero...tional-airport/

You win some you lose some, while Frontier has started their three day a week service to Washington National, Delta will be dropping their daily service to Washington National from GRR in mid July. Interestingly the Frontier service is really a Denver to Washington flight with Grand Rapids as an intermediate stop. The reason for the GRR stop (along with the Madison stop on alternating days) is that almost all allocated slots to Washington National including this one are restricted to cities no more than 1500 miles from Washington. Denver is too far away to use this airport slot for a non-stop.

Edited by walker

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so why not just fly into IAD to serve that market then

What market at IAD? Dulles is a joke. I speak as one who, because of geography, cannot board a plane at LAX that will land at DCA. If you are connecting to a transatlantic flight, JFK or BOS are better options. For that matter, ORD or DTW are even better.

I think Walker nailed it -- the loss of the daily Delta flight is big. On the other hand, I remember having to connect at DTW in the past, so I guess Frontier's 3 a week is still a better option.

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FYI - I live in Denver and I know Frontier flies non-stop between DEN and DCA since I fly that route frequently. It's a favorite of all the federal employees out here (and sometimes Members of Congress, too). Before Frontier offered that option, I had my choice of changing planes at DFW (awful!), ORD, and sometimes St. Louis.

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FYI - I live in Denver and I know Frontier flies non-stop between DEN and DCA since I fly that route frequently. It's a favorite of all the federal employees out here (and sometimes Members of Congress, too). Before Frontier offered that option, I had my choice of changing planes at DFW (awful!), ORD, and sometimes St. Louis.

There are a few slots that are exempted from the perimeter rule, including several from Denver. I was wrong about the mileage limit. It is 1250 miles, not 1500 as I had stated. If you look at the Wikipedia entry for Washington National Airport there is a good discussion (most of it toward the botton of the entry) of the perimeter restrictions and the slots that are exempted and a little about the politics involved in those exemptions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_Reagan_Washington_National_Airport

None of this has much to do with GRR other than Frontier is using GRR as an intermediate stop as a way of getting around the perimeter rule using a non-exempt slot. I imagine this is the same reason that Sun Country Airlines stops in Lansing on their way from Minneapolis to Wahington National.

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Here it is late August and still no word about SW Air's plan for GRR. Maybe they're content to simply continue the routes flown by AirTran?

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