Grand Rapids Airport (GRR) News and Developments

[joeDowntown]

Slow news day (year?), but GRR is adding a new bookstore / self serve wine bar. It's in the former Grand Rapids store (which anecdotally had the worst sign ever and the store looked really cheap). 

https://grbj.com/news/travel-tourism/ford-airport-adds-bookstore-and-wine-bar/

I just flew back to GR yesterday and wondered when that store had closed / vending area was vacant. Glad to see new amenities. The airport is looking really good, VERY busy. Loving the American GRR > Charlotte (CLT) route. super easy, goes out a couple of times a day, and it was packed (both ways). 

[GRJohn]

With the new addition of 8 gates in Concourse A, has there been any word (speculation) on what new flights there might be to and from GRR?  I'm assuming they would be Delta and/or Allegiant since those seem to be the airlines assigned to that Concourse.  

[MJLO]

19 minutes ago, GRJohn said:

With the new addition of 8 gates in Concourse A, has there been any word (speculation) on what new flights there might be to and from GRR?  I'm assuming they would be Delta and/or Allegiant since those seem to be the airlines assigned to that Concourse.  

I think this expansion was done mostly with future growth in mind.  Though I do think Allegiant wants to expand their focus here and a lack of available gates makes that problematic currently.  I believe it also comes with a "big kid" customs receiving area so that folks flying in  internationally can enter the way they do at most airports.  The old way  customs set up a card table at the gate, and checked people at the gateway.  I think that was a big reason why Air Canada dropped the daily Toronto flight.   Perhaps this will open to some Caribbean flights, or maybe even bring back Air Canada to the market. 

[GR8scott]

2 hours ago, MJLO said:

I think this expansion was done mostly with future growth in mind.  Though I do think Allegiant wants to expand their focus here and a lack of available gates makes that problematic currently.  I believe it also comes with a "big kid" customs receiving area so that folks flying in  internationally can enter the way they do at most airports.  The old way  customs set up a card table at the gate, and checked people at the gateway.  I think that was a big reason why Air Canada dropped the daily Toronto flight.   Perhaps this will open to some Caribbean flights, or maybe even bring back Air Canada to the market. 

I read somewhere that the A gates will be legacy carriers so American, Delta and United and B gates will be "low" cost carriers so Allegiant, Frontier, and Southwest. If that happens right away with no expanded services, it seems like there would be plenty of extra room in A gates and B gates might be pretty cramped. That begs the question, would they plan to do a similar upgrade to B gates after the current Project Elevate completes? Theres not enough room to expand that concourse as long but certainty could modernize it, widen it and add a couple more gates to bring it up to par with the A gates. If that were to happen, some of the low cost carriers would certainly have to use A gates during construction. 

 

So far, the only announced new service is American adding LGA, which Delta already has. I would hope maybe Delta switches to their JFK hub for another destination option. Most major legacy hubs are serviced but still room to expand if United returns to Dulles, perhaps SFO. Delta to SEA and SLC and maybe current routes that Allegiant has like LAX and BOS. It would be nice if American had year round service to PHX and MIA instead of once per week during a few winter months. 

 

As for the "low" cost, theres been several startups but the one that was reported to fly to GRR, Midwest, is no longer? Jet Blue or Spirit could be a possibility but plenty of options for Allegiant and Southwest to expand service and Im betting International service returns with a low cost seasonal to Cancun. Canada does not need a customs, Air Canada pulled out of several midsized markets like Omaha, Rochester, Richmond ect. but seems like theres enough W. MI connections that it could support a return. The new customs would be necessary for Cancun though and of course other future possibilities like Montego Bay or Punta Cana and maybe eventually Europe (Amsterdam!)

[joeDowntown]

I could see GRR adding a lot of flights that currently use Lansing. We went to Cancun last winter and most of the people we ran into were from GR/West Michigan. 

when does the customs area at GRR open? Or is it done and just needs flights?

Joe

[GR8scott]

On 1/20/2023 at 6:55 PM, joeDowntown said:

I could see GRR adding a lot of flights that currently use Lansing. We went to Cancun last winter and most of the people we ran into were from GR/West Michigan. 

when does the customs area at GRR open? Or is it done and just needs flights?

Joe

Lansing basically gutted their flight options with exception of new low cost carrier Avelo going to Orlando but as for the customs, it appears the building part is finished and there would need to be federal clearance/staffing? maybe they need an airline to schedule first? Possibly need more gate room in the B terminal which would have to shift things around after some of the new gates open up? I'm guessing it will be about a year before theres extra room, scheduled service and staffing for it??? 

 

Heres the new building (yellow) kind of awkwardly next to the B gates. I wonder if there will have to be a long jetbridge (orange?) to connect passengers to the new customs area?? otherwise the old school airstairs during the winter?

 

 

[MJLO]

22 hours ago, GR8scott said:

 I'm guessing it will be about a year before theres extra room, scheduled service and staffing for it??? 

GRR already has a customs staff on account of being an international airport.  My guess is that they could probably handle it now.  We are probably looking at a couple flights a week a la the Allegiant business model at first, so they could likely prepare for that volume already.  At most even if a daily flight returned from Toronto, we are still probably only talking about a 50 seater Embraer or similar.  It wouldn't be hard to accommodate that  especially if they have the facilities now.   Not at all like a DTW that handles multiple flights from multiple continents with 1000s of passengers at once. 

[Hoeks]

29 minutes ago, MJLO said:

GRR already has a customs staff on account of being an international airport.  My guess is that they could probably hand it now.  We are probably looking at a couple flights a week a la the Allegiant business model at first, so they could likely prepare for that volume already.  At most even if a daily flight returned from Toronto, we are still probably only talking about a 50 seater Embraer or similar.  It wouldn't be hard to accommodate that  especially if they have the facilities now.   Not at all like a DTW that handles multiple flights from multiple continents with 1000s of passengers at once. 

A direct connect as a gateway to Europe (Amsterdam/London/Paris) would be amazing!   Not sure if demand (or ability to schedule into those airports) would be possible.   It also seems like GRR could support a seasonal to Cancun/Caribbean destinations.   Fingers crossed that direct, is the direction of International for GRR, otherwise it seems like it wouldn't be much of a difference between having to connect through ATL/NYC/etc.   Really hopeful!  

[arcturus]

2 hours ago, MJLO said:

GRR already has a customs staff on account of being an international airport.  My guess is that they could probably hand it now.  We are probably looking at a couple flights a week a la the Allegiant business model at first, so they could likely prepare for that volume already.  At most even if a daily flight returned from Toronto, we are still probably only talking about a 50 seater Embraer or similar.  It wouldn't be hard to accommodate that  especially if they have the facilities now.   Not at all like a DTW that handles multiple flights from multiple continents with 1000s of passengers at once. 

One airline which fits this which comes to mind is Porter Air witht their Embraer 195's.    https://www.flyporter.com/en-us/book-flights/where-we-fly

[GR8scott]

Direct to Cancun, Punta Cana and I think Montego Bay were specifically cited as goals by the airport. Those are destinations taht Lansing has supported in the past so theres certainly enough demand in the area to do that. Cancun is a no-brainer and would be surprised with there are not flights by next spring season.  And Europe is a long shot and would be several years out but with more 787s being built, seating less and being more efficient plus historic and business connections in west michigan to netherlands possibly a seasonal flight? I know slightly larger non-touristy cities such as Raleigh, Indy, cincy, Pittsburg have flights like that. 

I remember reading something about the customs at this time is part time and scheduled whereas there would need to be permanently based full time customs? which doesnt seem too difficult but probably wouldn't until an airline schedules regular service outside of US/Canada. Its not necessary for Canada as wasnt before when there were regularly scheduled airCanada flights, before they eliminated several mid-sized US markets. I would think GRR is one of the popular formerly served routes than say Allentown or Dayton so hope that comes back as well. 

[kwl]

I'm going to be wagering that we won't see return of Air Canada or a GRR-YYZ route anytime soon. 

Few reasons why:

• It looks like AC operated the route from 2008-2013 and a little earlier in the 2000s.
  • Equipment was a Beech 1900D turboprop which sat 18. 
  • Air Canada and Air Canada express no longer fly the 1900D and the smallest plane in the AC/AC Express fleet seats about 50
  • Smaller planes are turboprop and often corporate insurance prevents employees from flying on turboprops

Finally, I'm assuming that AC had that route to try and capture West Michigan auto supplier pax needing to go to Ontario manufacturing sites. Business has changed quite a bit since 2013 (and before) and I'm guessing the demand just isn't there. ...

[joeDowntown]

1 hour ago, kwl said:

Finally, I'm assuming that AC had that route to try and capture West Michigan auto supplier pax needing to go to Ontario manufacturing sites. Business has changed quite a bit since 2013 (and before) and I'm guessing the demand just isn't there. ...

That being said, the amount of airport traffic, and travel shifts (business +leisure) have also shifted quite a bit since 2013. Toronto is a good destination on its own, and probably would open up a lot of routes for people traveling internationally. So I don’t think a route like that (or any route  right now) is solely based on business travel or a single industry. 

Joe

[GR8scott]

those are good reasons especially plane size, if I remember correctly though there  were multiple flights per day? And these are the similar sized non-touristy and non-hub US markets currently served by AC express so its not a stretch for GRR after expansion, MKE and Hartford do about a million more passengers than GRR did pre-covid....

 Cincinnati, Cleveland, Columbus–Glenn, Indianapolis, Milwaukee,  Pittsburgh, Raleigh/Durham, St. Louis,  Hartford, Kansas City

[BLUESCRUBS]

Airport  direct road access study....

 

https://www.woodtv.com/news/kent-county/community-leaders-meet-to-improve-ford-airport-access/

https://www.gvmc.org/airport-access-study

[StreetcarGR]

Thanks for sharing. I just left a comment asking for them to prioritize other means of access instead of privately owned vehicles. Perhaps an "express" bus service would be a good start? Light rail is the ideal but who knows if that would happen. Thoughts?

[GR8scott]

22 hours ago, StreetcarGR said:

Thanks for sharing. I just left a comment asking for them to prioritize other means of access instead of privately owned vehicles. Perhaps an "express" bus service would be a good start? Light rail is the ideal but who knows if that would happen. Thoughts?

the shuttle already happened in the past and there were times it was very busy especially during conventions. That seems like a no-brainer because of its relatively low startup/on going costs compared to revenue generated, yet in their analysis it has "medium" cost. I see other head scratchers in the anaysis as well such as the $100million+ secondary access road around the north runway (not a tunnel)???

And there was previous mention of rail service so it seems like its at least on their radar to preserve the rail lines nearby in case but does not appear to be in the final short-term long-term look with this study. 

I still think its going to take all of the above type approach but ultimately the biggest long term impact is direct i96 access shaving off 2-3 miles of the majority of roughly 10,000 peoples airport access each and every day. the miles saves TIME, traffic, pollution, money and offers a much better experience for everyone especially visitors. 

[arcturus]

Passenger traffic for 2022 was just 3.4% below the record set in 2019, up 18.45% over 2021 which in turn was up 68% over the 2020 numbers for obvious reasons.

https://www.grr.org/hubfs/December Aviation Activity Report.pdf?hsLang=en

https://www.grr.org/history

 

[MJLO]

Traffic up 16.35% in January 2023 vs. 2022  to 261k passengers.  If growth stays at that pace 2023 will end over 4 million passengers.    I remember heading into 2020 airport traffic was up double digits in Jan/Feb compared to record breaking 2019.  Feb 2020 had over 300k passengers(which was huge for a winter month).   It'll be interesting to see how this month ends, whether it's close to that 2020 number or not.  I've not been home in a few months but it seems like you guys keep getting hit with snow storms so that will probably slow some of that traffic. 

[d8alterego]

On 2/17/2023 at 9:29 AM, BLUESCRUBS said:

Airport  direct road access study....

 

https://www.woodtv.com/news/kent-county/community-leaders-meet-to-improve-ford-airport-access/

https://www.gvmc.org/airport-access-study

As much of a fantasy as this may be, how about a rail system?

I could see a lot of development/growth at stations along the route; especially along the 28th Street corridor. 

Edited February 21, 2023 by d8alterego

[cstonesparty]

48 minutes ago, d8alterego said:

As much of a fantasy as this may be, how about a rail system?

I could see a lot of development/growth at stations along the route; especially along the 28th Street corridor. 

Seems like if you put a 'park & ride' at the 36th exit and ran a shuttle in to the airport, you could do this very inexpensively and serve non-airport traffic into downtown from that corner.  I know nothing about railroads, so the tracks may not be suitable for this purpose in that corridor...

[StreetcarGR]

1 hour ago, d8alterego said:

As much of a fantasy as this may be, how about a rail system?

I could see a lot of development/growth at stations along the route; especially along the 28th Street corridor. 

It just makes too much sense! I find myself wondering what the cost of something like this would be. Expensive sure but a $100 million interchange is as well. Something like this would have the potential (as you pointed out) to grow our city in a less car-dependent way, which I think would be a great step forward for our city and help us scale up for the future sustainably.

[d8alterego]

44 minutes ago, StreetcarGR said:

It just makes too much sense! I find myself wondering what the cost of something like this would be. Expensive sure but a $100 million interchange is as well. Something like this would have the potential (as you pointed out) to grow our city in a less car-dependent way, which I think would be a great step forward for our city and help us scale up for the future sustainably.

According to Bloomberg it costs, on average for light rail, above $100 million per mile. 

The potential 10 mile rail line I drew, even though it utilizes an existing rail corridor, would cost somewhere around $1 billion. 

But this line would not travel through rural areas waiting to be developed. The density is already there to immediately benefit those areas. The redevelopment potential, in my opinion, would bring in far more than $1 billion in residential and commercial property taxes over the years. 

Edited February 21, 2023 by d8alterego

[Zads]

2 hours ago, d8alterego said:

As much of a fantasy as this may be, how about a rail system?

I could see a lot of development/growth at stations along the route; especially along the 28th Street corridor. 

Love this. Put this in the City Master Plan meetings. There are three this week. Dream big.

https://www.grandrapidsmi.gov/Government/Programs-and-Initiatives/Community-Master-Plan-Updates

[GR8scott]

$100 million / mile seems like it would be if there was no existing infrastructure? In this case utilizing existing and not heavily used lines could be much more cost effective? Its too bad its mostly lined with industrial and lower density residential as if it went through commercial and higher density areas to the north such eastown, egr, calvin, woodland ect seems like a no brainer for light rail even at a higher cost where as this seems more like a commuter rail kind of service which might not be a bad idea to pair with another commuter line envisioned to the west through Grandville-Jenison-Hudsonville-Zeeland-Holland? Commuter rail would have less stops but more park and ride type stations, maybe something like this? With stations at Division, Burton, and E. Beltline? 

[d8alterego]

14 hours ago, Zads said:

Love this. Put this in the City Master Plan meetings. There are three this week. Dream big.

https://www.grandrapidsmi.gov/Government/Programs-and-Initiatives/Community-Master-Plan-Updates

Since I no longer live in Grand Rapids, nor Michigan, I'm not sure I'm the one to do so. However I still love GR so much that I follow this UP channel.