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People Mover may get expanded to New Center


Allan

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That was no slight to you, BTW. Sorry if it read that way.

All that aside, I think it's pretty clear why expanding the PM may be expensive, it's certainly and perfectly capable of being expanded. The only question is whether the private investors want to front the monetary costs, and whether they see a long-term benefit in which the costs of expanding the system are worth it in the long run? The fact is that very, very few mass transit systems turn a profit, so if that's the case, if we only think about this on paper, very, very few mass transit systems should even exists if we're judging it on turning a profit, alone.

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I'm not sure what the 'however' was for, because I've been behind this plan ever since I heard about it. My point was being made to the naysayers who always have an excuse of why any type of rail mass transit or people mover expansion wouldn't work. That's what the whole part about mass transit systems rarely ever turning a profit was all about, the point being that if some are simply going to judge the monetary costs of a system, then almost no mass transit systems should exist because they rarely ever turn a profit. We've got to factor in a lot more factors than just the factor of whether or not this thing pays for itself. I find it ironic people complain about the costs of these systems and how much they are funded by state and national money, but totally are silent when you tell them that freeways are heavily subsidized.

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Time for mass transit fantasies! :)

dmtsb2.jpg

There would be the expansion route (blue)

and Grand Boulevard Line

and Woodward

The G. Blvd. line would cut in so that it meets up at the train station. The Woodward line starts at the train station.

The only important part is that all those lines that would meet up in the same general area all meet up at the train station, which would be a really big hub, with one of those european stations that has a mall type thing or whatever. I think that's good because it would be easy to transfer, and because mentally, all of the routes would make a lot more sense and they'd feel a lot more concise. A lot of systems don't make sense, and no one here will put up with cracked out systems.

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true! and this may not be that important, but if the station is empty and no one is getting in or off, the train doesn't have to wait for it's computerized time to make it go. The driver in that case can just take off.

It would also be really sad if they don't make it a two-way. Who would want to go all the way to the new center from the ren cen if they just want to get to the Millerder Center station, even though that person should be walking anyways, but that's non of my business.

I say tear down the entire system, it's one of the city's eyesores and a complete waste. We need to encourage walking. Do you know how many more people would fill our sidewalks downtown during special shows/events if it weren't for these trains. I wouldn't be saying this if we were Chicago or Toronto, but we are not and probably will never be. we have a small CBD that can be easily navigated by foot. If people don't like to walk, they shouldn't come here anyways. Sorry for the negativity.

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That looks awesome to me! Hop on a train in Flint, stop in downtown Detroit, then head to Lansing to hang for a while.

One think i would do is a Lapeer- Flint line, going through my town of Davison, utilizing the Grand trunk western route. A lot of people work in Flint and live in Lapeer. Then again, the GRD Trunk has so much freight traffic it would be hard to get them to let us use the track for commuter rail.

Maybe light rail could do that job?

Some good fantasies!

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You'd have to transfer in Holly to get to Downtown Detroit, but you would have direct access to Metro Airport.:) The Flint and Adrian routes are the only two routes that don't go directly Downtown. The Flint Line serves the growing I-275/Western Oakland corridor as well as Metro Airport, while the Adrian line serves as a "cross-town" line creating a shortcut for people who aren't going directly downtown, e.g. someone who lives in Milford and works in Auburn Hills.

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Mine too:

metrotransit2.jpg

All eight routes are on existing tracks except for the stretch through Downtown Detroit. Some of the routes use former rail lines that are no longer used. I'm not sure how easy it would be to "reuse" these routes for commuter rail, but there were tracks along these routes at one point. A route from the Dequindre Cut's terminus in Rivertown to the tracks that lead to Canada would have to be constructed. In my opinion, the best option would be to remove Atwater/Civic Center Dr from Rivertown to just west of Joe Louis Arena and have that area be the route through Downtown. It would be below grade or under ground through much of this section and for the remaining section it would run at-grade parallel to W Jefferson Ave.

The Downtown terminal would then be built into the Cobo Hall expansion where Cobo Arena currently sits. It would have a retail mall and have direct access to the People Mover station built to also serve Hart Plaza, the Riverwalk, and the Cobo annex. The location would also be the site of a large hotel.

One change that I should make thoug is to have the "Flint" route end in Monroe as opposed to Carleton.

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Good ideas everyone! :)

Tracer, I like the lodge-rail idea. It very convienently goes downtown, but as much out of the way as possible, and still connects to the people mover, and now like you say, it could go to Canada. If I recall right, there's already a train tunnel around that area already, but I'm sure it's heavily used by freight.

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The Downtown terminal would then be built into the Cobo Hall expansion where Cobo Arena currently sits. It would have a retail mall and have direct access to the People Mover station built to also serve Hart Plaza, the Riverwalk, and the Cobo annex. The location would also be the site of a large hotel.
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More transit fantasy!

It's a train station! tee-hee!!

dtrainstation7yg.jpg

Dark Blue: Station (The same size as Grand Central Station in NY)

Light Blue: Hotel/Whatever Tower (about the same footprint as Met Life on top of GC, which isn't a hotel, but whatever) Would only be ~15 stories

Very Light Blue: Current UAW, either worked into design or demolished.

Bright Blue: Some cool developement or something. So that the station would be in hustle and bustle, not isolated. Not mega tall (so skyline can still be seen without being covered up a lot).

Black Lines: sky bridges crossing Jefferson.

It also lines up with Griswold, so if there needed to be more than one road going in, it could wrap around and meet up with the other roads.

The station would be a few floors tall, with mall type stuff along the edges, and a big opening in the middle, and a skylight in the roof. The outside walls would have windows, even if the shops don't want them. With that area, there would be about half as many platforms are MCS, if I'm looking at the arials right.

Jefferson would go under cobo, but would go right back to jefferson. The highway would be the train tracks, and would go under cobo elsewhere, which should be possible considering everything else that goes under it.

Some of Hart Plaza would be eaten up, but I think most of the space eaten is just empty space, not really space that is important to Hart Plaza.

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