Downtown Projects & Developments

[Spartan]

I can't speak for all, but in my limited experience working downtown, garages were relatively full, but not completely. The Magnolia Deck is designed to handle the capacity for full occupancy of the ESA building, which is only about 1/2 occupied I think? (just guessing there) And also Palmetto Bank (since it was built on their parking lot to begin with)

Dunbar is not heavily used, and Kennedy is only used by Broadwalk and Denny's employees. Plenty of room in both to park. I think Dunbar is mainly used by Advance America and maybe that other miscellaneous office building next door to it.

The parking decks are mostly used during the week by these employees. The businesses eat the costs for their employees, so they essentially park for free (God forbid you pay to park anywhere). Visitors have to pay. So if you're local you look for the ample, free, on-street parking. The problem there is that people complain about a perceived lack of parking because the spaces are not right in front of their destination. SOME people have trouble with the notion of walking a block to get to their parking spot whether its from a garage or other parking lot or garage.

I have to add, however, that every time I go home I see more people using the decks and parking on the streets further away including Magnolia, Spring, and parts of Broad for nightlife purposes, and even the weekend lunch crowd is becoming stronger. For example, I went to Groucho's with my family at around 2pm one day, and it was packed out. Another time at 1:30, same thing.

During the week I can't say as much since I last worked in Spartanburg about 4 years ago. But at that time, people did walk to lunch spots regularly. Sandella's, Wild Wings, Subway, Monsoon Noodle House, Delaney's, etc were all pretty popular. The main problem to overcome now is the issue of critical mass within the core CBD to support even more lunch time business.

Regarding parking in general though, the problem stems, in my opinion, from a "Fear" of parking garages. I don't know if everyone realizes they are free on nights and weekends and how incredibly convenient they are.

Sorry - please don't flame me - but it was really disheartening to see all those parking lots with random unoccupied buildings scattered about.

Opinions and constructive criticism are welcome. Don't apologize for that. There is a difference between that type of discussion and putting one place down in comparison to another be it one's hometown or otherwise.

I personally disagree with what you said though. Downtown as a whole, while not as architecturally diverse is still a better place today that in was in the 70s, 80s, or 90s for that matter. The fact that it is no longer a place that Spartan's avoid for everything except Spring Fling says a lot. For locals it is a place to meet, gather, and enjoy. There is still a along way to go, but I hope nobody mistakes my rants for a displeasure in the overall direction that downtown is going.

[travey]

Downtown as a whole, while not as architecturally diverse is still a better place today that in was in the 70s, 80s, or 90s for that matter. The fact that it is no longer a place that Spartan's avoid for everything except Spring Fling says a lot

I don't agree. In the 70's and 80's I enjoyed SHOPPING downtown. Belks, Woolworths, Silvers, Standard, Bargain basements under most retailers... Sure, the Department stores were slowly killed by the malls. Don't forget H. Walker for ice cream sodas ..... It lasted til about 1988 (?). Yes, it may have not looked spiffy, but it was alive with commerce and a diverse swatch of people.

[Spartan]

True. Before Hillcrest Mall, downtown was the ONLY place to get anything. I'll admit that my knowledge of downtown from those days is largely from my parents and history books. Which reminds me that recent-era Spartanburg history is very hard to come by. If anyone knows any books that cover Spartanburg's growth and development from the say around WW2 through the present I'd be interested in it. I've read Phillip Racine's books. They're not much for "recent" history. In fact I dare say I own almost every history book about Spartanburg, except "Textile Town."

So far the best places to get the kind of history that I want are from the planning efforts that were undertaken in those days. Those are not easy to come by though.

Anyway, my earliest experiences that I can remember with downtown are in the 80s, and in those days we generally did not go there. I mean the Morgan Square part of downtown. We went to church, Sugar-n-Spice and other such things. My favorite memories were of the Piedmont Steak House. But never for hanging out or meeting people like today.

[roads-scholar]

I was a youngster in the 1960's but vividly recall downtown Spartanburg as a bustling and vibrant place, especially on Saturdays. I especially remember the pedestrian traffic waiting to cross Church Street where Wild Wings is now. Its hard to imagine but a city policeman stood at the corner directing all the traffic.

Morgan Square, however, was simply a parking lot. I also don't remember many places to eat. Woolworth's had their lunch counter but other restaurants just don't come to mind.

By the time the 70's rolled around downtown was clearly on the decline. After Westgate opened in '75 downtown really became a ghost town, even though the Main Street Mall opened around the same time.

Today downtown has a pleasant green space (Morgan Square), nice parking decks, white collar offices, and several nice restaurants. Although downtown has a long way to go I'm encouraged and excited about the future. I feel privileged to experience downtown's revival.

[goodbye]

...But driving on Main Street (I hate how they made the street so curvy)...

As do I. It makes little sense and ruins an otherwise great, straight corridor with plenty of potential in many ways.

[Spartan]

The serpentine design of Main Street was a bad idea from the start. In fact, every planning effort in downtown has recommended its removal, and I'm fairly certain that it was an idea that was never in any official plan. Yet another example of how Spartanburg takes the bad concepts and makes it happen. If they would rebuild it as a straight street with parallel parking they would be ample room for wider sidewalks and street cafe's, etc.

[teshadoh]

I understand this might be a weak comparison - but you know what upstate city that is doing a great job of giving their downtown a facelift is? Anderson. I was really impressed with the work they are doing there a month ago. It helps give downtown Anderson an intimate feeling (only if more buildings were renovated).

[Spartan]

Anderson is fortunate because they didn't tear down all of their historic buildings, they have a decent grid, and they don't have Spartanburg's City Council.

[Sparkleman]

Whats up with the tee pees that are set up on the lot where the old State theater used to be? I noticed them this morning and was wondering if anyone knew the deal.

[Spartan]

Which lot is that?

[travey]

Which lot is that?

The lot is on Main ST. about 3 spaces in from the corner of Church St. Those tee pees are art. Didn't you know? Art sponsored by hub-bub. Government sanctioned art, perhaps. Not sure if the hub-bubbers are still funded by city tax dollars. You can find out more details at www.hub-bub.com about the artist-in-resident who created it.

[Spartan]

Oh... THAT lot. I had never heard it called that before.

[Spartan]

There is an article in the HJ today that discusses the state of downtown businesses. In general the article doesn't have much substantive information in it, except that most downtown restaurants are seeing stable numbers though some are having less consistent business. Some retailers are seeing a slight downturn. Overall Spartanburg appears to be faring well given the state of the rest of the world.

Article

[Spartan]

Ok I have some photo updates.

The building I mentioned before (that was formerly Aug W Smith) is also listed as 100 E Main (same address as the Palmetto Building).

I presume that even though these buildings appear to be separate, the same address is listed because they were both part of Belk-Hudson when it was located there.

Here are the photos:

Here is what is used to look like:

And in other news, the furniture store at 111 Main is closing, so there is a new retail or restaurant opportunity here in addition to the building to the right of it:

[Spartan]

Ezell Street updates:

Photos of the Hub City Art Park:

[Spartan]

Has anyone else seen the Palmetto Building lately? Its been painted. Any guess on the color? Thats right, our city's favorite- beige. Its not the whole thing though, just the bottom floor and a stripe in the middle and on top. It looks like crap IMO. I don't have my camera at home this weekend, but if anyone wants to get out there and take a shot from the square it would be appreciated.

My thought: why not Delaney's green or restoring the original brick?

[Sparkleman]

These are tough times even for the zillionares over at Longleaf. Beige is cheaper than green and restoring the brick would probably cost a ton.

[Spartan]

I'm just not very enthusiastic about beige. Our city is quite infatuated with it, and I don't understand why.

[Spartan]

This is interesting. The City has had two of its Economic Development staff resign. Both say its for other career interests, but given how things seem to work in Spartanburg, I can't help but wonder if something else is going on.

Article

[spartanburgh]

The way things work in Spartanburg, you don't need an Economic Development Department, you just need to get the approval of Johnson Development and you can do anything you want. I'm assuming these two got tired of beating their heads against brick walls. I know of so many projects that were shot down or given the run around until they died weary deaths and that gets old really quick.

[alias007]

...don't need an Economic Development Department, you just need to get the approval of Johnson Development...

(but crying inside)

I hear a lot worse of this same issue in Myrtle Beach. The people that own the Opry, Pavilion (everything) ran off so much good stuff down there just because they could. This is all hearsay, but my mom (that lives at the beach) said that Disney was looking at the old airforce base for a new park. They were run off because they'd "lose money on the Pavilion". So then they closed the Pavilion the next year. Of course, Disney would've meant more money for them, but that's not how they saw it. Sorry to spout hearsay (and about a different town). But I say that to say, it could be worse. Not that it makes everything okay. But still, it could be worse. ;-)

[Spartan]

Supposedly Myrtle Beach was on the radar when they were scouting sites for Disney World. They ended up picking a sleepy little town in Central Florida.

[Spartan]

I"m not sure what this is supposed to be, but it seems the Palmetto Building is going to get an exterior facelift of at least $230,000. They just painted it, so I'm not sure what else they want to do... unless perhaps its for the Belk Hudson/ Aug W Smith section that has recently seen some demo work.

HJ Article

[alias007]

The way I interpret the article is that $30k from the city would go towards exterior (maybe improved sidewalk, parking, that kind of thing???) and it also says toward renovations. So maybe some of the money would go towards renovations -in- the building? The other $200k from Palmetto seems to be mostly for interior renovations. It's quite vague the way it's worded, but that's my take on it anyways.

[Spartan]

That makes more sense. That article was not very well written. Maybe the $30k is for that beige paint.