Conspiracy theories!

[Allison Slater]

But what about other countries' governments?

And still, one can say "it's everywhere" all they want, but that still doesn't provide much proof. Is there video of any of these people saying such things, and under what context?

[cityboi]

But what about other countries' governments?

And still, one can say "it's everywhere" all they want, but that still doesn't provide much proof. Is there video of any of these people saying such things, and under what context?

yes there are quotes from other governments and yes there is video of some. The rest are known declasified documents or things the press reported. They are all documented with evidence

[cityboi]

satelite image of one of the Martian poles. The martian poles contain water in the form of ice and the image appears to show large trees/vegitation. NASA says its frost but Alot of people dont buy that. they obviously appear to be three deminsional because they are casting shadows. They look alot like banyan trees

[Allison Slater]

That could be anythihng, really. The image isn't detailed enough to really label them as anything, IMHO.

What I never understood was the concept that alien life needs water or air to survive. The only life we truly know of is Earth Life. Yes, Earth Life may require that for survival, but what's to say any possible alien life would?

[cityboi]

That could be anythihng, really. The image isn't detailed enough to really label them as anything, IMHO.

What I never understood was the concept that alien life needs water or air to survive. The only life we truly know of is Earth Life. Yes, Earth Life may require that for survival, but what's to say any possible alien life would?

However life can evolve very differently on other worlds. Maybe there are condidtions on other planets were plant life needs other type of gases to live. Even on our own planet we have found that life can live in the most extreme environments on earth. Its narrow minded for us to think life can only evolve and live the way it does on earth. In regards to the NASA photo, the so called vegetation is located at the poles where there is water. What ever they are, they are three demensional because they are casting shadows so it cant be frost. And they obviously appear to have branches.

[Allison Slater]

I wouldn't call those branches. Not enough detail to be able to assume such. There are many things which could assume such shape.. possibly things we don't even know exist. They certainly couldn't be like trees on Earth, as the 'branches' in the photo are much too visible.

It could even just be mesas(?) of rock with a colour different from the ground around it which have fissures running about in them.

The possibilities are endless, really. I just don't think one can go around calling it vegetation, or anything else for that matter, until more is learned about it.

In the meantime, the only definition we have is indeed from Nasa, and they say it is frost.

[cityboi]

I wouldn't call those branches. Not enough detail to be able to assume such. There are many things which could assume such shape.. possibly things we don't even know exist. They certainly couldn't be like trees on Earth, as the 'branches' in the photo are much too visible.

It could even just be mesas(?) of rock with a colour different from the ground around it which have fissures running about in them.

The possibilities are endless, really. I just don't think one can go around calling it vegetation, or anything else for that matter, until more is learned about it.

In the meantime, the only definition we have is indeed from Nasa, and they say it is frost.

you never know

[Charlotteman]

Wow! When I started this thread I had no idea it would attract such interest. My sincere thanks to all of you that have posted.

I've enjoyed reading all your posts. Hopefully everyone who is interested in UFOs is familiar with the Vril Society, a Berlin based group who started building and flying what we call "flying saucers" as early as 1934. There are some terrific pics of Vril Society craft on Google image search.

If man was able to build and fly a "flying saucer" as far back as 1934, why are we so shocked when we see similarly shaped craft in our skies today? Why the huge leap from flying saucer to alien craft? Man can build and fly flying saucers as we speak!

The leap is because we all want to believe. But the US military has been working on fantastic stuff for decades. When we see a craft in the sky acting against laws of physics, then I would say that means our science is further advanced than we have been lead to believe.

Another question I have---if aliens are able to visit the Earth, which would mean they are technologically superior, wouldn't they be technologically able to avert crashes? with force fields or something? I always wondered that about the Roswell lore---if they are smart enough to get here, aren't they smart enough to avert crashes?

And if aliens are visiting the Earth, they must be technologically superior. Seeing us with all our wars, and all our murders, and rapes, and all the horrible things people do, wouldn't it make the aliens want to keep a safe distance? Like when people go to a zoo----fun to watch, but definitely keep a safe distance. If I was an alien from space I wouldn't make contact with such a deadly, dangerous race.....

No one wants to believe more than me. But I have to see proof>

[Miesian Corners]

I've been sitting in the DEN airport for hours and thus far, no lizard people sightings, I looked at the artwork and didn't find the New World Order depicted anywhere, and the keystone looks just like a keystone.

Next.

[cityboi]

I think even a race more supurior than man can still make mistakes. From what insiders (Bob Lazar) have said, our gravity field affects their craft which is why they wobble alot. so crashes would still be possible.

Many people think they are the fallen angels that are mentioned in the book of Genesis in the Bible. The Bible said these fallen angels from the heavens took earth women and produced offspring. That means these fallen angels werent invisible spirits but physical beings. And they also werent human. We hear this same story throughout all ancient civilizations just like the flood. So there must be some truth in this some where. Even in todays time it sounds very similar to UFO abductions where aliens are producing hybrid offspring. Some ancient civilizations called these beings from the heavens "the watchers" That would certainly describe modern day extraterestrial since they dont seem to intervene in human affairs.

If there is an evil agenda here, I dont think the "aliens" want themselves widely known. Just like when you are playing cards, you hide your hand.

I think just because you cant see something that doesnt mean its not there. I believe there is intelligent life out there. If man evolved into intellegent creatures, then im sure there is intellegent life elsewhere. The universe is made of the same matter and characteristics so what happened here on earth can easily be duplicated elsewhere. Its foolish to think we are the only ones just like it was foolish to think the sun and stars revolved areound the earth and just like it was foolish to think that the only planets in the universe were in our solar system. That was the scientific thinking in the past.

Level of intellegence could vary dramatically. There could be intellegent life out there less advance than us and there could be life out there more advanced than us to the point that they can travel vast distances across the universe in a short period of time. That level of technology is reason enough for the world goverenments to keep this secret. Until people stop thinking that UFOs are nothing more than science fiction nonsense, the truth will never come out.

[Charlotteman]

Until people stop thinking that UFOs are nothing more than science fiction nonsense, the truth will never come out.

I agree with you on this. All sightings should be taken seriously, and examined when possible. To brush something off as science fiction before looking into it is unscientific. Of course the Universe is teaming with life!

Mankind has been seeing inexplicable things for centuries. In the past they were described as "gnomes" "fairies" "serpents" "angels" etc. Today's "explanation" to unknown things in the sky is that they are alien spacecraft.

I doubt countries of the world could keep such a thing secret for so long. Someone, somewhere, would sell that info to a magazine or newpaper for $millions$. Greed is too strong for a secret that profound to last.

And I'm about 95% convinced Robert Lazar is a CIA/ONI disinformation agent.

[Justadude]

^ It would be easier to buy into UFO sightings if they weren't consistently revealed to be other, ordinary events. As you say above, it would be almost impossible to cover up something this huge for such a long period of time if any ordinary Joe were able to stumble across definitive evidence from his own backyard.

[cityboi]

^ It would be easier to buy into UFO sightings if they weren't consistently revealed to be other, ordinary events. As you say above, it would be almost impossible to cover up something this huge for such a long period of time if any ordinary Joe were able to stumble across definitive evidence from his own backyard.

well I think it leaks out all the time but the problem is we have the mentality that you need scientific proof. Instead we see strange lights in sky, documents that people try to debunk as a hoax and stories from people, many which are credible. But thats not enough to say we are being visited despite the evidence.

[Justadude]

BTW, the following link gives the real story about the "sighting" during the Apollo 11 mission:

http://www.debunker.com/texts/apollo11.html

[cityboi]

BTW, the following link gives the real story about the "sighting" during the Apollo 11 mission:

http://www.debunker.com/texts/apollo11.html

so NASA is capable of lying? Its nothing but an attempt to cover-up things that have been leaked out. The goverenment has been highly successfull at this with disinformation and so forth. It must be swamp gas or a comet. Nothing on that website proves that it didnt happen. Even if Neil Armstrong says he didnt see UFOs because it sure seems like he wants to just put the whole thing behind him. Like I said its extremly odd that the origianal Apollo film is missing. and there are also anomolies in the photographs themselves as if things in the photos have been covered up. There are clear examples of this kind of photo tampering. For example in some of the photos, the camera crosshairs are behind objects in the photos. Stars are not visible in a number of photos as if the sky has been blacked out. There is no atmosphere on the moon so stars should be clearly visible. In some NASA Apollo moon images you can even see "cloned" terrian as if something in the photo was covered up.

[Allison Slater]

I wouldn't be so quick to label all of that as disinformation. You seem to take any UFO-supporting evidence and praise it immediately, and just as quickly label anything that suggests against UFOs as lies or disinformation, which doesn't exactly make much of the information you spread believable.

Now, as for the crosshairs, that is indeed odd. It's also odd to think that they would have messed up on such a big and obvious element.

[Gusterfell]

There are clear examples of this kind of photo tampering. For example in some of the photos, the camera crosshairs are behind objects in the photos. Stars are not visible in a number of photos as if the sky has been blacked out. There is no atmosphere on the moon so stars should be clearly visible.

Not to debunk the entire "UFOs on the moon" conspiracy (which I believe to be possible), but both of these anomalies are easily explainable through the limitations of photography. Cameras can't discern extremes of light and dark anywhere near as well as the human eye. What this means is that if the camera is set to properly expose the brightly lit foreground objects, the relatively faint pinpoints of stars will be underexposed to the point they aren't visible. Go outside on a clear, starry night and take a picture of something brightly-lit. You won't see any stars in the photo.

The anomaly with the crosshairs could easily be caused by a similar circumstance. Notice that in all cases the object the crosshair is "behind" is much brighter than the background. The camera was set to properly expose the background, which is why it appears in detail. These brighter objects are severely overexposed, causing their surface detail to be blown out. Likewise the white glare from the overexposure will blow out the fine line of the crosshair if the camera isn't powerful enough to resolve it.

Both these issues would be magnified if (as is extremely likely online) the photos we are looking at are at a lower resolution that the originals.

Since this is sort of anti-conspiracy, for balance I want to offer a pro-conspiracy responce to Charlotteman's earlier post:

Another question I have---if aliens are able to visit the Earth, which would mean they are technologically superior, wouldn't they be technologically able to avert crashes? with force fields or something? I always wondered that about the Roswell lore---if they are smart enough to get here, aren't they smart enough to avert crashes?

Not necessarily. Our own space program would seem like fantastically advanced technology to an ordinary person of just 100 years ago. As we all know the technology isn't perfect, and occasionally results in terrible failures. UFOs apparently involve extremely advanced technology, but that doesn't necessarily mean that whoever possesses that technology (whether human or alien) have perfected it to the point that accidents never occur.

If the government were in possession of crashproof technology, wouldn't it make sense to install it on military and government aircraft and spacecraft, if not on commercial aircraft?

[Allison Slater]

To add to that, we still have accidnets with fireworks, and those have been around for at least a thousand years.

[Charlotteman]

Earlier in the thread was a discussion about Hollow Earth Theory. I find it a facinating concept.

As was mentioned earlier, for thousands and thousands of years people believed the Earth was flat. All they had to do is "look around and see it with their own eyes".

For thousands and thousands of years people thought the sun and planets revolved around the Earth. All they had to do was "look at the night skies and clearly see it".

Until the early 20th Century, people thought the Milky Way and the Universe were one in the same. No real questioning of it~

The discovery that Jupiter, Uranus and Neptune have rings wasn't until the 1970s. Until then, no one really considered any of the other planets might have rings besides Saturn........ because "you couldn't see any rings around them through telescopes"

We just can't flippantly dismiss the possibility that the Earth is hollow just because for many years people believed it was solid. History has many examples (like the ones I mentioned above) of long established thought being totally discredited as the years go by. And we can't ever forget the famous quip "the Universe is queerer than we could ever suppose." .

I'm still a little confused how Hollow Earth Theory supposedly became a governmental conspiracy. Anyone have any other thoughts to share on this?

[cityboi]

Admiral Byrd wrote in his diary that he flew into the indside of the earth through the north pole. Because the curviture is gradual, he claimed he couldnt even tell when he flew in. Supposedly there is an inner surface with an atmosphere and a star like oblect at the center of the earth that is not as bright as the sun. The admiral claimed that he saw animals that have long been extinct on the outer surface such as mammoths and that the trees and plants are much bigger. He also claimed that he encountered people there that were 10 to 12 feet tall. (In the book of Genesis in the Bible, it talks of "giants being in the earth in those days")

One thing to note. Today Flying directly over the north pole is off limits and NASA refuses to show real time images of the north pole and thats a fact.

here is a graphic

[JerseyBoy]

So you actually believe there is a hole at the top of the Earth?

[cityboi]

LOL maybe thats the explainantion for the Northern lights.

[Charlotteman]

LOL maybe thats the explainantion for the Northern lights.

Seems like I read that some Hollow Earth advocates imagine the Aurora Borealis is caused by escaping Inner-Earth atmosphere (escaping through a hole at the North Pole)

Hollow Earth is a cool thing to ponder and imagine. The conspiracy of governments to keep it secret makes sense only if you bring up the Arctic's closed airspace, and the limited number of longitudinal satellite orbits. Of course that airspace could be closed off to keep weapons systems secret.

Hiding behind almost every conspiracy theory, I see the US Military Industrial Complex. hehhee

[cityboi]

I think it would be very cool if the earth is Hollow. Its like finding new unexplored territory much like during the Christopher Columbus days. Some scientists have provided evidence that the earth is hollow they way earthquakes cause the earth to "ring like a bell" indicating a hollow earth. When the astronaut went to the moon, they did tests and it to rang like a bell. What if all planets and moon were hollow. I think think if scientist have a much better understading of how planets are formed we might have the answers to some of these questions

[Justadude]

I don't think there is a hole at the top of the earth, but it's entirely possible that the planet is hollow. I would recommend Bill Bryson's bestseller, "A Short History of Nearly Everything", for a digestible and fairly light-hearted review of our attempts to solve the question.

The fact of the matter is that we are not as advanced technologically as we think we are. Our attempts to understand the inside of the earth are like a person trying to figure out what's inside a house by tapping softly on an outside wall and poking it with a toothpick. The only thing we know for certain is that the crust is fairly hard, and that it has something underneath. What's under there will probably not be discovered for several hundred more years if at all.