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GvilleSC

The Confederate flag issue rekindled

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Interesting video. The NAACP's efforts and way of going about this aren't going to make any friends in South Carolina's State House. As a result, the rag is going to fly atop that pole for longer than it had to. It has become more of a pride issue now and it seems to me that a lot of people are more concerned about the "slippery slope" possibility. If the NCAA takes any action on this issue in South Carolina, they need to make an agreement with the NAACP that it must take care of some bigger issues facing that Black community in the state-- if one or the other doesn't hold up their end of the bargain, then the other doesn't have to either.

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Regardless of Biden's intentions, his statements were on point.

If the NCAA takes any action on this issue in South Carolina, they need to make an agreement with the NAACP that it must take care of some bigger issues facing that Black community in the state-- if one or the other doesn't hold up their end of the bargain, then the other doesn't have to either.

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The NAACP is just doing it's job. The State of South Carolina needs to step up to the plate and do the right thing. It's time for SC to come clean with it's past and move forward.

Trying to shift the debate to other tangential issues will only worsen the problem. Enough already. Fix the darn thing, it's been broke for too long.

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Regardless of Biden's intentions, his statements were on point.

What other issues, and what justification do you see for having the NCAA hold the NAACP to this?

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Did the NAACP not agree to move the flag off the dome to its current place? I'm assuming they did because if some sort of agreement wasn

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The NAACP is just doing it's job. The State of South Carolina needs to step up to the plate and do the right thing. It's time for SC to come clean with it's past and move forward.

Trying to shift the debate to other tangential issues will only worsen the problem. Enough already. Fix the darn thing, it's been broke for too long.

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I have a good compromise too: we have Memorial Park at Hampton & Gadsden, which is home to war memorials and other memorials for SC. Lets move the flag there on a new Confederate momument or Civil War monument, then move on with our lives.

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I dont know. They want it off of the State House grounds, right? Seems like that would do the trick.

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In an effort to make a statement to the rest of the nation about South Carolina, I say move confederate monument/memorial from the FRONT of the State House to a corner or other location on the grounds. It deserves a place on the grounds, but not front and center-- it's not a front and center issue anymore. As a result, replace it with a piece of art or a statue of some sort that will represent where the state is headed (maybe something tied to a new economy emerging from the dust of an old one)??? In the same gesture as moving the monument, move the flag like Spartan suggested.

It would take a shadow off of South Carolina and off of Columbia.

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This is actually a good point. Scoop, you may have just single handedly changed my position on this issue.

This debate over the flag is the most asinine issue ever. If we take the flag down NOTHING will change. Nothing. It would be a moral victory at best. I think the NAACP has outlived its usefulness to the African-American Community. I haven't seen them do anything worthwhile lately. But you know, if moving that flag will shut them up and force them to focus on the real issues in this state that GvilleSC mentioned then thats fine. I have a good compromise too: we have Memorial Park at Hampton & Gadsden, which is home to war memorials and other memorials for SC. Lets move the flag there on a new Confederate momument or Civil War monument, then move on with our lives.

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I am an African-American and a member of the NAACP, so it's evident that I don't concurr that the organization has outlived it's usefulness. As long as we have racial issues in the US, there will be a need for organizations such as the NAACP to exist.

In order to move forward, we need to truly respect others and seek to dialogue with them to solve those issues that divide us.

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Maybe I'm slow, but what does any of this have to do with Furman hosting a I-AA playoff game or Clemson hosting a baseball playoff regional or having a cross country championship in the state?

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Maybe I'm slow, but what does any of this have to do with Furman hosting a I-AA playoff game or Clemson hosting a baseball playoff regional or having a cross country championship in the state?

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The NCAA imposed these sanctions not the NAACP. The sanctions were a result of SC's refusal to abide by the requirements of the NCAA policies relative to respect for all of it's students. You may want to check the NCAA's site for it's guidelines regarding compliance.

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Yes, sadly enough racial issues do still exist in this country. Unfortunately a group that claims to be solving or trying to solve these issues, really is the source of some racial issues itself, IMO.

And yes to move forward we need to truly respect others and seek to dialogue with them. Unfortunately the NAACP doesn't always feel that it's necessary to be a part of dialogues or to give a little to gain something. Two groups have very strong and opposite feelings for the flag and BOTH must be respected.

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Yes, I'm quite aware of the NCAA's obtuseness on many, many issues including this one. Lots of folks have speculated that the NCAA as an organization will break up in the next 10 years or so due to the weight of lots of issues.

Point is Clemson hosting a super regional against Arkansas, or Furman hosting a playoff game against UMass, or having the NCAA basketball tournament in Greenville has really nothing to do with where a flag may or may not be over a hundred miles away in Columbia.

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I don't necessary like the verbiage that you choose to express your point. "Shut them up", is a bit condesending and disrespectable but I guess that's on you. In order to move forward, we need to truly respect others and seek to dialogue with them to solve those issues that divide us.

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They imposed the sanctions against the state not a city or school. All state schools that belong to the NCAA comes under this umbrella.

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Bringing down the flag is an issue of "advancing colored people" in society. But having the flag off of the state house's grounds isn't going to magically improve the lives of African Americans in SC or the US.

High School gradutation rate for Black students:

- Nationally: 55%

Dropout Rate:

-South Carolina: 13.1% of high school freshmen

Higher Education graduation rate for Black students:

-Nationally: 42%

Reasons for dropping out as cited by the SC Dept of Education:

-Socioeconomic background

-Mobility

-Family Structure

-Attitude toward school

-Support in the home

-Poverty

-Low expectations

-Abuse

-Parent level of education

-Language and literacy levels

Improving graduation rates at both the high school and college level for black students is the best way to advance individuals in society. Unemployment rates are statistically lower for those with more education. Some of the reasons for dropping out as stated above are things that need to be worked on and improved upon. This should be where the NAACP steps in, IMO, and truly takes strides toward "advancing colored people."

sources:

http://www.manhattan-institute.org/html/cr_48.htm

ed.sc.gov

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In an effort to make a statement to the rest of the nation about South Carolina, I say move confederate monument/memorial from the FRONT of the State House to a corner or other location on the grounds. It deserves a place on the grounds, but not front and center-- it's not a front and center issue anymore. As a result, replace it with a piece of art or a statue of some sort that will represent where the state is headed (maybe something tied to a new economy emerging from the dust of an old one)??? In the same gesture as moving the monument, move the flag like Spartan suggested.

It would take a shadow off of South Carolina and off of Columbia.

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Furman is not a state school, neither is the City of Greenville's Bi-Lo Center which hosted the NCAA basketball tournament four years ago, but won't get it again because of the boycott.

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It was a poor choise of words, as I mean no disrespect. I am simply tired of hearing about this issue because it is so irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. So, if moving the flag will silence this issue and bring light to other more important ones, then that is what needs to be done. But like you said, it takes both sides respecting the other's thoughts and opinions on the issue at hand. So far I've not seen that from the NAACP itself, though people such as yourself seem more willing to listen to the ideas of others.

As for the VRA- I have major issues with preclearance, and I don't see how the NAACP had any significant impact on that bill, which had a large amount of support anyway from what I recall. My main problem is that its based on 1960s population demographics, and this unfairly targets Southern States. If preclearance is going to continue to exist, it needs to use current population demographics.

As for the flag.... Personally, I am in that 'heritage not hate' category. This flag, no matter how devisive, is a part of our history now. I understand that people-particularly AfricanAmericans- are offended by the battle flag, and the naval jack "rectangular" flag that we are so familiar with today. These flags have been used to promote hate and segregation- so, I am not opposed to moving it for that reason. I think that at the very least we should put up a real Confederate Flag that actually pertains to SC (in the new location of course), as the one that flies today originated in Virginia, and very few South Carolinians fought and died under it. The 1st flag of the Confederacy (the stars and bars) seems appropriate to me.

You said you agree that a flag at a monument in a different location would be acceptable. Keeping in mind that the Memorial Park may still technically be "state" property -I honestly don't know who owns it- do you think the NAACP would agree with that idea?

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