GR suggests Metro Gov't

[tamias6]

The city and county merging would not be feasible anyway because the county as a whole is not dense enough to support it as there are still plenty of rural areas left inside the county. But I don't think that is the point. The point is a merger of GR proper and its immediate communities would leave nothing for any politically touchy townships to worry about except for increased competition from a merged GR. In fact a merged GR would be a benefit to surrounding townships as increase political clout from a much larger and far more powerful city would tend to shift the political balance at the state level more into West Michigan's favor than it is now. That could potentially squeeze out more revenue sharing, funnel more funds to struggling school districts and get more grants from state and federal sources to build big ticket projects such as a fixed guide way based mass transit service.

[GR8-town]

Exactly my point. You said this merger was brought up in the 40's or 50's and the main reason why EGR incorporated into a City from a Village in 1926 was due to the residential development expansion from the west of GR towards EGR. I'm interested in the reason why a merger came up in the 40/50's???

On another note, State law in Michigan requires a city-wide vote on any proposed de-annexation from a city. However, I believe a shift in school-district boundary lines falls within the powers of the KISD, not on a city or district-wide vote.

[francishsu]

Supporters of consolidation might take heart at one thing Granholm mentioned in her State of the State address:

Tonight I am proposing a change to revenue-sharing payments to local governments.

Cities and townships that want to see their revenue sharing increase this year will need to show us they are sharing services or consolidating with other units of government to save taxpayers money.

It's simple. When they show us they're consolidating or sharing, we'll "show them the money."

[Veloise]

Supporters of consolidation might take heart at one thing Granholm mentioned in her State of the State address:

[MJLO]

I'm missing something. Is she proposing consolidating districts? That would make a bit of sense to me, Especially in places like Wyoming where they have a cluster F*** of school districts.

[RustTown]

She was talking about that and more:

"And our local partners must do the same. Michigan's counties, cities and villages, townships, and school districts all must do more to share and consolidate resources."

[tamias6]

Well going by what the governor has laid out, GR and surrounding communities must consolidate in some way, shape , or form if they ever want to get more money from the state. The writing is on the wall, GR and fellow communities. So lets merge!

[Rizzo]

As best as it is to hear from the Governor about this issue, I think it won't help much for the argument to consolidate cities or services. The people who need incentives to consolidate are the townships. Wasn't it said earlier in this thread that townships aren't exactly hurting, its only the city?

Traverse City was set to seriously look at consolidating their Fire and Police into a Metro wide service. I'm not quite sure where that went. I also believe Lansing's Mayor is looking at this issue.

[MJLO]

but will doing something like that create a larger municipality? or just cross juristictional services, like a county sherrif?

[GRDadof3]

but will doing something like that create a larger municipality? or just cross juristictional services, like a county sherrif?

[FilmMaker]

I keep wondering where everyone is getting the notion that townships are somehow immune to the financial challenges faced by all units of government?

The truth is, the recent deregulation of the cable TV industry is simply the latest in a litany of financial set-backs for townships over the past few years. Cable licensing fees are (were) one of the most significant sources of revenue for townships. Let me see if I can list a few other set-backs: significant fire/police/disaster investments required by post-911 security measures, ridiculous (and in some cases multiple) investments in new (and not always better) voting technology (thanks to recent election debacles), increased local expense to provide services and infrastructure that Counties and the State simply no longer wish to provide... etc, etc, etc.

Perhaps cities get a lot more press about their troubles - but they are not alone - and the shrinking budgets of townships should not be perceived as some sort of pot-of-gold at the end of some legislative rainbow.

If I were to interpret Granholm's comments, I'd say she is probably encouraging cooperation because she knows ALL municipalities are facing challenges - - NOT because she thinks townships are a budgetary cornucopia to be pillaged by desperate cities and counties.

Instead of arguing over who seems to "have it good" and "who doesn't" - - how about we spend our energies trying to identify specific and workable ways to streamline costs across boundaries?

[mifunboy]

Exactly my point. You said this merger was brought up in the 40's or 50's and the main reason why EGR incorporated into a City from a Village in 1926 was due to the residential development expansion from the west of GR towards EGR. I'm interested in the reason why a merger came up in the 40/50's???

On another note, State law in Michigan requires a city-wide vote on any proposed de-annexation from a city. However, I believe a shift in school-district boundary lines falls within the powers of the KISD, not on a city or district-wide vote.

[MJLO]

Actually I think the State should just shove it down the fake cities and townships throats. They were developed as tax shelters and have no vallid reason for being. People moved there to avoid the city's taxes while basking in the services and jobs the major cities provide. I say that unless a suburb or town exited for a huge length of time in its own right, it is a farce and a tax shelter.

The townships, suburbs do not even resemble towns or cities. Many of these townships and cities were also created to create a zone that black people could not live in, cough East Lansing cough.

[suydam]

Actually I think the State should just shove it down the fake cities and townships throats. They were developed as tax shelters and have no vallid reason for being. People moved there to avoid the city's taxes while basking in the services and jobs the major cities provide. I say that unless a suburb or town exited for a huge length of time in its own right, it is a farce and a tax shelter.

The townships, suburbs do not even resemble towns or cities. Many of these townships and cities were also created to create a zone that black people could not live in, cough East Lansing cough.

[ted124b]

http://www.woodtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=6...mp;nav=0RceeChq

Interesting article, I dont know if it has been mentioned in this thread before. Local mayors reacting to Granholm's call for consolidation. From what it sounds like many local communities in the metro GR area have already consolidated services to save money.

[NorthCoast]

Actually I think the State should just shove it down the fake cities and townships throats. They were developed as tax shelters and have no vallid reason for being. People moved there to avoid the city's taxes while basking in the services and jobs the major cities provide. I say that unless a suburb or town exited for a huge length of time in its own right, it is a farce and a tax shelter.

The townships, suburbs do not even resemble towns or cities. Many of these townships and cities were also created to create a zone that black people could not live in, cough East Lansing cough.

[rstravis]

Sorry it took so long to say this -- I haven't read this forum in awhile. But I had to respond to something a page or two back. Anyone who is concerned about an area losing its identity only has to look at Standale. It has never been an incorporated city. It was unincorporated, within Walker Township, and part of the Grandville School District. Then it became part of the city of Walker. And yet, through all of that, it has very much retained its identity. The census bureau does not recognize it. It is not on many maps. And yet, it is still very much a community with an identity.

So it can be done. That argument just doesn't hold water.

[tamias6]

Also look at Uptown, Eastown, Westside, and Heartside. They are districts of the city of GR and yet they have very strong self identities at least in the eyes of locals.

Sorry it took so long to say this -- I haven't read this forum in awhile. But I had to respond to something a page or two back. Anyone who is concerned about an area losing its identity only has to look at Standale. It has never been an incorporated city. It was unincorporated, within Walker Township, and part of the Grandville School District. Then it became part of the city of Walker. And yet, through all of that, it has very much retained its identity. The census bureau does not recognize it. It is not on many maps. And yet, it is still very much a community with an identity.

So it can be done. That argument just doesn't hold water.

[mjak68]

Looks like we may see consolidation sooner than later. I think this would be fabulous for our region and give us way more clout in Lansing and beyond. Love the comparison with Louisville. Mlive has the story.

[FloridaSpartan]

there has been some consolidation down here in S. Florida. Broward Sheriff's Office has contracted with all but a couple of city governments to handle the police and fire. This has definitely been successful. As a result, BSO is one of the largest, if not the largest police/fire dept. Consolidation in the GR area of just police and fire would eliminate a lot of overlapping, wasteful administrative work, while increasing the services that could be offered with a larger budget.

Even more that MI could do to save money would be to consolidate more public schools...all the way up through the universities. Why does every college need a dean and all of the same administrative positions? In the private sector their is one CEO that runs large organizations. Seems that govt could learn a lot from private industry on efficiency.

[fotoman311]

there has been some consolidation down here in S. Florida. Broward Sheriff's Office has contracted with all but a couple of city governments to handle the police and fire. This has definitely been successful. As a result, BSO is one of the largest, if not the largest police/fire dept. Consolidation in the GR area of just police and fire would eliminate a lot of overlapping, wasteful administrative work, while increasing the services that could be offered with a larger budget.

Even more that MI could do to save money would be to consolidate more public schools...all the way up through the universities. Why does every college need a dean and all of the same administrative positions? In the private sector their is one CEO that runs large organizations. Seems that govt could learn a lot from private industry on efficiency.

[LA Dave]

there has been some consolidation down here in S. Florida. Broward Sheriff's Office has contracted with all but a couple of city governments to handle the police and fire. This has definitely been successful. As a result, BSO is one of the largest, if not the largest police/fire dept. Consolidation in the GR area of just police and fire would eliminate a lot of overlapping, wasteful administrative work, while increasing the services that could be offered with a larger budget.

Even more that MI could do to save money would be to consolidate more public schools...all the way up through the universities. Why does every college need a dean and all of the same administrative positions? In the private sector their is one CEO that runs large organizations. Seems that govt could learn a lot from private industry on efficiency.

[suydam]

While consolidation of school districts has its place (there is no reason in Hades why the City of Wyoming has what, three separate school districts?), the notion of consolidating universities is ridiculous. Are you arguing for the consolidation of universities in separate locations, with separate student bodies? Or are you arguing that, for example, the University of Michigan Law School and the University of Michigan Medical School can have the same dean? Or the Michigan State Vet school and the Michigan State College of Osteopathic Medicine?

The last thing Michigan should be doing is messing around with the higher education system, one of the few attractions left in the Wolverine State. (As the parent of a California high school senior, I can tell you that U-M is one of the hottest colleges at my son's high school, with several students planning to attend (and pay the high out of state tuition).

[LA Dave]

I don't think anyone would (or should) touch UofM.

What about the smaller state schools though? Seems like we are the only state where (random selection) Ferris has to compete with Oakland using marketing dollars (which are just tuition and/or taxpayer funds). They're both schools.

For the sake of comparison, when I go to Wisconsin, UW Whitewater doesn't have billboards all over Stevens Point (home to UW Stevens Point).

On the contrary, in Michigan, I've seen Oakland University billboards in GR and I've seen GVSU billboards near Rochester.

I've never really understood that aspect of our state's higher education system. That part would seem open for discussion to me (which I fully agree, hands off UofM, MSU, and anything else with a truly global reputation).

[gvsusean]

That's a fair comment. I do think that a certain amount of coordination on what programs are offered at which of the "second-tier" schools (not a judgment on quality, just on size)is appropriate. For example, should Oakland U expand a program that already is in place at Grand Valley? I think that it would be a mistake to allow one of these universities, for example, to set up another law school in addition to the schools now in place at Michigan, WSU and Michigan State. There is simply is no need for another law school. And, I suppose that one could try to allocate specialty programs (which can only be served by one college) among the universities. For example, GVSU has an excellent masters program in knieseology (sp?); no need for Eastern, for example, to duplicate that program unless there is a demonstrated need for it. The problem is, of course, that there is no higher ed czar to make that allocation decision. As far as I know, a self-governing university is free to establish new departments so long as they can fit within its budget.

Interesting comment about the billboards. The reality is, of course, that GVSU is drawing an increasing number of students from the Detroit area due to the perceived quality of its programs. I doubt that Oakland is having similar success in Kent and Ottawa Counties.