Greensboro's population to grow by 15,000 people after annexation

[cityboi]

This isn't always true. The city of Va. Beach has a population of about 450,000 residents, but the northern half is mainly suburbs while the southern half of the city is rural farmland and swamps. There is no true downtown with skyscrapers, etc. The city takes up nearly 500 sq miles of land. Norfolk is deemed the true downtown of the Hampton Roads region with a population almost half that of Virginia Beach.

The same can be said about other mega suburbs like Cary and a lot of cities right around Los Angeles. Even though they have booming populations they lack urbanity and will continue to do so because of the history of the city/town and also because of the way "development" is being driven.

[krazeeboi]

The laws are liberal so that cities can annex to remain high on lists?

Atlanta, Miami, Boston, Minneapolis, Cleveland, St. Louis, half of New Jersey, etc. may have annexation laws as barriers, but are also now surrounded by other sovereign municipalities, so not really relevant to any NC city, all of which still have much available land around them, even land bloated CLT could gobble up another 100 or so square miles in Mecklenburg (god forbid). The list/ranking mentality is not productive, metro/urbanized area is more meaningful anyway. If a city is being robbed of a legitimate tax base or residents are lacking services then great, annex, but for the stated purpose to keep up with their rivals? Come on, that's krazee. ;/

[cityboi]

No, not to keep up with rivals, but to have the municipal population size more accurately reflect the size of the city's urban area. It goes more towards accurate representation of a city's TRUE size.

Let's face it, only us urban junkies and statistics freaks know anything about urbanized area population, or even MSA/CSA population. When most people want to get a feel for how large a place is, the first stat they look up is municipal population. Now it may be shallow to annex to simply pander to the largely geography-ignorant public (sad but true), but that's essentially how things work. At any rate, I only think that was one stated purpose for annexation, as I didn't read the entire article.

But as I've stated, if it causes no signficant burden to the city from a financial perspective, why not?

I think that has more to do with the way cities get incorporated in Virginia than anything else. VA Beach was essentially created as an "anti-city" to Norfolk.

[blburton]

Right. My point was just that high population and urbanity don't necessarily correlate with a place becoming more urban and more nationally well known. Ok... I guess I'm off topic now. Sorry.

[cityboi]

Right. My point was just that high population and urbanity don't necessarily correlate with a place becoming more urban and more nationally well known. Ok... I guess I'm off topic now. Sorry.

[nowensone]

I feel GSO should screw the annexation crap and concentrate on building some identifiable core to it - that IMO will be the thing that attracts people and businesses here if we're going to discuss the more superficial aspects of civic programs and actions. Too many people have described it as a "suburb", to which in the past I have replied "suburb of what?". But the observation is a valid one - other than North Elm and couple of other downtown streets and neighborhoods, GSO is nothing but a suburb. An older and very beautiful one, no doubt about it, but has very few externally distinguishing features other than the Coliseum which is on High Point Road.

Not advocating skyscrapers, by the way, just centralization, which is just kinda sorta maybe beginning to happen. That is a better way to draw business, residents and achieve the bragging rights, rankings, whatever. But really I'd just like to concentrate on improvements and not worry about slipping down NC's population lists. Years ago GSO was first on America's most livable cities list or something like that, but has since slipped something like 100 places. These surveys are mostly crap, however, they do highlight a few benchmarks that GSO has ceased to be competitive on, like a plummeting educational system (scores and overcrowding), gangs/crime, etc. I think ultimately businesses and residents must locate in cities that are good in these areas, not the most populous.

To quote Yoda, "Annex not, improve self you must". ;D

[cityboi]

I feel GSO should screw the annexation crap and concentrate on building some identifiable core to it - that IMO will be the thing that attracts people and businesses here if we're going to discuss the more superficial aspects of civic programs and actions. Too many people have described it as a "suburb", to which in the past I have replied "suburb of what?". But the observation is a valid one - other than North Elm and couple of other downtown streets and neighborhoods, GSO is nothing but a suburb. An older and very beautiful one, no doubt about it, but has very few externally distinguishing features other than the Coliseum which is on High Point Road.

Not advocating skyscrapers, by the way, just centralization, which is just kinda sorta maybe beginning to happen. That is a better way to draw business, residents and achieve the bragging rights, rankings, whatever. But really I'd just like to concentrate on improvements and not worry about slipping down NC's population lists. Years ago GSO was first on America's most livable cities list or something like that, but has since slipped something like 100 places. These surveys are mostly crap, however, they do highlight a few benchmarks that GSO has ceased to be competitive on, like a plummeting educational system (scores and overcrowding), gangs/crime, etc. I think ultimately businesses and residents must locate in cities that are good in these areas, not the most populous.

To quote Yoda, "Annex not, improve self you must". ;D

[krazeeboi]

I feel GSO should screw the annexation crap and concentrate on building some identifiable core to it - that IMO will be the thing that attracts people and businesses here if we're going to discuss the more superficial aspects of civic programs and actions.

[nowensone]

I doubt that Durham would catch Greensboro, annexation or not, considering completion of the new FedEx hub, completion of most of the urban loop, the A&T/UNCG biotech development, and an expanding city center that's on the verge of a boom.

[cityboi]

I don't know, Durham's current pace is much greater than GSO's. The fact it is adjacent in places to Raleigh is giving it lots of spillover growth in addition to it's own inertial growth, and then you add annexation on top of that and it seems likely to surpass GSO quite soon actually. The FedEx hub, HondaJet, the biotech center, etc. will I agree allow it to catch up at some point, but I think Durham will probably be larger for a decade or so until that happens.

It had been defacto mentioned, as annexing adjacent urbanized areas is typically for the tax base and services (in addition to keeping up with the Joneses ).

Greensboro's attitude, to my perceptions, is a little on the relaxed and contented side, kind of like a retired and wealthy beach bum, nothing much to prove, other than it's propensity to annex to lead the Triad in population. The Ballpark first, and now Centre Point and a few other DT projects may have recently given people here a reason to aspire to more, but I think that will be a while in catching on, taking some time to build momentum. We don't have a Hugh McColl to essentially build a monster tower in a sea of grass and make instant momentum a la CLT (that's not entirely accurate, but I think the value of building the BoA tower can't be overestimated).

[cityboi]

for the time being Greensboro city leaders are looking to annex 10,000 people and over 8 square miles. Greensboro is currently estimated to have a population of 241,000 which means these mass annexations would bump the city's population to 251,000. The combined annexations will take effect June 30, 2008. Early announcements showed the city was looking to annex 15,000. I imagine the remaining 5,000 will be annexed in time for the 2010 census. Currently the city covers 122.6 square miles. Greensboro also will annex Citicards in eastern Guilford County which is a mile and a half east of the loop. Greensboro will then be 5 miles west of Burlington which has already annexed into Guilford County. Greensboro and Burlington are growing closer and closer together.

http://www.digtriad.com/news/top/article.a...29&catid=14

http://www.news-record.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...RSTAFF/70831024

[davidals]

^

Question, and some comments.

Why hasn't Greensboro annexed the Grandover/Sedgefield area (the city limits zig-zag up and down several streets through the area), and all of those neighborhoods between PTI and Lake Brandt (Lewiston-Fleming-Old Oak Ridge-Inman Road areas)? There's definitely the population and density in those areas, from what I've been able to see.

I may be wrong on this, but I think all or most of the big NC cities have a weak mayor set-up, which I tend to like - just looking at some of the NE cities with strong mayors, many of the most famous of those mayors seemed to run their cities into the ground, though I'm no political scientist - this is just an impression. I think the real success can come from a weak mayor who is an effective cheerleader and can sell their city in memorable ways; I think if you look down the road to Charlotte or the Triangle, a lot (or all) of the real accomplishments came from private-sector visionaries, academic visionaries, or a combination of the two - BoA, or RTP as examples. My opinion is a little uninformed, but it seems to me that the real gov't role is in recognizing private sector successes and advocating for an environment that would encourage more of the same. Though both Raleigh and Charlotte (and the Triad as well) have all done at least a little poaching business from elsewhere in the country, I think at least the foundations for the biggest successes at least started out with home-grown business risks that paid off well.

Would love to hear someone who's a little more schooled on this to weigh in with an opinion...

[cityboi]

I think there are areas that are just about on the brink of annexation but not quite there yet. The numbers (financially) have to work because that means the city has to provide extra services and the tax base in a targeted area probably needs to meet a threshold. But I agree that there are areas that should be annexed today.

Most NC cities are set up on a Council/Manager form of government where the mayor really doesnt have any power at all. In fact the City-Manager is really the leader of the city. In Greensboro the City manager is Mitchell Johnson. The mayor, at least in Greensboro basically just presides over city council meeting but has the same power as his fellow council members. Even though the mayor has no power, he can still be influential.

Greensboro City Manager Mitchell Johnson

Greensboro Mayor Keith Holliday

Mayor Keith Holliday is not seeking re-election this fall which means one of these two people will become Greensboro's new mayor. They are the only two thats running. If Yvonne Johnson is elected, she would become Greensboro's first African-American Mayor and second female mayor.

54 year old Yvonne Johnson (city council member and mayor protem)

63 year old Milton Kern (downtown developer)

[Creasy336]

for the time being Greensboro city leaders are looking to annex 10,000 people and over 8 square miles. Greensboro is currently estimated to have a population of 241,000 which means these mass annexations would bump the city's population to 251,000. The combined annexations will take effect June 30, 2008. Early announcements showed the city was looking to annex 15,000. I imagine the remaining 5,000 will be annexed in time for the 2010 census. Currently the city covers 122.6 square miles. Greensboro also will annex Citicards in eastern Guilford County which is a mile and a half east of the loop. Greensboro will then be 5 miles west of Burlington which has already annexed into Guilford County. Greensboro and Burlington are growing closer and closer together.

http://www.digtriad.com/news/top/article.a...29&catid=14

http://www.news-record.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...RSTAFF/70831024

[cityboi]

Brightwood Farms and Ridge Creek adjacent to exit 135 are slated to become Burlington proper in the near future putting Burlington 2-3 Miles from Greensboro. (Pending Greensboro's up and coming annexation of the Citicard/ Mt Hope Church Road area)

[Creasy336]

Yes there are alot of similarities. Greensboro still has alot of land to annex. I have always wondered why Greensboro hasn't annexed the Sedgefield area. Does it have something to due with Jamestown?

[cityboi]

Yes there are alot of similarities. Greensboro still has alot of land to annex. I have always wondered why Greensboro hasn't annexed the Sedgefield area. Does it have something to due with Jamestown?

[cityboi]

Here is this morning's article which says now that more than 10,000 people will be annexed and would put the city's population well over 250,000. part of the annexation takes Greensboro city limits beyond the I-40/business 40 split, less than a mile away from the Guilford/Forsyth County line.

http://www.news-record.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...STAFF/309010016

[JerseyBoy]

That's just extremely excessive if you ask me.

[cityboi]

I think it should have been annexed a long time ago. Winston did a similar mass annexation where 18,000 became a part of the city

[blburton]

I always think of the far NW areas to be annexed as Greensboro anyway. The increase in taxes yearly won't affect them too much since the avg yearly household income I'm sure is well over 70-80K.

not sure. I know Greensboro has an annexation agreement with High Point but I believe Sedgefield is in Greensboro's territory.

[cityboi]

I always think of the far NW areas to be annexed as Greensboro anyway. The increase in taxes yearly won't affect them too much since the avg yearly household income I'm sure is well over 70-80K.

[JerseyBoy]

I thought the towns of Summerfield and Oak Ridge (assuming that's what blburton meant by NW areas) were already incorporated?

[cityboi]

I thought the towns of Summerfield and Oak Ridge (assuming that's what blburton meant by NW areas) were already incorporated?

[cityboi]

City Council will take on the issue tonight. Most residents dont seem to be fighting this as you would expect in mass annexation so I would expect this to move forward without a hiccup. I think the Cardinal area could have been annexed 10 years ago so I think most residents in the highlighted areas have expected this for a long time.

http://www.news-record.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...RSTAFF/70904001