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It's Time To Remove the Confederate Battle Flag


tombarnes

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The country fought the Indians for many, many years under the American flag so we can have their land which we now reside on today.

How about the Bonnie Blue flag? It is is simple, easily recognized by anyone with a basic knowledge of the war, and attractive. There is no negative connotation to it. It's even got a song.

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...which did not include the preservation of the institution of slavery as a major goal, as it was for the South. That's the difference.

Slavery was no longer an economic necessity for the North, nor was it as economically beneficial as it was for the South. I don't agree with slavery as we are all people deserving of equal rights and treatment, but lets not pretend the North was morally pure and the civil war was about slavery.

Let's also not pretend that just because Mississippi has the confederate emblem in its flag that the people of Mississippi are racists. I judge a person by character and not by the color of his or her skin, I just don't like for someone to dictate what flag the state can or cannot fly. It would not hurt me at all if the flag was changed but it is normal to defend yourself when attacked.

What if Indians call for the flag of the United States of America to be changed because the history attached to it was offensive to them? What if the people in this country were to be offended by the Muslim flag because Muslim actions and beliefs (not all Muslims) aren't tolerant of our own? Where does it end?

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Slavery was no longer an economic necessity for the North, nor was it as economically beneficial as it was for the South. I don't agree with slavery as we are all people deserving of equal rights and treatment, but lets not pretend the North was morally pure and the civil war was about slavery.

Let's also not pretend that just because Mississippi has the confederate emblem in its flag that the people of Mississippi are racists. I judge a person by character and not by the color of his or her skin, I just don't like for someone to dictate what flag the state can or cannot fly. It would not hurt me at all if the flag was changed but it is normal to defend yourself when attacked.

What if Indians call for the flag of the United States of America to be changed because the history attached to it was offensive to them? What if the people in this country were to be offended by the Muslim flag because Muslim actions and beliefs (not all Muslims) aren't tolerant of our own? Where does it end?

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Slavery was no longer an economic necessity for the North, nor was it as economically beneficial as it was for the South. I don't agree with slavery as we are all people deserving of equal rights and treatment, but lets not pretend the North was morally pure and the civil war was about slavery.
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Well, it is obvious we cannot come to terms on this matter, but you can't please everybody. Let's just get rid of all flags and symbols because someone is going to be offended by them... that would make as much sense as singling one flag out when there are thousands of others someone may find offensive.

I never said the flag did not have negative connotations. But many flags do for many people for many different reasons. As far as the American flag representing freedom, that may be what it stands for for many people, but to others who were wronged under the flag it stands for injustice.

Just like the Confederate flag has different meaning to different people. It no more stands for slavery than the American flag stands for the injustice against Indians. We took their land under that flag and we fought to keep control of it under that flag.

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Both of you have valid points. The intent of my question was whether or not another referendum should be held on the subject in Mississippi. I have a strong suspicion that the old flag might not survive a new vote. As I have said before, it would be a good message to send out to the world if Mississippi were to jettison the stars and bars to the realm of history. There's nothing wrong with honoring one's ancestors, but the Confederate battle flag has become, for good or ill, a symbol which is detrimental to Mississippi's bright future. Let's send it to a museum where it belongs.

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...which did not include the preservation of the institution of slavery as a major goal, as it was for the South. That's the difference.

And perhaps that argument does have some validity. Just because a big ruckus isn't being made over that in comparison to the Confederate Battle flag issue doesn't mean it's any less valid.

I was told (by a Georgian) that despite the similarities, the number of stars (Georgia's has 13, representing the original colonies, whereas the CSA flag has 11) between both flags is what separates the Georgia state flag from the official flag of the CSA (at least symbolically).

Also, in reference to the "defiantly Southern" comment: why should Mississippi, or any other Southern state, be "defiantly" Southern? What is there to defy? And, as it has been said, is this a good way for the state to be represented nationally? IMO, a positive Southern identity, which may include unifying symbols for all of the state's peoples, is a much better way to represent the state.

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Somewhere needs to be defiantly Southern because the South is rapidly disappearing. Fewer and fewer people identify themselves as Southerners. Mississippi needs to be the one place that stays true to its Southern identity and just doesn't look like everywhere else. Our country is becoming so homogenized and losing its regional identities. Every town pretty much looks the same and has the same type of people. Mississippi should be like the Dixie Chicks (see previous post) and say to hell what everyone else thinks, we are going to be ourselves. It's not worth it to sell out just so everyone can have a large tract home and an SUV to take the kids to the mall and the megachurch in.
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Mississippi can remain true to its Southern identity (the positive aspects anyway) without being "defiant." I think that word is a bit too strong, and even then this sort of "defiance" would be much different than the defiance displayed during the days of the short-lived Confederacy. Furthermore, it seems as though you are implying that Mississippi should continue to perform poorly across many categories so as to discourage outsiders from moving in; this is the REAL reason why Mississippi isn't attracting many transplants, and it's not good for the state or its citizens. I don't think the flag really has much to do with it. Take my own state for instance; we continue to fly the Confederate battle flag in a position of honor and prominence on our Statehouse grounds, yet domestic migration into the state is on the rise (particularly along the coast) and "homogenization" is definitely occurring. The constructive way for Mississippi to preserve its identity isn't to keep the state stuck at the bottom of the barrell (either in terms of perception or reality), but to enact progressive land use, transportation, and growth policies and the like on more of a statewide basis (e.g., Oregon).
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^What's going on in DeSoto County is economic overflow from Memphis. That's where stricter land use regulations, zoning, etc. come into play.

In my view, the display of the Confederate flag (or the emblem within the flag) represents the "old South" mentality, not just in terms of "Southern pride" (at least as interpreted by a certain group of individuals), but in terms of maintaining that wide chasm between the haves and have-nots and preserving the "good ol' boys" union--at the expense of progress for the entire state. I simply don't think that a truly progressive mindset can co-exist with that old South mentality, and I believe there are several examples within the South that prove that.

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^What's going on in DeSoto County is economic overflow from Memphis. That's where stricter land use regulations, zoning, etc. come into play.

In my view, the display of the Confederate flag (or the emblem within the flag) represents the "old South" mentality, not just in terms of "Southern pride" (at least as interpreted by a certain group of individuals), but in terms of maintaining that wide chasm between the haves and have-nots and preserving the "good ol' boys" union--at the expense of progress for the entire state. I simply don't think that a truly progressive mindset can co-exist with that old South mentality, and I believe there are several examples within the South that prove that.

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  • 2 weeks later...

If Alabama could remove the Confederate battle flag from the state Capitol dome without riots in the streets, then surely some kind of flag solution compromise could be found for Mississippi.

What did the state flag look like before the current design was chosen?

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As this article by Professor David Sansing of the University of Mississippi makes clear, none of the previous flags come without baggage- especially those of the Confederacy. The Bonnie Blue flag and the Magnolia flag both have Confederate associations. Possibly, a referendum on a completely new flag could be held again.

Flags Over Mississippi- David Sansing

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