Elizabeth Projects (7th St, Elizabeth Ave, etc)

[atlrvr]

The neighborhood association can no longer afford the upkeep on many of the houses they own and have been renting to only black residents. They are now in agreement to sell a large majority of the houses to a developer who will be bringing in a higher density infill project to the neighbothood that meets with the associations approval....needless to say, gentrification will begin soon.....a few private houses on the market have been renovated and sold in excess of $250k, and the area will become high demand once it turns the corner due to the school district.

[browngeo]

Sorry about the real estate questions.

[atlrvr]

It's been a while since there have been any updates here.

Grubb has applied for a few demolition permits this past week.

They will demolish the building across Travis St. from Carpe Diem that had Matilda's in it. (1601 Elizabeth)

They will also demolish the 1 and 2 story crappy office buildings located on the other side of Elizabeth just east of Torrence (1500-1508 Elizabeth)

I heard that this site will contain a 3-4 story new office building with ground floor retail, though of course I also heard that they were going to keep the Matilda's building and just renovate and expand it, so what do I know.

I would think this is a positive sign that they are getting ready to do something, as it doesn't make sense to keep tearing down and not replacing buildings because it would destroy the urban feel they are trying to create.

Also, I was told that they have reached some sort of agreement with Burger King to relocate them. This has been the hold-up of the Whole Foods, but it appears that things may start moving forward on that.

[dubone]

I was hoping the Matilda's building would stay. . The others, however, are no loss.

Do we have confirmation that the Whole Foods in South Park isn't in lieu of this one? I have kind of wondered that since that one was announced and this was has been so stagnant.

[DigitalSky]

I'm pretty sure it isnt in lieu, but we shouldn't rule that out

[atlrvr]

Yes.....Whole Foods confirmed that they will do 2 locations in Charlotte. The Elizabeth Ave one will be moving forward and is in design (well, redesign actually) right now.

[eastsider]

The first section of the CPCC parking deck has been put up. It looks like a prefeb panel with brick already in place on the exterior. I'm curious to see what it will look like when a full wall is in place, a real brick structure or just some bad panelling?

[voyager12]

So I noticed going into NOFO this week that a building along Liz Ave has been demolished. Any news on what is replacing it? A new restaurant/store Hopefully not another Bojangles or Parking Garage

[dubone]

Was it the old Matilda's building? It was posted here somewhere that it was the next to go, which I think was a huge shame. But we'll see if Grubb starts on building, rather than act like other Charlotte developers, leveling old storefronts, turning it to a gravel lot, and then waiting for years until the market turns.

[abbitt]

im guessing the latter, since the whole elizabeth redevelopment was announced years ago and very little has materialized to date.

[A2]

What is the estimated time line on the Grubb "build out" out of Elizabeth? Are we talking a decade, or just a couple of years?

A2

[atlrvr]

When I worked on the conceptual plan in 2003, the plan was to be done in 2014-2015.....right now, they are running 2 years behind where they wanted to be, mostly due to a slowdown in the office market.

I can say though that even though there have been delays, they are getting more ambitious, and if the Whole Foods project comes to fruition as is currently planned, that that particular building will be a towering success.

Edited July 22, 2006 by atlrvr

[appatone]

It was a decade at creation I believe but that was a few years ago. I think at this point we are currently nearing the half way mark of Grubb's initial 10 year plan with little more than one building done. Heck even this thread is two years old and it was started well after the project had been on the desk for a while. If you want my opinion which is based pretty much on nothing but my own thought. Grubb has run into several big wrenches in the system over the last few years.

Wrench 1) The SouthPark expansion. When Grubb first dreamed up this project I think they were hoping to get tenants that later signed on with SP. It was said that Grubb was in talks with Anthropolgie and Urban Outfitters. Grubb was later quoted in an article as describing SP as "fortress-like" in its ability to grab all retail coming into the city.

Later on Grubb said that they were going for more Carolina brands but thus far NOFO is as much as we've gotten despite the countless stores in the Carolinas that would make excellent tenants.

2) Eastern Federal selling its movie business to Regal. Although Grubb hasn't publicly said Regal isn't opening a theatre there it seems the likely case. I'm unsure if Grubb has a theatre company lined up anymore, and if your movie theatre is going to be your big drawing card tenant it would hurt to loose it.

3) Apparently Grubb is always having to haggle and fight owners of small little portions of land in the neighborhood. Rumors of arguments with Burger King and Auto service places are always around. Since I don't work for Grubb there really is no way for me to know if that's true or not.

4) Who the hell knows what's going on the Whole Foods situation but I wonder if Grubb or WF is holding up the process on that one and if it is Grubb I wonder how long WF will hang on with out saying screw it we'll go to Metropolitan.

5) Soon enough, if not already, Grubb will be competing with Metropolitan for small retailers. As if SP wasn't competition enough.

6) I don't know why Grubb won't go ahead and spark a little something by going ahead and constructing its planned Sterling Elizabeth apartment building. It seems to me demand would be high there for a complex like that. I don't know enough about where Grubb stands in its feeling on building the apartments. How did the renting thing go in Dilworth? Did those go condo because rentals were sluggish? If so, then perhaps Grubb is rethinking building rentals.

Right now this project is so shrouded in mystery it's hard to tell. Grubb used to be very open about this project. Now it seems like we never hear anything which I think is a bad sign. A while back(a little over a year ago) Grubb talked about all of these buildings that would be going up over the following year and all of these renovations that would be taking place as well over the year. Here we are a year later without even a stake in the ground. I think something's gone bad. I still think this is an incredible project with tremendous potential to succeed and exceed everyone's expectations but it seems it needs a shot in the arm from somewhere. Grubb needs to re-rally behind this. I also think Morrison Place has distracted Grubb from ole' Liz too. This is just my opinion based on nothing more than my own meandering thoughts.

But apparently atlrvr is a little more optomistic than I am right now.

Edited July 22, 2006 by appatone

[A2]

When I worked on the conceptual plan in 2003, the plan was to be done in 2014-2015.....right now, they are running 2 years behind where they wanted to be, mostly due to a slowdown in the office market.

I can say though that even though there have been delays, they are getting more ambitious, and if the Whole Foods project comes to fruition as is currently planned, that that particular building will be a towering success.

Towering success . You slay me atlrvr!

A2

[atlrvr]

2) Eastern Federal selling its movie business to Regal. Although Grubb hasn't publicly said Regal isn't opening a theatre there it seems the likely case. I'm unsure if Grubb has a theatre company lined up anymore, and if your movie theatre is going to be your big drawing card tenant it would hurt to loose it.

It is extremely unlikely that there will be a movie theatre included. Regal has been very cool to the project. I don't believe they are currently persuing any other theatres. Assuming EpiCentre does include movies, then Grubb will drop all plans.

3) Apparently Grubb is always having to haggle and fight owners of small little portions of land in the neighborhood. Rumors of arguments with Burger King and Auto service places are always around. Since I don't work for Grubb there really is no way for me to know if that's true or not.

Burger King was a HUGE thorn in their side. Word is that this got resolved back in April and Burger King will move......as to other land owners/land leesees, I don't know the status, but BK was their primary concern to get resolved.

4) Who the hell knows what's going on the Whole Foods situation but I wonder if Grubb or WF is holding up the process on that one and if it is Grubb I wonder how long WF will hang on with out saying screw it we'll go to Metropolitan.

I alluded to Whole Foods already, but to add a bit, the BK situation was the major hold-up, as they needed that parcel to make their expanded vision for the Whole Foods. Now that they have this apparantly resolved, they have sent their conceptual plans to the architect and engineers to move forward. They will still need a rezoning (they have an indefinite deferral hanging out there) but if I were a betting man, I would expect an updated announcement with renderings by years end, with construction within 9 months.

[voyager12]

I hope all the exciting plans for Elizabeth Avenue come to fruition. Its already a good street and could be even better! It has a great urban and walkable feel already. Its one of the few blocks in this city that well... feels like a city. When I take out of towners to NOFO or Carpe Diem they rave about the awesome panoramic view down the hill to Uptown which I also love. The businesses already there are a great mix of funky, elegant, with SK and Carpe Diem, NOFO, and the new martini bar. The right development could make Liz a must visit street, something Charlotte sorely needs more of! So lets get going already

[dubone]

By towering success, I assume bstnrvr is not referring to their large portions of organic native Carolina Low Country long-grain rice, with vegan tofu stir fry on the side.

[A2]

By towering success, I assume bstnrvr is not referring to their large portions of organic native Carolina Low Country long-grain rice, with vegan tofu stir fry on the side.

[atlrvr]

Grubb Properties completed its purchase of the Burger King on Elizabeth last week.

[Mobuchu]

This is the CPCC parking deck right?

8-10-06

[dubone]

I know some hate the brick, but I think it is great that they were able to have the full brick as part of the pre-fabbed panels. That does NOT look like CPCC's typical parking decks. It looks like an actual college building.

I'm glad CPCC is doing their part to make the area more attractive and urban. Too bad the city zoning department still thinks this area should be like a 485 interchange (Bo's).

[A2]

I know some hate the brick, but I think it is great that they were able to have the full brick as part of the pre-fabbed panels. That does NOT look like CPCC's typical parking decks. It looks like an actual college building.

I'm glad CPCC is doing their part to make the area more attractive and urban. Too bad the city zoning department still thinks this area should be like a 485 interchange (Bo's).

FWIW, I like the brick D!

A2

[uptownliving]

There was a lot of talk about this project in the Central Ave thread so I thought I would bring that talk back over to the proper thread.

This project isn't moving as fast as people had expected or wished...but it does continue to move forward. Grubb has stated from the begining that this is a 10 year project and we are only about 2 years in with 8 years left to go. I think it was Charlotte_native who made the observation that Metropolitan will be finished before Elizabeth is...and I would agree with him. The Metropolitan and Elizabeth are very different projects.

To make a bad metaphor, the Metropolitan is like a fast casual chain restarant whereas Elizabeth is a local restarant with all homegrown ingredients. The Metropolitan is going to be a New Urbanist type development that will focus in on itself like Birkdale and Phillips Place do...whereas Elizabeth will be a true urban project that will focus on the existing grid pattern. It takes longer to put a project like Elizabeth together than having the mostly national chain building blocks of Metropolitan thrown together.

I don't want to take away from the Metropolitan, I think its going to be a great development...but I just wanted to make sure people knew that these 2 projects are very different.

Edited August 31, 2006 by uptownliving

[crispin]

I just wanted to make sure people knew that these 2 projects are very different.

They certainly are, inasmuch as metropolitan is actually moving forward.

[atlrvr]

Grubb is going to begin renovations soon of the building located between Travis and NoFo...previously occupied by Matildas. I thought they were going to demolish the entire things, but it turns out just the ugly addition on the back. It will be similar to the building containing Carpe Diem next door, with ground floor retail and second story office space.