Hartford Negativity

[Whaler0718]

I am a big Hartford cheerleader. I'll only be preaching to the choir if I talk about the city's history, its architecture, its cultures, and its promise.

Despite my best efforts, however, I have a very difficult time convincing friends to settle in Hartford. Just last week I had lunch with two friends, each looking to buy a condo. "Have you thought about Hartford?" I asked. "You kidding?!" "No, of course I'm not," and I proceeded to pitch the city. Responses: "They want how much for that building across from the fire station? .... In Hartford? No way!" and "I'll probably get shot. At the minimum, my car will get stolen." (My spiel wasn't helped by the fact that a colleague of theirs was renting an apartment downtown (while his house in the burbs is being finished) and that in the two months he's been there his car has been broken into twice).

The other night, my fiancee and I had dinner with another couple, who live in Manchester. "Move to Hartford," I said. "Well, we like the West End," they replied, "but we're worried about schools." (Of course, front page in the Courant today was the infuriating and sad story of a 15-year old girl who was shot walking home from Bulkeley High.)

Another friend: "I've thought about moving downtown, but I'm pretty sure my company is going to move to Bloomfield, and that would defeat the purpose, wouldn't it?" Well, yeah, sort of.

I hear people say Hartford 21 is on schedule, but aside from the recent restaurant boom, there's nary a new store downtown, and I repeatedly hear gripes about the rent. Tell the truth, I live in the West End, so I probably don't count (in that I wouldn't be a new body in the city) but I can't see spending what they're asking for apartments downtown. One of the best arguments for living in Hartford I heard before moved here is that it's cheaper than the suburbs. Not so if you're in Hartford 21.

Is the Hartford Image Project working? How do we sell this city, and whom do we sell it to? Should we be trying to pull people away from the burbs, or should we aim higher and try to get people from Boston and New York? Given the expense of those cities, a viable alternative might lure some, especially those who are kind of over the experience. Lots of people go to NYC for two or three years and have had enough of it, but they're not ready to move to a small town ... why not a small city?

[MadVlad]

I am a big Hartford cheerleader. I'll only be preaching to the choir if I talk about the city's history, its architecture, its cultures, and its promise.

Despite my best efforts, however, I have a very difficult time convincing friends to settle in Hartford. Just last week I had lunch with two friends, each looking to buy a condo. "Have you thought about Hartford?" I asked. "You kidding?!" "No, of course I'm not," and I proceeded to pitch the city. Responses: "They want how much for that building across from the fire station? .... In Hartford? No way!" and "I'll probably get shot. At the minimum, my car will get stolen." (My spiel wasn't helped by the fact that a colleague of theirs was renting an apartment downtown (while his house in the burbs is being finished) and that in the two months he's been there his car has been broken into twice).

The other night, my fiancee and I had dinner with another couple, who live in Manchester. "Move to Hartford," I said. "Well, we like the West End," they replied, "but we're worried about schools." (Of course, front page in the Courant today was the infuriating and sad story of a 15-year old girl who was shot walking home from Bulkeley High.)

Another friend: "I've thought about moving downtown, but I'm pretty sure my company is going to move to Bloomfield, and that would defeat the purpose, wouldn't it?" Well, yeah, sort of.

I hear people say Hartford 21 is on schedule, but aside from the recent restaurant boom, there's nary a new store downtown, and I repeatedly hear gripes about the rent. Tell the truth, I live in the West End, so I probably don't count (in that I wouldn't be a new body in the city) but I can't see spending what they're asking for apartments downtown. One of the best arguments for living in Hartford I heard before moved here is that it's cheaper than the suburbs. Not so if you're in Hartford 21.

Is the Hartford Image Project working? How do we sell this city, and whom do we sell it to? Should we be trying to pull people away from the burbs, or should we aim higher and try to get people from Boston and New York? Given the expense of those cities, a viable alternative might lure some, especially those who are kind of over the experience. Lots of people go to NYC for two or three years and have had enough of it, but they're not ready to move to a small town ... why not a small city?

[HartfordTycoon]

I agree with both of you guys. I myself question whether those rents need to be so high and if we're asking for too much money to purchase the condos in town as well. Crime is an issue that is best tackled with education and access to it and policing. I'm not opposed to cameras and I think the foot patrols have made a real difference in a short amount of time. Unfortunately as long as guns are cheap and people are poor and living on top of one another, there will be urban crime. Always has been always will be. So let's tackle those issues. Poverty and gun control, since most guns used in crimes are bought legally usually by a suburban resident who then sells it in the city. Last year there was a story about 1 handgun that was passed around and was used to shoot like at least 5 people all on seperate occasions in the city. So to me that illustrates that each gun off of the street counts and we need to stop these straw purchasers, gun runners, and crack heads from outside of the city from getting the guns in the first place.

[penetcostal_iglesia_faith]

I agree with both of you guys. I myself question whether those rents need to be so high and if we're asking for too much money to purchase the condos in town as well. Crime is an issue that is best tackled with education and access to it and policing. I'm not opposed to cameras and I think the foot patrols have made a real difference in a short amount of time. Unfortunately as long as guns are cheap and people are poor and living on top of one another, there will be urban crime. Always has been always will be. So let's tackle those issues. Poverty and gun control, since most guns used in crimes are bought legally usually by a suburban resident who then sells it in the city. Last year there was a story about 1 handgun that was passed around and was used to shoot like at least 5 people all on seperate occasions in the city. So to me that illustrates that each gun off of the street counts and we need to stop these straw purchasers, gun runners, and crack heads from outside of the city from getting the guns in the first place.

[MadVlad]

Was Hartford had a worser crimes in the 80s and 90s???

[blink55184]

Transit/Transportation is something left off of that list.

If you move to a satellite town/city out of NYC as far as Waterbury, youve got transit.

And for Boston, as for as Worcester/Providence.

Hartford is stuck in a corridor in between.

84 is a mess. There are no commuter trains and AMTRAK through Hartford is inadequate at best.

If CDOT or Metro North or anyone made a fast and efficient train connection to either the MBTA or Metro Transit system, or even just a train that went directly to Boston from Hartford as opposed to going to Springfield and sitting for a layover, we would have a better selling point.

[asylumhill]

Move to Hartford, invite people over, take them to restaurants. Take them to the Bushnell, Bushnell Park events, have fun.

As far as overcoming objections:

Crime- know your community service officer and keep them in the loop when you see things happening. They can put the bits of info together and help the other officers know when and where to go to make arrests. Participate in neighborhood cleanups such as the ones Knox Parks helps out with. Get an alarm system if you can, you'll feel much safer.

Transportation- There's plenty of transportation in Hartford. The city is centrally located. Even if you rely on driving, you're closer to suburban Hartford's main attractions living in the city. When I was living in Hartford, I was 15 minutes from both WestFarms and Buckland Hills. It took me 2 minutes to get to the highways. I hardly ever hit traffic because I could reverse commute to West Hartford, or take the bus. In 15 minutes I could walk to the bus/train station and be in New York in under 3 hours, without ever looking for a parking space. We need better transportation to the airport though, and I would love to see a trolley line connect downtown Hartford and West Hartford center.

Housing- I agree, there are plenty of rental opportunities at reasonable rents that don't get publicized. Clemens Place, 250 Main, Park Place, and Morgan at the Park all have nice apartments for less than $1000. Property tax rates are higher than other towns but property assessments are lower, so you can spend much less on a unit in the city. Personally, I would be bored living in Newington, Berlin, etc.

Education- This is a huge issue. Until we solve it, we have to rely on drawing younger people into the city and give up on trying to draw families. I support housing vouchers but they are controversial. As far as I know, all the good private schools are in the suburbs too.

Environment- If you have friends who are proud to recycle and buy organic, play up the environmental angle. It's less energy-intensive (per capita) to live in an urban environment than in the suburbs due to reduced gasoline use and smaller heating bills (from living in smaller, attached dwellings vs single family homes). They say if New York City was a state it would be 51st in the nation in terms of per capita energy use.

[MadVlad]

Housing- I agree, there are plenty of rental opportunities at reasonable rents that don't get publicized. Clemens Place, 250 Main, Park Place, and Morgan at the Park all have nice apartments for less than $1000. Property tax rates are higher than other towns but property assessments are lower, so you can spend much less on a unit in the city.

[JayHass]

With all due respect I see a reoccuring theme here. Yes technically Hartford is inside the borders proper - but realistically, we ALL live in Hartford. (I'm in Manchester and tell people away that I live in Hartford or The Hartford Region etc.

The mentality that West Hartford, Newington or Manchester somehow is "not Hartford" IMHO weakens us all. People in Geogia don't say I live in Sandy Springs...no, they say "I live in Atlanta".

To answer the question brought up here about living in Hartford proper as someone mentioned...Not many people want to live in that harsh of an environment. I'm sorry, but I'm just being relistic. I go down Albany avenue to I84 from Canton every day on my way home from work and often visit restaurants in South Hartford and know my way around the city pretty well and I would NOT want to live there. The streets are dirty, homes are run down, the crime is high and overall there is a "ghetto" mentality. Real or perceived. I grew up in the harsh of harshest neighborhoods in Waterbury so don't think I'm some Avon spoiled kid saying "Like, no way" looking down at people. I'm just being real...I wouldn't want raise my family in that environment. Sorry.

[blink55184]

I'm sorry, but I'm just being relistic. I go down Albany avenue to I84 from Canton every day on my way home from work and often visit restaurants in South Hartford and know my way around the city pretty well and I would NOT want to live there. The streets are dirty, homes are run down, the crime is high and overall there is a "ghetto" mentality. Real or perceived.

[HartfordTycoon]

With all due respect I see a reoccuring theme here. Yes technically Hartford is inside the borders proper - but realistically, we ALL live in Hartford. (I'm in Manchester and tell people away that I live in Hartford or The Hartford Region etc.

The mentality that West Hartford, Newington or Manchester somehow is "not Hartford" IMHO weakens us all. People in Geogia don't say I live in Sandy Springs...no, they say "I live in Atlanta".

To answer the question brought up here about living in Hartford proper as someone mentioned...Not many people want to live in that harsh of an environment. I'm sorry, but I'm just being relistic. I go down Albany avenue to I84 from Canton every day on my way home from work and often visit restaurants in South Hartford and know my way around the city pretty well and I would NOT want to live there. The streets are dirty, homes are run down, the crime is high and overall there is a "ghetto" mentality. Real or perceived. I grew up in the harsh of harshest neighborhoods in Waterbury so don't think I'm some Avon spoiled kid saying "Like, no way" looking down at people. I'm just being real...I wouldn't want raise my family in that environment. Sorry.

[blink55184]

Excuse my lack of photoshop effort and weak paint effort, but this summarizes what ALOT of people think

Red== nice for an event visit or quick downtown trip.

Money is money..and mostly jewish wealth in west hartford.

the rest is ugly.

Any agree? Disagree?

[HartfordTycoon]

Excuse my lack of photoshop effort and weak paint effort, but this summarizes what ALOT of people think

Red== nice for an event visit or quick downtown trip.

Money is money..and mostly jewish wealth in west hartford.

the rest is ugly.

Any agree? Disagree?

[asylumhill]

Excuse my lack of photoshop effort and weak paint effort, but this summarizes what ALOT of people think

Red== nice for an event visit or quick downtown trip.

Money is money..and mostly jewish wealth in west hartford.

the rest is ugly.

Any agree? Disagree?

[blink55184]

You dont have to get so defensive.

Your opinion of the inner city is as legitimate as mine, I was just sharing mine.

You live there, I live 5 minutes away. That 5 minutes must shake up alot of views.

It is not like us "suburbanites" are from some gated community light years away.

I have friend in Hartford, I hang out there, I go downtown, I visit family there.

I have lived in various parts of two other cities and find their ugliest parts safer and cleaner than Hartfords ugly.

And take my map with a grain of salt, its a generalization. Sure there are a few streets circled in UGLY that arent.

[HartfordTycoon]

You dont have to get so defensive.

Your opinion of the inner city is as legitimate as mine, I was just sharing mine.

You live there, I live 5 minutes away. That 5 minutes must shake up alot of views.

It is not like us "suburbanites" are from some gated community light years away.

I have friend in Hartford, I hang out there, I go downtown, I visit family there.

I have lived in various parts of two other cities and find their ugliest parts safer and cleaner than Hartfords ugly.

And take my map with a grain of salt, its a generalization. Sure there are a few streets circled in UGLY that arent.

[blink55184]

Maybe I am mistaken here.....

Aren't we talking about the grit? Run down houses? Neighborhoods and streets in awful shape? The visibly decayed?

If we are not understanding each other lemme know

If so, I don't have to live there my whole life to see it and know it is there....

[drc72]

Was Hartford had a worser crimes in the 80s and 90s???

[HartfordTycoon]

Maybe I am mistaken here.....

Aren't we talking about the grit? Run down houses? Neighborhoods and streets in awful shape? The visibly decayed?

If we are not understanding each other lemme know

If so, I don't have to live there my whole life to see it and know it is there....

[JayHass]

Excuse my lack of photoshop effort and weak paint effort, but this summarizes what ALOT of people think

Red== nice for an event visit or quick downtown trip.

Money is money..and mostly jewish wealth in west hartford.

the rest is ugly.

Any agree? Disagree?

[JayHass]

That's exactly what we are talking about. I just don't see it how you do. I've spent a lifetime here. You describe a wasteland and it's just not like that. That's all I'm saying. It's my town and you describe a place I really don't see. I see a place of mostly hard working decent people and well kept homes throughout Hartford.

[blink55184]

Very nicely put in both posts Jay.

I noticed that when I started college, there is alot you do not know about where you are from until you leave it.

And I am certainly not bashing Hartford, I wouldnt be on this board if I hated it and thought it was vile

[penetcostal_iglesia_faith]

With all due respect I see a reoccuring theme here. Yes technically Hartford is inside the borders proper - but realistically, we ALL live in Hartford. (I'm in Manchester and tell people away that I live in Hartford or The Hartford Region etc.

The mentality that West Hartford, Newington or Manchester somehow is "not Hartford" IMHO weakens us all. People in Geogia don't say I live in Sandy Springs...no, they say "I live in Atlanta".

To answer the question brought up here about living in Hartford proper as someone mentioned...Not many people want to live in that harsh of an environment. I'm sorry, but I'm just being relistic. I go down Albany avenue to I84 from Canton every day on my way home from work and often visit restaurants in South Hartford and know my way around the city pretty well and I would NOT want to live there. The streets are dirty, homes are run down, the crime is high and overall there is a "ghetto" mentality. Real or perceived. I grew up in the harsh of harshest neighborhoods in Waterbury so don't think I'm some Avon spoiled kid saying "Like, no way" looking down at people. I'm just being real...I wouldn't want raise my family in that environment. Sorry.

[HartfordTycoon]

Perhaps that the very reason why you see it as "normal". I know when I moved away for 5 years and returned, my perception was incredibly changed. Sometimes it takes someone from the "outside" to point out something. When you live with it every day, it becomes your "norm".

Go live in a city like Charlotte or Greenville for a little while and come back. Youre jaw will drop. Heck, nevermind the South, take a trip to Portland Maine and look around! Portland has Hartford beat on many fronts and it amazes me how they can do it. We can too.

I love the Hartford area, I think the city has buildings and cultural gems other cities would die for...but it needs work! The first step in correcting a problem is first admitting there is one.

No one is trashing Hartford...at least I'm not. I'm just saying outside of some nice areas and downtown, the neighborhoods are rough. And they are.

[JayHass]

Was that post to be something offended to say- "overall there is a "ghetto" mentality"