Myths surrounding suburbia

[Recchia]

The food section is what kills me. I eat meat daily. I scored an 18 even under the scenario that I would walk to work everyday (if only I could...!)

[lammius]

The food section is what kills me. I eat meat daily. I scored an 18 even under the scenario that I would walk to work everyday (if only I could...!)

[rnc]

How in the world can they calculate that number with any accuracy? I guess we should all live in a house with no running water or electricity and eat only the food we can scavenge from the surrounding earth. Then all us awful Americans would be good people. I get the overall message of the website and I agree with it to some degree; however, that is a website with a political agenda.

[Snowguy716]

It's not a website with a political agenda. It's a website that sees how much we use way more than our fair share of resources. We have hotdog eating contests while children in Africa starve to death. And most Americans either don't care or actually think that it's okay that life works that way.

Like I said, when I was in Austria, I lived in "dorm style" apartment building with running water and electricity (with high efficiency), I walked everywhere and took the bus less than 20-30 miles per week, which was run from electricity provided from hydro-electric, wind, and nuclear power. I only ate meat every other day and I made up for that by eating a lot of beans and taking vitamins. I walked everywhere.

And with that life style we would need 1.1 planets. My lifestyle was completely fine and I'm sure if everyone lived like that we could find the extra space to make up for that .1 planet.

I still got to enjoy a steak every once in a while and drink milk and eat cheese and enjoy all sorts of great food without having to have a giant hamburger or pile of meat in front of me.

I got to observe and enjoy all the goings-on of Salzburg.. the woman that swept outside of her little Cafe every morning that always said "Guten Morgen" as I walked by or just the birds.. or see how much snow had fallen or melted on the mountains towering over the city.. and when it rained... there was the bus for EUR 1,80.

The U.S prevents htat way of life with its silly addiction to automobiles and having to be spread out all the time. I don't hate the U.S for it, but I have a feeling we will be forced into changing our way of life lest we collapse completely. It's not something I want to do... but you do what you have to do.

[lammius]

How in the world can they calculate that number with any accuracy? I guess we should all live in a house with no running water or electricity and eat only the food we can scavenge from the surrounding earth. Then all us awful Americans would be good people. I get the overall message of the website and I agree with it to some degree; however, that is a website with a political agenda.

[rnc]

It's not a website with a political agenda. It's a website that sees how much we use way more than our fair share of resources. We have hotdog eating contests while children in Africa starve to death. And most Americans either don't care or actually think that it's okay that life works that way.

Like I said, when I was in Austria, I lived in "dorm style" apartment building with running water and electricity (with high efficiency), I walked everywhere and took the bus less than 20-30 miles per week, which was run from electricity provided from hydro-electric, wind, and nuclear power. I only ate meat every other day and I made up for that by eating a lot of beans and taking vitamins. I walked everywhere.

And with that life style we would need 1.1 planets. My lifestyle was completely fine and I'm sure if everyone lived like that we could find the extra space to make up for that .1 planet.

I still got to enjoy a steak every once in a while and drink milk and eat cheese and enjoy all sorts of great food without having to have a giant hamburger or pile of meat in front of me.

I got to observe and enjoy all the goings-on of Salzburg.. the woman that swept outside of her little Cafe every morning that always said "Guten Morgen" as I walked by or just the birds.. or see how much snow had fallen or melted on the mountains towering over the city.. and when it rained... there was the bus for EUR 1,80.

The U.S prevents htat way of life with its silly addiction to automobiles and having to be spread out all the time. I don't hate the U.S for it, but I have a feeling we will be forced into changing our way of life lest we collapse completely. It's not something I want to do... but you do what you have to do.

[Snowguy716]

You, my friend, are an average American. You aren't any more wasteful that others.

But you have to consider:

That meat you eat once per day probably came from a slaughterhouse over a thousand miles away delivered by some very oil intensive inefficient means of transport.

Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat come from California (except in summer) and were delivered by truck and grown on water taken from the mountains because it doesn't rain for about 5 months per year in much of central California.

The flying also doesn't help. Where most Americans might drive more than you, they probably fly less.

It also figures in climate and how much energy at typical person in your region uses to heat/cool their house. So it's not totally accurate, but it gives a decent idea.

[nashvillwill]

13 acres/2.9 planets...that doesn't seem so bad compared to some of your scores. BUT, before you think that i am gloating i must make a confession...I am a smoker.....i wonder how many acres THAT adds?

[rnc]

You, my friend, are an average American. You aren't any more wasteful that others.

But you have to consider:

That meat you eat once per day probably came from a slaughterhouse over a thousand miles away delivered by some very oil intensive inefficient means of transport.

Most of the fruit and vegetables you eat come from California (except in summer) and were delivered by truck and grown on water taken from the mountains because it doesn't rain for about 5 months per year in much of central California.

The flying also doesn't help. Where most Americans might drive more than you, they probably fly less.

It also figures in climate and how much energy at typical person in your region uses to heat/cool their house. So it's not totally accurate, but it gives a decent idea.

[krazeeboi]

I scored a 29 (eek), but I do recycle. They should have factored that in. I do the best I can considering where I live. Even the central city in my metro area (Charlotte) doesn't have a bus system that runs 24 hours, and I work nights so when it comes to mass transit, I couldn't event theoretically use it if I wanted to (there is a Park and Ride system in place that comes down from Charlotte to my city, but it only runs during the day).

[monsoon]

Please no more one-liner posts with your score. This is a discussion topic

[ChiefJoJo]

16 acres/3.7 planets!

Wow, and I walk everywhere, recycle, live in a small condo, recycle, and generally don't consume much (except food )... and I'm still pretty high it seems.

1. Americans are addicted to driving.

Europeans may enjoy top-notch transit and endure gasoline that costs $5 per gallon, but in fact they don't drive much less than we do. In the United States, automobiles account for about 88 percent of travel. In Europe, the figure is about 78 percent. And Europeans are gaining on us.

With out any statistics to rely on, I'm going to have to call BS on that. My educated guess is those are percentage of trips taken by car vs transit, not total VMT (miles travelled). If it were based on total VMT, the numbers would be much more disparate.

2. Public transit can reduce traffic congestion.

I tend to agree with the unless's post on the last page. Transit probably has more to do with parking supplies and accomadating intense growth in urban areas than reducing road congestion, but the political realities are there.

Even though spending on public transportation has ballooned to more than seven times its 1960s levels, the percentage of people who use it to get to work fell 63 percent from 1960 to 2000 and now stands at just under 5 percent nationwide.

Again, I have to take issue with this. What has our road budget done over the same period? Does this account for inflation? I would hazard a guess that road spending outpaces transit by a tremendous amount by every measure you can show. This also does not account for our massive subsidizing of oil, land use (parking rules, etc) thru federal policy.

3. We can cut air pollution only if we stop driving.

More stringent regulations and better technology have allowed us to achieve what was previously unthinkable: driving more and getting cleaner.

True, vehicle fleets are becoming cleaner, but VMT is increasing at a tremendous rate. AQ rules state that areas must not worsen AQ over ime through planning. Higher emissions are not just a product of gridlock, in fact emissions are actually be worse at high freeway speeds and volumes versus moderate speeds. Basically emissions are an inverse bell curve, with low and high speeds producing the most emissions per VMT. This is a complex topic, and the above qute is incredibly misleading.

4. We're paving over America.

No, bu we're headed that way more and more each day, and it's hard to ignore the trends of loss of open space and farming.

5. We can't deal with global warming unless we stop driving.

An obvious oversimplification of a highly complex problem--possibly (along with global terror and poverty) the biggest global issue of this century. The US, India, and China (the 3 biggest nations) need to be involved obviously and commit to curbing fossil fuel emissions drastically, including auto and point sources. Actually, China has MUCH higher fuel efficiency standards than we do, which is a total embarrasment to US leaders. It's clear this is a comprehensive problem that we cannot solve with one tool.

[cdub]

Gasoline is not subsidized - just the opposite, it is taxed. rather heavily in some states (NY, 38 cents per gallon ~ 19%!!!)

Please people do some research instead of making baseless statements as if they are facts.

[monsoon]

When you consider the federal and state money that pays for port facilities where oil is imported, the federal outlays to keep refineries going, the Coast Guard costs to keep off-shore drilling safe, and the huge military outlays to protect the oil supply in unstable parts of the world, then yes, gasoline is heavily subsidized. If the total costs of making gasoline available to this country were put on the price of a gallon of gasoline, the cost would be a lot higher.

[Snowguy716]

Yes. And it is suburbanites who benefit the most from this system, because every person pays taxes to cover those hidden costs, and the amount would be the same whether you live 40 miles from work in a giant McMansion in an exurb or if you live down the block from work in a city where a car is not necessary (given that you have the same income), so the suburbanite is actually benefiting and getting more for his/her tax dollar. And they always seem to be the ones screaming for lower taxes.

I say fine! Let's just end government subsidies for everything and you can pay the true market price for your Little Debbie's or your gallon of gas. Suddenly the suburbs wouldn't be so hot anymore.

[buster]

Is the gas tax in your area sufficient for all the road building, and more importantly maintenance? My bet is no, so when someone acts that this is a user fee, it falls short. In my home state, we'll be facing a $2 billion short fall for maintenance and future projects because the gas tax is insufficient. Subsidy must come from somewhere else.

Will the gas taxes present pay the $533 billion in road improvements mentioned above?

[Snowguy716]

Ahem. I was directly refuting an obviously incorrect statement, for the benefit of those who don't think for themselves. You are going off on another point entirely. Gasoline is NOT subsidized, and it IS taxed.

If you want to talk about roads and how they are paid for, fine. They are also taxed.

You may as well further expand this thinking to every single thing in America. Therefore everything, including your life, is heavily subsidized. If this were a socialist or communist nation, these things would all be even more heavily subsidized.

[DaveRPI]

everyone has an opinion and just like some other unpleasant things they all stink

incomplete facts are fun to use when you are trying to argue your point, but consider this

living in boston, 2 miles from the financial district it still takes me a minimum of 30 min to get from my door to my work door [sometimes taking up to an hour] via the subway and bus lines costing $71 a month, if i drove and parked in a garage near my bldg it takes about 15 min, but costs $400/month

make your opinions about that one!

[Recchia]

everyone has an opinion and just like some other unpleasant things they all stink

incomplete facts are fun to use when you are trying to argue your point, but consider this

living in boston, 2 miles from the financial district it still takes me a minimum of 30 min to get from my door to my work door [sometimes taking up to an hour] via the subway and bus lines costing $71 a month, if i drove and parked in a garage near my bldg it takes about 15 min, but costs $400/month

make your opinions about that one!

[lammius]

everyone has an opinion and just like some other unpleasant things they all stink

incomplete facts are fun to use when you are trying to argue your point, but consider this

living in boston, 2 miles from the financial district it still takes me a minimum of 30 min to get from my door to my work door [sometimes taking up to an hour] via the subway and bus lines costing $71 a month, if i drove and parked in a garage near my bldg it takes about 15 min, but costs $400/month

make your opinions about that one!

[JDC]

everyone has an opinion and just like some other unpleasant things they all stink

incomplete facts are fun to use when you are trying to argue your point, but consider this

living in boston, 2 miles from the financial district it still takes me a minimum of 30 min to get from my door to my work door [sometimes taking up to an hour] via the subway and bus lines costing $71 a month, if i drove and parked in a garage near my bldg it takes about 15 min, but costs $400/month

make your opinions about that one!

[ohioaninSC]

With the weather in Boston over the winter months, I wouldn't walk/bike ride to work, but most of the rest of the year, if that was me I would.

BTW, my score was 7.7 planets, but, most of that comes from the fact that my job requires me to fly to a lot of places, as I work in sales for a nationwide flatbed trucking company. If I refused to fly, there would be no way for me to bring on new customers or service my current customers, as they expect to physically see you every so often as opposed to talking on the phone. If I don't bring in the revenue, I lose my job, and driving 1000 miles is not feasible.

Also, I live in a single family house, b/c I like my privacy. I could never live in a very dense environment b/c I hate hearing loud noises, especially when I'm trying to go to bed. I used to live in a dense Columbus neighborhood, and just couldn't take how inconsiderate most people were. So, since I make enough, I have my own nice little house, but, I do recycle as much as possible, I only have a 10 min commute to my office when I am there, and I have a pretty good car when it comes to gas mileage.

The only change I will make in my life is when I find the right person to marry, otherwise, I like the way my life is. If I had the option to use public transit for instance to get me to the Charlotte airport from Rock Hill, or if they had 24/7 public transit to get me up to Uptown when my friends and I want to go out up there, I'd use that. When I lived in Cleveland's east side suburbs, I used Cleveland's Rapid every chance I had, so I don't understand the areas hesitancy to install it, b/c it is a better alternative than expanding freeways.

Also, through most of the winter months especially, it is very hard to find local produce, so I don't understand, am I supposed to give up eating healthy vegies and fruit when it can't be grown locally b/c of climate? I have cut down on meat, now just once a day instead of 2-3 times a day but they make it sound bad that you eat that stuff when the only way you can get it during part of the year is to have it trucked/railroaded in from CA or FL.