Belk's Site

[interestedexpat]

We've known for a long time this was coming. I thought it deserved it's own thread with news likely coming in the next few weeks to put more detail on the proposal.

The city says they might select a developer next week for the Belk's site in Anderson's downtown. Read about it here.This is one of the most strategic sites in the city and a successful development will go a long way to creating an attractive core! If you don't know Anderson - the Belk's site is half a block off Main on the same cross street as both the Chiqoula and Court House. It's a few blocks down from the Calhoun.

Developers in the running are ...

B & B Development Inc., of Anderson, which is doing the Chiquola condos.

Johnston Design Group, a Greenville-based company

Civic Square LLC, which has completed several projects in downtown Charleston

The city wants mixed use. A hotel has been discussed. B&B said their plan will feature a combination of retail and residential. Several floors of condos and several floors of retail. A rooftop restaurant, courtyards and green space also could be incorporate into the project.

This sounds great. If the other proposals are this good - we are in business! I can't wait to hear and see the details.

[Spartan]

This is definitely exciting. I can't wait to hear more

[GvilleSC]

This does sound great!

[gs3]

Great news! When I was through downtown Anderson a couple of weeks ago, I noticed a good amount of activity. This is so nice to see.

[krazeeboi]

Sounds good to me!

[interestedexpat]

The Anderson Independent is reporting a little about the developers presentations to the city committee.... Here.

Not too much interms of new information. Except for a little clearer picture of what Civic Square LLC has in mind. This is from the AIM news account...

"David Agnew, of Civic Square, said his company

[interestedexpat]

Belk site proposals are moving slowly... but they are moving.

Anderson Independent Mail

City Committee considers parking deck proposals

The title of the article is a little misleading. What we learn is the B&B Development (the Anderson based bidder) is talking about putting a parking deck in the old Belk site as part of their proposal. They are also planning housing, a hotel and presumably retail.

The more detailed info came out of Charleston based Civic Square. Their proposal includes 13,000 sq foot of ground floor retail, 36 condos and a 100 room hotel! I would assume this would also call for provision for parking.

B&B says their research shows Anderson can definitely handle more downtown condos. These are the same guys doing the Chiquola Condos.

No one has released any drawings yet, but based on the size of the lot, I would have to assume that the Civic Square proposal is at least 6 floors, perhaps 7 or 8. A new building of that size in downtown Anderson in that location will be a tremendous addition both in terms of economic activity and in terms of creating visual impact.

My take is that B&B are going to do further projects in downtown no matter what. So right now I'm hoping Civic Square gets the go ahead. Especially if their 100 room hotel has a good name.

[interestedexpat]

Oops, just read more about the proposals... info that's not in the AIM article.

Civic Square is advocating a more 'horizontal' building. Not sure exactly what that means, but my guess is more like 4 floors. B&B is advocating a more 'vertical' plan.

B&B is also proposing a 'skybridge' to connect the proposed parking to the Chiquola and the Courthouse. Civic Square argued that defeated the purpose of trying to create pedestrial street level activity. B&B also proposed a roof top restaurant as part of their proposal.

After reading this stuff i'd like to combine the two. I'd still like to see a 6-9 floor building...a vertical approach. I think some parking is important whether its just for this building or also for the court house and chiquola. I'd actually like to see the two parking lots stay a separate issue. i do NOT want to see a skybridge over main street. I think this would be disasterous.

[Spartan]

Boo for skybridges. Is it really too much trouble to go down a few more floors?

Rooftop restaurants are always a winner in my book.

[interestedexpat]

Civic Square out of Charleston was chosen for the old Belk's site. The city hopes to negotiate terms of the development over the next 60 days and hopes construction starts by the end of the year.

Just to recap, Civic Square's proposal called for 36 Condos, 100 hotel rooms and 13,000 sqt of retail. They were thinking more horizontal than vertical and I think had plans to include other nearby properties in the development. I hope this isn't too horizontal (i.e. I still want 5-8 floors) but I liked that I know of their plan better. I hated the "skybridge" idea from B&B.

[Spartan]

I think that while taller is always nice, you have to consider which will be higher quality. In this case, it sounds like the more "horizontal" one may fit the bill better, and I'm ok with that. I want to see the project that is the best for Anderson come foreward. We need to see what the "horizonal" thing means first, however. Mixed use comes in both horizontal and vertical forms. Horizontal mixed use is just having more than one type of use on a given site, but still in separate buildings (or floorspace with in a building). IF thats the case, then the vertical plan may still be the better plan, since you have stacked mixing of uses.

[ab1137]

Has anyone heard more definitive plans for this site? It's been months since we heard that plans were coming together....

[ab1137]

I'll answer my own question with this article in AIM....

Belk Site

[GSP Tiger]

All those ideas are worth being used throughout downtown. Personally, lodging, retail, and dining should be the top three ideas to address in order to brind people downtown.

[interestedexpat]

Sorry for the late reply about the status of the site. Hopefully we'll know more later this month. Unfortunately there is some negative local chatter. Anderson loves eating its own. Civic Square's initial meeting with local officials was rescheduled which has led to bickering and rumor mongering. I think it's mostly just unrealistic timeline expectations and some dissatisfaction with local processes.

Anyway, I'm excited to see what they come up with. A lot of people are hoping for a small hotel as part of the development.

[ab1137]

Unfortunately there is some negative local chatter. Anderson loves eating its own. Civic Square's initial meeting with local officials was rescheduled which has led to bickering and rumor mongering. I think it's mostly just unrealistic timeline expectations and some dissatisfaction with local processes.

[GSP Tiger]

A tower as a higher end hotel and a rooftop restaurant... Now I want to head back to The Westin Peachtree Plaza in Atlanta. It is what Anderson needs and can benefit from. It would not have to compete with Greenville, as it can draw from Clemson.

[ab1137]

I'd love to see that 73 story Westin Peechtree Plaze in Anderson Wow, it is stunning. I think Anderson is in competition with Clemson too, I hear of concerts and comedians going to little john collisium all the time. It's great for the students because they dont have to worry about getting home after the evening "festivities".

It would be nice if Anderson and Clemson got together on a mass transit train or something and make it a straight shot to the city from the school. All wishful thinking, i know.

[GSP Tiger]

For Anderson's size, a 10-12 level hotel with public access above for viewing and a rooftoop restaurtant, and a ground level for some botiques, dining, and convention space would work well. Perhaps a taller version of Greenville's Westin Poinsett in downtown Anderson would work.

[interestedexpat]

ab1137 ... I have my sources.

Anyway - I'd love to see a 10-12 floor hotel. I'm skeptical though about whether it would be able to make it - especially downtown at this stage. I think we desperately need a few more businesses located downtown before something like that could be profitable. I'd love to be proved wrong.

A hotel that size will need to be on a different site though. Civic Square's vision (that the Council bought into) was decidedly shorter than that. I believe they had a proposal for something taller and went for the Civic Square vision citing "character of the neighborhood". I believe the vision is to keep Main Street height limited. I'm just hoping that means 4-5 floors and not 2 or 3.

I go back and forth as to whether I think the height limited thing is a good idea. If we could do that and get some height on surrounding streets it could be very cool. I'm just skeptical....

[GSP Tiger]

When speaking of a height limit, are you speaking of a maximum or minimum height? I rather see a height minimum, which would force bulders to build tall, maximizing their space, and maintaining the character of the neighborhood with a nice decent skyline.

[interestedexpat]

Unfortunately - they are talking maximum height. I don't know that they are talking in those terms, but the concensus seemed to be that less height was more consistent with the neighborhood.

[interestedexpat]

The latest is that the developer is still planning mixed use, but to feature a 100 room hotel. No condos at this point. He said he felt with the Chiqoula and Calhoun properties coming on market recently, that condos were too risky. Good move in my opinion. Now the hotel will need to be a destination in and of itself. If they pull that off, this will be successful.

[GSP Tiger]

^That is not a bad start. One hundred rooms is great to start off with, and will possibly make the structure at least 6 levels. Could they learn something from downtown Greenville's Hampton Inn & Suites and Westin Poinsett?

[interestedexpat]

From my vantage point 6 or 7 floors would be ideal for this location. I think something up over 10 floors will dominate the landscape too much at this stage. 6 or 7 would create a more urban feel, while blending in and leaving room for other developments of similar size.

I'd like to see 3 new projects of 6-9 floors before someone goes for the 10-15 range. Just my opinion.