Heartwell v. Rinck

[Rizzo]

Convenience is The Factor. Amtrak is never on time nor does it operate frequently. There's a saying among some of the Amtrak Conductors and Engineers I know on the Pere Marquette line, "Always safe, never on time."

You're right though, the allure of trains is coming back, but I'd argue that it never left -- it was just ran over by an automobile.

[mpchicago]

Trains are economical, and more efficient environmentally. Amtrack, the nation's only rail passenger carrier has seen ridership in Michigan rise 47 percent since 2002 and hit a record last year of almost 665,000 passengers. Nationwide, the rate was up 12 percent. The allure of trains is coming back. Gas prices and rising Airline prices are helping to drive the increase, but convenience is another factor.

[GRDadof3]

Don't get me wrong, I love train travel. I have used the service a number of times between GR and Chicago and Ann Arbor and Chicago, but Amtrak is a struggling government run black whole. While ridership is up (good news) it still does not have the capacity to be a self sufficient service. Every few years, the State doles out subsidies to keep it running. Is there a viable financial plan for someone to pay for a statewide Amtrak service?

The plan that is being proposed by some of the folks here, for light rail in the Grand Rapids area, sounds more viable than a statewide Amtrak plan. Mr. Rink should check it out.

[francishsu]

Amtrak operates commuter rail for a number of areas in the country. Ticket prices GR<->Holland go for $5 one-way, but the schedule is not suitable for commuting. But adding commuter routes to the Pere Marquette rail could be the quickest way of expanding the scope of mass transit in West Michigan. You could start off with Amtrak managing and always switch to a different company in the future. Is there a market for a GR <-> Wyoming/Grandville/Jenison <-> Hudsonville <-> Zeeland <-> Holland commuter line?

[Rizzo]

I think if you start early and provide two things: park/ride facilities and frequent service (25-30 minutes) you could create quite a market. Of the tens of thousands of people commuting into downtown I'm sure there are plenty commuting from Holland and the suburbs lining the route. If the connections could be made to Muskegon and Holland I think that would really entice more people into Downtown and even entice more people to visit Muskegon and Holland's main streets.

[DemocraticEdge]

The plan that is being proposed by some of the folks here, for light rail in the Grand Rapids area, sounds more viable than a statewide Amtrak plan. Mr. Rink should check it out.

[GRDadof3]

The place where rail is needed most in Michigan is between Grand Rapids and Lansing. With Grand Rapids in the midst of construction the MSU "Medical Mile", with a $1 Billion + price tag, there will be a huge need to transport students, teachers, etc. betwen GR and Lansing.

[snoogit]

The students and professors here and in East Lansing will be in entirely different programs. You might have half a dozen who need to make the trip a week, tops. Hardly worth an investment in the hundred of millions, if not billions, of dollars.

All efforts for expanding mass transit in West Michigan need to be concentrated on where the maximum number of daily trips are being made currently: suburbs to downtown. Not "city-to-city. The only exception to that might be Holland Township > Zeeland > Hudsonville > Grandville > Downtown GR at some point in the future. But even that's not what is causing the greatest stress on the current system.

But I think this thread has crossed over into the Transit Thread discussion.

[DemocraticEdge]

Yeah this thread was about Jim Rinck and George Heartwell..

I'll admit I don't know much about these two candidates, I was wondering if maybe someone could give me an idea of how these guys operate.

[Kib]

This, from the GR Press RE: Bush's Visit to EGR with the Mayor in attendance

"Grand Rapids Mayor George Heartwell said he still favors removing troops from Iraq, but he was impressed at how Bush "made a compelling case for his plan."

Heartwell -- who did not applaud at points when others did --"

I don't have a dog in this fight, but it appears the GR Press does.

NOTE TO CANDIDATES: Be careful out there, the newspaper may start taking count and mentioning your number of potty breaks during events...

Good solid investigative work there, fishwrap.

[Veloise]

This, from the GR Press RE: Bush's Visit to EGR with the Mayor in attendance

"Grand Rapids Mayor George Heartwell said he still favors removing troops from Iraq, but he was impressed at how Bush "made a compelling case for his plan."

Heartwell -- who did not applaud at points when others did --"

I don't have a dog in this fight, but it appears the GR Press does.

NOTE TO CANDIDATES: Be careful out there, the newspaper may start taking count and mentioning your number of potty breaks during events...

Good solid investigative work there, fishwrap.

[GR Jackson]

I don't know much about the other candidate, but Heartwell seems to be leading the city in the way of a sustainability with a great appreciation for enviornmental (LEED) building/construction.

[GRDadof3]

This, from the GR Press RE: Bush's Visit to EGR with the Mayor in attendance

"Grand Rapids Mayor George Heartwell said he still favors removing troops from Iraq, but he was impressed at how Bush "made a compelling case for his plan."

Heartwell -- who did not applaud at points when others did --"

I don't have a dog in this fight, but it appears the GR Press does.

NOTE TO CANDIDATES: Be careful out there, the newspaper may start taking count and mentioning your number of potty breaks during events...

Good solid investigative work there, fishwrap.

[Kib]

"No dog in this fight". Hmmm, I've kinda thought you might be a transplant Kib?

If so, I'm going to guess Australia.

[GRDadof3]

In the interest of edification and illumination, until I sign the house deed and become a fully-fledged member of the greater Grand Rapids community I don't give a rat's, at this point, who becomes Mayor. I do care about sloppy journalism.

As far a pedigree, born and bred in the great state of Oregon.

(perhaps it was my rakish Russell Crowe/Paul Hogan good-looks, and fierce independant and outspoken behavior that led you to believe I was a man from down under)

[Landscape1]

In the interest of edification and illumination, until I sign the house deed and become a fully-fledged member of the greater Grand Rapids community I don't give a rat's, at this point, who becomes Mayor. I do care about sloppy journalism.

As far a pedigree, born and bred in the great state of Oregon.

(perhaps it was my rakish Russell Crowe/Paul Hogan good-looks, and fierce independant and outspoken behavior that led you to believe I was a man from down under)

[Kib]

Thanks Landscape. Rest assured once I get moved up there, registered to vote and ramped up on the candidates and issues I'll be an active participant !!

[barefoot]

Rinck seems just to be a rock thrower, rather than a leader. Sort of like Tormula on the City Commission.

While this personality type is ok if you are a minority member of some political body, it is is unacceptable when you are the longest serving member of a body with eyes of leading that body (Rinck and Tormula again).

Meanwhile, the race is Heartwell's to loose and he seems to be doing everything he can to loose it with his obsession on race quotas.

[GR Jackson]

Another thing I like about Heartwell is that he seems to be down to earth. He always wears the same suit, which says to me that he is unpretentious and not materialistic. As far as quotas go, he is standing for a progressive view of the city which includes a working towards closing the gap between minorities and the majority. I can't agree more with this outlook.

[barefoot]

Only problem with "closing the gap" through government preferences is:

one, the voters rejected it;

two, it's unconstitutional;

three, he would place emphasis on race and gender which is short-sighted.

Q: Why should a business owned by a wealthy black person be given preference over a similar business owned by a lower income white person?

He keeps beating this drum and it detracts from his other more sensible ideas that serve to progress GR rather than PC.

[GRDadof3]

I agree that Heartwell needs to drop these attempts to "circumvent" the State laws. Every time I see another proposal in the city commission agenda that still gives minority preference, I just shake my head. It's fine if he thinks it's important, but go rally at the State capitol or something. The way he is doing it is so passive aggressive and he should be working on other issues.

[GR Jackson]

Only problem with "closing the gap" through government preferences is:

one, the voters rejected it;

two, it's unconstitutional;

three, he would place emphasis on race and gender which is short-sighted.

Q: Why should a business owned by a wealthy black person be given preference over a similar business owned by a lower income white person?

He keeps beating this drum and it detracts from his other more sensible ideas that serve to progress GR rather than PC.

[DemocraticEdge]

I agree that Heartwell needs to drop these attempts to "circumvent" the State laws. Every time I see another proposal in the city commission agenda that still gives minority preference, I just shake my head. It's fine if he thinks it's important, but go rally at the State capitol or something. The way he is doing it is so passive aggressive and he should be working on other issues.

[DemocraticEdge]

Another thing I like about Heartwell is that he seems to be down to earth. He always wears the same suit, which says to me that he is unpretentious and not materialistic. As far as quotas go, he is standing for a progressive view of the city which includes a working towards closing the gap between minorities and the majority. I can't agree more with this outlook.

[DemocraticEdge]

Rinck seems just to be a rock thrower, rather than a leader. Sort of like Tormula on the City Commission.

While this personality type is ok if you are a minority member of some political body, it is is unacceptable when you are the longest serving member of a body with eyes of leading that body (Rinck and Tormula again).

Meanwhile, the race is Heartwell's to loose and he seems to be doing everything he can to loose it with his obsession on race quotas.