The Triangle's music scene/market

[cophead567]

I thought this article in the Independent was interesting. It is about the bud light downtown live series and it sounds like it's bashing this year's lineup.

Indeed, if the last two years for Downtown Live have been defined by '90s alt-rock has-beens and one-time radio climbers you forgot existed, this year's line-up is, somehow, a large step down. There's an (award-winning?) U2 cover band, Night Ranger and The Romantics.

[DanRNC]

Such booking has left Raleigh with a festival with as little character or innovation as its growing downtown.

[dmccall]

While I will be seeing Night Ranger, I agree. I'd much rather see more acts like Blue Merle, The Bravery, TV on the Radio, The Hold Steady, etc.

[ncwebguy]

The problem with the "article" (really an op/ed piece with a couple of interviews to give it a "newsy" feel) is that it was written to slam Raleigh first, report on the concert series second.

The booking *is* somewhat reflective of downtown Raleigh -- a mix of the old and familar (headliners) and up and coming (local and regional acts). Like it or not, downtown Raleigh isn't just about "expensive restaurants, glitzy retail shops and the polished open face of a television studio." The city is just coming into its own over the last 3 years or so. For every reject chandeliers or Plensa installation, there is a festival series, a shimmering wall, and a City Square. It is a disservice to focus solely on the negative, but that is what it takes to promote an anti-Raleigh agenda.

Why should a local band who can sleep in their own beds the night before and after the show be paid as much as a bad that has to come from several states or time zones away? Would 10,000 people come if it was headlined by a relatively unknown local act? No. Should they try to attract a greater varitey of acts? Heck yes. I don't know if a) Deep South isn't trying or b) the acts aren't interested in coming. I hoped the first two years' success would lead to greater diversity, a larger budget, etc. but for some reason that isn't the case. Is this because they put too much faith in Deep South? Maybe. Could someone else do a better job? The next closest has been Alive After Five, but it doesn't go all day.

Mr. Currin might not know or problably care, but people will turn out to see those headline bands. They might not be "active" fans, but they will come downtown to see someone they fondly remember for FREE. People want to have a couple of beers and sing along to songs they know. A hundred people might know every song of the local bands, but that isn't enough.

The FREE aspect means they need to get big crowds. The Cradle can put on a show for an audience of 1,000 if they're paying $10 each plus buying beer. They also don't have to take a chance on the weather cooperating. Downtown Live doesn't have that luxury.

I think more downtown partners need to pitch in if they want the concert series to get bigger. Artspace, Exploris, City Market, the Downtown Raleigh Alliance, the downtown merchants/restaurant assocation (is there one???), etc. need to step up. They all benefit from the crowds but don't support it any more than putting a poster up in the window. The article vaguely mentions the lack of other city entities pitching in, but drops the blame on the city's doorstep.

They should also sell more than just beer. I worked at about half the shows and the lack of being able to buy anything but beer was a turn off to families who stopped by in the afternoon. They added some kids things to do, which seemed to draw more, but I don't know if that will continue this year. A deal with the local Coke or Pepsi presenece could be another source of income. A lot of people ate before coming to the show, but if you wanted to eat there, choices were limited. A larger budget would give them the chance to take a few more chances.

[JeffC]

The Independent is really beginning to get on my nerves...yeah, I chuckled at some of the throwaway lines in the article, but I shouldn't have...the entire paper has taken on a nasty, negative tone since it changed publishers (I heard the woman is an absolute harpy).

They seem in a permanent snit about Raleigh and Wake County in the "I've never been there, but I hear the food is terrible" tone of a staff of arts reporters who all apparently live in either Chapel Hill or Durham, never actually visit or have any familiarity with Raleigh and who (evidently, judging from the fawning coverage) must have some kind of under the table financial stake in Cats Cradle. Does saying "North Carolina's preeminant live music club" like a bazillion times make it true?

I love taking progressive friends from Durham/Chapel Hill who have been drinking the Indy's purple Kool-aid of "Raleigh is nothing but nondescript subdivisions and tacky strip malls" for years and driving them through Seaboard, the Halifax Court redevelopment, and the warehouse district and watching the shock on their faces.

EVERY media outlet-- including the Independent-- has a bias and a political agenda. People who think the alternative press is without original sin need to get over that notion...

[jaxpalmer]

Does saying "North Carolina's preeminant live music club" like a bazillion times make it true?

[orulz]

These days some people in Asheville might take issue with that (Orange Peel) but I'd say you're right - Cats Cradle has been around in one location or another for several decades and has really built a name for itself. Compare that to the Orange Peel, which is in the same location as and borrows the name of a 1970s Soul Club, but in its present incarnation has only been around since 2002.

Although I greatly prefer the Orange Peel as a venue (modern facility in a historic building with good acoustics and equipment) to the current location of the Cat's Cradle (strip mall, pretty bad acoustics, kinda odd layout) but I have to agree that the Cat's Cradle name carries a lot more weight than the Orange Peel, and with the new location for the Cradle supposedly in the works as a part of the 300 Main redevelopment in Carrboro, my complaint against the Cradle hopefully won't apply for much longer.

[JeffC]

Point isn't whether the Cradle is or isn't...its that the Indy's constant fawning over them makes it appear from reading their arts coverage that all life as we know it ends a little west of Brier Creek...I heard complaints about their coverage of Raleigh music scene as far back as the early 90s.

[ChiefJoJo]

^I agree. About the only thing Raleigh has consistently going for it is Bob Geary's Citizen column. I do like Indy, but it is tiring to have to hear the constant beating on Raleigh for it's anti-hip music and art scene. Grayson Currin pretty much slammed SparkCon, which featured a nice lineup of mostly Raleigh-based artists, techies, and musicians. Actually, Grayson Currin slams everything in Raleigh. The irony is that Currin is an NC State grad.

[RaleighRob]

The thing is, it seems that the Indy music/entertainment writers are focusing on one or two different types of music to define an area's "music scene". Sure, if you're talking about rock bands, the ChapelHill/Carrboro end may be more "hip" than Raleigh, but that's just one genre of music. There's still jazz/blues, country, electronica/house, classical/opera, r&b/rap, latin, etc etc.

So each city of the Triangle most likely has an advantage for two or three of those types of music. Something for everyone!

[Jones_]

Grsyson Currin has been getting on my nerves with the absolute say-so that all music in Raleigh worth checking out died with Kings and Bickett...or at least venue-wise. The Pourhouse would take great exception to that. As would Volume Eleven, and several others with genres that Grayson could care less for. Sorry Grayson, but just because we are not Indie enough for you, or emo enough for you, does not mean you are the top of the heap....I for one, in line with what Rob mentioned, would like some qualification as to what music you speak for. And don't steal phrasisms (new creative word) like "as far as the creative music scene is concerned", or however you put it in the last article, becasue anyone penning their own work is styled creative. As luck would have it, Kings was my favorite place to catch a new band in Raleigh, but I am just tired hearing about how everything else has to suck....

[tjoad]

Hipsters sigh as graying rock bands flock to Raleigh

Over the next two months, FireHouse ("Love of a Lifetime," 1991) will be followed by free shows by Eddie Money ("Two Tickets to Paradise," 1977), Night Ranger ("Sister Christian," 1984), Soul Asylum ("Runaway Train," 1993) and Warrant ("Cherry Pie," 1990).

[Jones_]

Even though I bashed Grayson Currin I too lean a little indie in my music, but hardly qualify as a Jackpot DJ. With my base position stated, I think downtown Raleigh is officially a lost cause for indie/hipster/starving artists etc. Property of all types is too expensive and venues that rely on a the same 100 people to pay 5 bucks at the door and drink PBR all night simply can't pay the bills. Same for art galleries that sell 30 dollar acrylics and thrift stores. Father and Sons seems to be the exception for now....but all exceptions are on the endangered list in DT proper. I think the bohemian center needs to, if it is not already push its way down Hilsborough St. For one all your affordable apartments are down Hillsboroough. So are places like Cup a Joe, The Brewery, various head shops, Jack Pot etc. The Bolton place near Charlie Goodnights would be a good place to wedge in Kings type venue with an art collective filling up the rest of the space and maybe vegetarian sandwich shop facing Morgan Street to compliment Irregardless.

Maybe these thought belong on the Future of Raleigh but the music got me thinking about it in the first place....

[dmccall]

I heard that Eddie Money also recently played at Smithfield's Ham & Yam Festival.

[RaleighRob]

With my base position stated, I think downtown Raleigh is officially a lost cause for indie/hipster/starving artists etc. Property of all types is too expensive and venues that rely on a the same 100 people to pay 5 bucks at the door and drink PBR all night simply can't pay the bills. Same for art galleries that sell 30 dollar acrylics and thrift stores. Father and Sons seems to be the exception for now....but all exceptions are on the endangered list in DT proper. I think the bohemian center needs to, if it is not already push its way down Hilsborough St. For one all your affordable apartments are down Hillsboroough. So are places like Cup a Joe, The Brewery, various head shops, Jack Pot etc. The Bolton place near Charlie Goodnights would be a good place to wedge in Kings type venue with an art collective filling up the rest of the space and maybe vegetarian sandwich shop facing Morgan Street to compliment Irregardless.

[dmccall]

This very same issue is happening with fresh seafood markets in Wrightsville Beach. There is only one now because real estate has gotten so hot nobody can afford to run some little fish market by the water. A few have closed to be replaced by condo/mixed use projects. To us this is a real quality of life issue.

[Jones_]

Well, there's still Lincoln Theatre, right? I'm not a rock/indie music expert, but I was eating at Fins Friday night, and when we went back up the parking deck we heard some loud music. Apparently Lincoln Theatre closed off E. Cabarrus Street from Blount to Wilmington, set up a huge stage and there seemed several hundred young "indie"-looking kids bouncing around to some hard rock music. I was surprised by this to say the least. There tons of them out there and the whole block seemed theirs for the taking. Interesting for a part of downtown that's not totally bohemian, with quarter-million dollar condos popping up everywhere.

[ChiefJoJo]

Introducing "Small World" straight outta Raleigh... I love this tidbit:

That's why last Friday Ludacris was standing on a barbershop roof near St. Augustine's College with his new artist, filming a video after the shoot was run off a street corner near Raleigh Boulevard for not having a permit.

[DanRNC]

^Signature Raleigh. Someone was probably getting robbed and murdered down the street as the cops roughed up the video crew.

[ncwebguy]

The Raleigh Blvd. corridor is pretty safe since no one has anything to steal.

I don't know where they would want to shoot a video there... The Boys and Girls club? The shopping center with the food lion and shoe store outparcel? The small collection of stores near St. Augs is pretty neat and probably made a good backdrop for the video. It is hard to tell when anything is open there, and the streets weren't made for the constant on-street parking.

That being said, where do acts like Small World, Little Brother, etc. perform around here? Black Tie? There was a club on Hargett in the Raleigh Furniture building (down from Heilig-Levine) but it is being rennovated now. I would love to see the Stone Warehouse (on the SE corner) converted to a music venue for all kinds of acts. The Rex Senior center doesn't need its parking at night, and there is plenty of parking on Chavis Way. The residents of Carlton Place (the empty lot in the satellite picture) might not be up for that.

Or the Raleigh Events Center, formerly Retail and Martin Street Music Hall. It is Lincoln Theater/Kings sized, but would be another option in the heart of the CBD.

The Blount/Person/Hammond Road area south of downtonwn could be a "bohemian" area with a venue as large as the Ritz/Disco Rodeo. The 9:30 club in DC is in a rough neighborhood but still attracts larger acts. It seems the "artistic" crowd here doesn't want to take a chance in affordable Southeast Raleigh. It could develop into an area like Charlotte's North Davidson (NoDa) but so far it is no dice. Or the Cargill plant smell is too much.

[ncwebguy]

The city of Durham seems to be as "welcoming" of the music scene as Raleigh is. The city is not working with 305 South , part store part performance space, into keeping its doors open. They held an auction on Saturday to raise awarness of the space (and money).

Where is the Kings-like "end of downtown" cries from the Independent? Nowhere. They skirted the laws of a nightclub by being a store for months, yet they still can not afford to do the fire exits and bathroom work to be a nightclub.

[Redman84]

I've just learned of this venue only recently, which is surprising to me considering I work in the live music business here in town....but has anyone heard anything about or been to Volume 11 Tavern? Its located just off Lake Wheeler Rd. across from the State Farmers Market, behind the Capital Seafood Market on Maywood Ave.

[Jones_]

I've just learned of this venue only recently, which is surprising to me considering I work in the live music business here in town....but has anyone heard anything about or been to Volume 11 Tavern? Its located just off Lake Wheeler Rd. across from the State Farmers Market, behind the Capital Seafood Market on Maywood Ave.

[DanRNC]

^ I'll be there Sat. night for the Helmet/Totimoshi/Burning Brides show. First time going there.

[Jones_]

Holy crap...Helmet?? I would say that is quite a coup for this place...I might have to walk down and check it out.