Hall House to be sold and demolished!

[mallguy]

Again, I'm not seeking a direct comparison to Manhattan. Obviously Uptown NYC is more desirable than Uptown Charlotte, so the quality of businesses there will be different (to the point of excluding small-time companies). Uptown Charlotte is not THAT developed, so such an exclusion should not be happening here.

The point is that older buildings usually command lower rent rates...

Right but my point is that prime streets are going to attract A-grade companies, regardless of the type of building. Independence Center at Trade & Tryon is in my view B-grade office space (small, dark offices with low ceilings inside, despite the nice lobby), for example, but it still has some high-quality law firms and Bank of America as tenants. I think that if Hall House were kept and converted into office space, it'd probably be done decently and would attract some bank (or those who feed off the banks) as a tenant. Sure, Midtown Manhattan (uptown is the 'hood!) is more desirable in the big scheme of things than uptown Charlotte, but Tryon Street, for office space (not retail), is Charlotte's Fifth Avenue, and even an older building on it will be eventually used by a higher-end office tenant.

Charlotte ought to be encouraging some less-desirable areas to keep their older commercial buildings if the point is to generate new businesses that can't pay high rents at the beginning. I still think Eastland Mall would be a good place for a call center or a C or D-grade office park-type building.

[Justadude]

I think that if Hall House were kept and converted into office space, it'd probably be done decently and would attract some bank (or those who feed off the banks) as a tenant.

Possibly so, but it would still be "some bank" and not one of THE banks in Charlotte. BoA and Wachovia are not likely going to move their people into Hall House under any circumstances -- they're big enough to custom-build their own facilities, as both of them are currently doing -- so even IF another bank bought into the place, it would be a bank that was obviously not out building its own towers... i.e., one that would otherwise not relocate to Tryon St. at all, and most likely not a Grade-A company.

But I doubt the place would be scooped up by yet another bank, unless you had someone particular in mind. More than likely it would go to someone outside the banking industry, which would diversify the business district. Either way it worked out, the district's economy would be diversified and therefore made healthier. Again, the point here is to diversify the district as much as possible; selling to a company who has plans to demolish the building is almost a sure sign that the lot will be converted to a shiny office skyscraper or condo tower and therefore make only a marginal gain in that direction. Considering this is the last old highrise available for conversion in Charlotte -- that there is absolutely no going back after this, that the supply of 60+ year old office space on Tryon St. will be completely and utterly exhausted forever -- one would expect that the public's best interest is in keeping the wrecking balls away from this one.

[cyrusuncc]

I know its been said here a lot, but i'm going to add in my comments anyway. I find it sad that Charlotte has an "out with the old, in with the new" attitude about buildings. Go you to any *REAL* city and you see a mix of old and new. I was in Chicago a few months back and loved fact that there were very old buildings next to the shiny new ones. You would see an old 10 story brick building, but the inside was totally rehabbed into a contemporary office (hard woods, glass desks, etc..). I'm not saying that it is never ok to demolish an old building, but when i drive through Uptown it just looks a little too pretty.. ya know what i mean?

I understand the economics of it being cheaper to demolish an old building then to purchase another parcel for more money, but if we really want the skyline to expand, build on the open spaces!!

[Miesian Corners]

I know its been said here a lot, but i'm going to add in my comments anyway. I find it sad that Charlotte has an "out with the old, in with the new" attitude about buildings. Go you to any *REAL* city and you see a mix of old and new. I was in Chicago a few months back and loved fact that there were very old buildings next to the shiny new ones. You would see an old 10 story brick building, but the inside was totally rehabbed into a contemporary office (hard woods, glass desks, etc..). I'm not saying that it is never ok to demolish an old building, but when i drive through Uptown it just looks a little too pretty.. ya know what i mean?

I understand the economics of it being cheaper to demolish an old building then to purchase another parcel for more money, but if we really want the skyline to expand, build on the open spaces!!

I agree. hueion39's example of what has been done in BOS is a great example of how do have both. Sadly, the powers that be in Charlotte have no incentive to do anything like that. It is cheaper to demolish the building (it is rife with asbestos, has poor column placement for modern uses, and has low ceiling heights) than paying for a rehab.

I spoke with someone involved in this project Friday. It will be demolished. Sadly, Charlotte's soul (if there's anything left of it) will be a damned a little further when this occurs.

[cyrusuncc]

Very sad... i just drove past it today after lunch as a reference point and think it's totally worth saving.. now that extension added can go as far as i'm concerned... i suppose that is moot now.

[cltheel.sdl]

Are they just going to pave it over with a parking lot or is something actually going to be built?

[Justadude]

Are they just going to pave it over with a parking lot or is something actually going to be built?

Unless there's a surprise in the works, this will make two large older buildings on N. Tryon which have been demolished on speculation.

[ChesterCopperPot]

Does anybody know what is going to be done with the Hall House? Is this land still for sale or has the CHA passed ownership?

[atlrvr]

As far as I know undecided....I had heard many years ago, BofA was interested. CHA then put it on the back burner for a while. Now that the senior community at the former Live Oak site in South Park is nearly complete, they can begin moving the remaining residents out. At that point, I think they wil become more aggressive in the sales effert.

This site and Edwin Towers are the next two on the sales block as far as I know. I think the development and political climate have changed slightly in the last 3-4 years, so there may be interest from developers to do a rehab + new development. They own a decent chunk of land along with the existing builing.

I know there has been some private interest in rehabbing the building, and if the HLC could get involved, it would be of benefit, though ultimately, if the bank wants the land, they will get it because they have the money and patience.

Personally, I'd like to see it go back to a hotel (with additional uses on the vacant land)....some companies such as Sage Hospitality specialize in this kind of hotel rehab project if they were to find the right local partner. The problem is we have few local developers who have real vision.

[tombarnes]

Wouldn't Charlotte's hotel market support more hotel rooms downtown? I'd think that this might even be interesting as a W Hotel. The building might not excite much interest from many, but its restrained Art Deco details are worth keeping. It would be a shame to tear down a solid building for something less permanent in nature. I hope that whoever buys the building won't demolish it.

[Raintree21]

I was there the other day and was told that they still had something like 40 residents still living there and they are just waiting for them to move out before they tear the place down.

[nonillogical]

I was there the other day and was told that they still had something like 40 residents still living there and they are just waiting for them to move out before they tear the place down.

well, i kinda like the building and think it has plenty of re-use potential, but if this goes, my view is going to become 10 times better and i couldn't complain, until something taller replaces that block.

[atlrvr]

An update on Hall House. Apparantly the housing authority is negotiating a sale with an unnamed buyer that will preserve the current building in the site's redevelopment. If negotiations fall through, the site will be put up to bid with prioritization given to developers the propose keeping Hall House.

I'm hoping we see it once again becoming a hotel, plus with the included land, there is plenty of room for 1-2 more buildings on the site.....this does not include the BofA owned parking lot and Farvan Gallery building along 7th.

[MZT]

Anyone here actually been inside the Hall House? Just how run-down is it, really?

(For what it's worth, I don't think removing the slab-sided 1950s addition from the back, would be much of a loss.)

[Raintree21]

Anyone here actually been inside the Hall House? Just how run-down is it, really?

(For what it's worth, I don't think removing the slab-sided 1950s addition from the back, would be much of a loss.)

I don't know if I'd say it's horribly run down (it was built back when they used quality materials that were meant to last) but it's definitely not nice. It could use a LOT of refurbishing. The residences are 2 rooms (1 BR and 1 living room with a wall partitioning off a very small kitchen).

[Charlotte_native]

^Looks like this place has gotten at least a short term new lease on life. It was recently cleaned out, cleaned up, and is housing homeleff families, moms and kids. Fantastic smart work by the city -- something I hate to admit they often seem to be lacking in. I hope this buys enough time for a permanent solution to keeping this building -- perhaps even as a permanent facility for families trying to stay on, or get on, their feet.

[RiverwoodCLT]

It is better than a vacant lot.

[InitialD]

I posted an article on CLTblog about the Hall House renovation, but here are some extra photos for those interested in seeing what the interior of this building looks like.

Most of the apartments are 600 square feet. Here you can see the kitchen and door to the bathroom. The door to the hallway is just off to the left of the photo. The ovens/ranges had to be removed due to some fire regulations. They did a good job getting the room clean, repaired, and repainted. Only floors 1 through 6 are being used, however. What I saw of the building really reminds me of what an older college dorm looks like.

Here's the view from the kitchen area. Many of the apartments have a room of equal size that connects off to the right of this photo. Also, the corner units on each floor are a good bit larger.

Typically what each hallway looks like. The hallways make a complete loop around each floor. The interior of each floor holds the two elevator shafts, stairwells, and each floor has a rec room with tables and things, and will have a microwave and maybe a TV. Hallways on the 4th through 6th floors have a spot where part of the drywall has been pealed off. If I had to guess, I'd say it looks like there had been a water leak and the outer paint-covered paper of the drywall had gotten mold and had to be pealed off. It was progressively worse each floor up, about a 5 foot wide patch in the 6th floor hall, so I'm worried the water damage will be much worse on floors above 6th (I didn't get a chance to go above 6th)

Here are the elevators on the first floor.

Also on the first floor, from the elevators this hallway leads back to a large open area that most likely will be used to serve meals.

In the very back of the building is this ballroom.

[dubone]

Thanks for posting that. I have never seen inside. Looks like it got some unfortunate low-cost downgrades inside over the years. But it looks perfectly good for otherwise homeless for this recession. I am very glad they are going to use it for that purpose for the next few years.

[InitialD]

I am very glad they are going to use it for that purpose for the next few years.

That's the problem. They only have it to use with certainty until June or July. The fate of the building after that is uncertain. It could remain a shelter or it could be sold. Too early to tell.

[nonillogical]

That's the problem. They only have it to use with certainty until June or July. The fate of the building after that is uncertain. It could remain a shelter or it could be sold. Too early to tell.

thats really great to see, and a good use of the building (though if it were converted to apartments people WOULD pay to live there and i think it would be great to have more options like that uptown).

on a personal note, i'd be lying if i said i was thrilled to now have homeless shelters on both sides of me (yes i live in tryon house). having the family situation here makes it clearly different, and i've never really been bothered by the homeless when they congregate around my building. they hardly ever ask me for anything, and some have been quite cool to talk to. i can't get enough of the guy that always has a 70's boombox on his shoulder and dances. i just hope its not a continuing trend to add to the huge concentration already present around the north side of the loop.

its funny since i live here, but i didn't even know it was vacant...how long has it been? i was told when i moved in that it an old folks home and i did see people in the lobby regularly.

[tozmervo]

I love the motivational posters over the elevators

[dubone]

I suspect that CHA and the city will make the decision to extend the use for it in this way. They should not be so dumb as to think they could get it redeveloped at this point, and without redevelopment, the value of the land is not going to be that much. It would be tragic if the only available buyer were Preferred Parking or something for surface lot on Tryon to replace a decent looking 70 year old brick building.

Plus, we all know that that this is going to be a very hard time in the country and it would be a certifiable sin to tear down a habitable building to be replaced with parking for automobiles (the almost certain outcome if the building is sold this year) until after we are through this economic mess.

[monsoon]

It's a nice use of a property like that. I good move for Charlotte.

[InitialD]

its funny since i live here, but i didn't even know it was vacant...how long has it been? i was told when i moved in that it an old folks home and i did see people in the lobby regularly.

It was housing for the elderly previously, but had sat vacant for around a year.