Raleigh "R-Line" Downtown Circulator

[Transplant]

WRAL has reported that the Downtown Raleigh Alliance is pushing for expanded Trolley service. I like this idea, and would love to see this succeed and lead to a fixed rail system.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1236648/

[ChiefJoJo]

Here's the link.

In the Alliance

[Jones_]

I still am thinking even bigger with full scale Trolley service at least 6 days a week, morning to evening and either free or very cheap as a perk for those visiting or living downtown. I am not set on the routes I have drawn but just put those there as a starting point (sorry my digital skills are weak)

parking_guide.pdf

parking_guide.pdf

[danclever]

I wonder how expensive it would be to add in signal priority at intersections? I'm sure it wouldn't be cheap, but it might cut down on all the starting and stopping that normal buses have to endure. It could also make the service run faster/more efficiently. Of course, some intersections would always be tricky.

[Transplant]

I put this together a while back. This was part of a larger system I was thinking about, but the Red line is a route for a trolley. It could go up to Peace st. or Lane St instead of going across Jones. The black boxes are stops, circles are 1/4 mi. radii. Cutting along the train tracks in the Warehouse Dist. would cost money to build, but would limit the number of turns, and speed service.

[ChiefJoJo]

It's important to realize that a lot of potential routes and schedule are at least on the table right now. If you really want a viable circulator service running 6 days a week, I'd suggest either going to an RTA (CAT) board meeting or writing to them, asking for the service you want.

Given the mostly conservative (anti-transit) council we have and their growing anti-downtown sentiments, there's a 99% chance there will be some major slashing of budgets on this, so CAT and the DRA will eventually need some backup from the community to support the need for expanding trolley service. My 2 cents.

[ncwebguy]

Do we know any specific email addresses at CAT to direct our concerns to?

There has been discussion on a downtown blog I post to about the need for a trolley a couple of times in the last year.

I think they would be on board for an email campaign if we know who to get in touch with. I'd like to think the Downtown Raleigh Alliance could make the case themselves, but this is too important to take that chance. Especially with the Pope, umm, John Locke Foundation beating the anti-transit drum again today.

[Jones_]

It's important to realize that a lot of potential routes and schedule are at least on the table right now. If you really want a viable circulator service running 6 days a week, I'd suggest either going to an RTA (CAT) board meeting or writing to them, asking for the service you want.

Given the mostly conservative (anti-transit) council we have and their growing anti-downtown sentiments, there's a 99% chance there will be some major slashing of budgets on this, so CAT and the DRA will eventually need some backup from the community to support the need for expanding trolley service. My 2 cents.

[ChiefJoJo]

I'm in Charlotte this week without a car, and I have been able to get around reasonably well riding the bus. With the speed street race events going on, the goldrush, which is the free fare bus "trolley" that runs around Uptown, really is handy for tourists and others to get around. We really neeed to get something similar up and running in Raleigh by next summer when the RCC opens. IMO it should run up F St, thru the state govt complex and over to Glenwood South.

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

I'm in Charlotte this week without a car, and I have been able to get around reasonably well riding the bus. With the speed street race events going on, the goldrush, which is the free fare bus "trolley" that runs around Uptown, really is handy for tourists and others to get around. We really neeed to get something similar up and running in Raleigh by next summer when the RCC opens. IMO it should run up F St, thru the state govt complex and over to Glenwood South.

[dmccall]

I completely agree. I wonder if businesses/condo associations down there would be willing to help pay a trolley association fee along with the City. They are the ones who directly benefit. I think the trolley fee has to be FREE. There is a real psychological barrier when there is even a .25 charge. We went to a wedding one time in Chattanooga and found ourselves excited to jump on the free electric bus, which only ran an out-and-back route on 1 street. I created a situation where we wanted to shop and eat within a block of the line. We didn't even entertain the idea of going 5 blocks from the line.

[DPK]

businesses/condo associations down there would be willing to help pay a trolley association fee

[Jones_]

For a place with any remarkable amentities, HOA dues are 300 a month (mine are anyway). Spiking that for a free ride would never fly if 25 cents a ride or so would make that unnecessary. I agree such a trolley should be free though. As a visitor amentiy as well, the city should be able to cover this and play with the numbers in a way wo that increased property values downtown 'cover' it in the way that increased property values along 540 supposedly pay for that.

[burt]

Hmmmmm. That's has a nice ring to it -- ROLLY TROLLY.

[ChiefJoJo]

DRA Prez. David Diaz interviewed on downtown issues... not a whole lot new here... more residential needed, retail, not just towers, in 5-10 years, DT Ral will be totally different... the main point I took was the need to connect all these areas via some type of public transport so we won't be dependent on walking (it's a hike from say, Mellow Mushroom to Lincoln Theatre). I think we need should expand the existing showtime trolley, but expand the hours to perhaps lunchtime on weekdays and expand the routes once the RCC is complete in 2008 (Fayetteville and Salisbury will be open) to cover the RCC, PE Ctr, F St, Moore Sq, Govt Ctr/state museums, Warehouse District, and GlenSo.

[ChiefJoJo]

CAT is moving forward with plans for the trolley circulator to begin service later this year, presumably coinciding with the convention center, hotel and Fayetteville St phase 2 openings.

• link the RCC, government complex, Glenwood South, Warehouse District, Moore Square, etc.

• free fare & 15 min (or less) headways (similar to Charlotte's "Gold Rush")

• up to six 40-ft low-floor hybrid buses; quieter and reduced emissions; cost $525,000 ea.

This should go forward to city council later this year once funding is established. With the makeup of the new council, I expect easy approval. I assume this will replace the current limited evening showtime trolley service.

[Jones_]

nice....these sorts of things are very important for visitors and impressions made on them. Nice perk for downtown residents too

[DwnTwnRaleighGuy]

For a place with any remarkable amentities, HOA dues are 300 a month (mine are anyway). Spiking that for a free ride would never fly if 25 cents a ride or so would make that unnecessary. I agree such a trolley should be free though. As a visitor amentiy as well, the city should be able to cover this and play with the numbers in a way wo that increased property values downtown 'cover' it in the way that increased property values along 540 supposedly pay for that.

[RiverwoodCLT]

The trolley in Uptown Charlotte is paid by the business located in up town.

The rail trolley will run on the South Blue line and will charge a fare. It will start back service in February.

[Jones_]

$300.00 a month!!!!!!!!!!!! What the,(bleep), does that include? Can I come over and swim in your pool? Play tennis on your tennis courts? Workout in you gym? Park in your extra parking space?

[ncwebguy]

Why hasn't any media picked up on this yet if it is more than a rumor?

I am hoping for free, but wouldn't mind paying 25 or 50 cents, but would prefer the option of "tokens" handed out by hotels/restaurants/shops. This could keep off the kids that ride the showtime trolley and scare everyone else off it while the driver does nothing.

As long as there is a stop on Hargett by the Marbles/Imax entrance, I'll be happy. It would make getting to south downtown (CC, Raleigh Memorial complex), the warehouse district, and Glenwood South a car-free experience for everyone already somewhere downtown.

The key to its success will be the hours of operation. Stopping it too early will make it useless for the bar/club crowd, and I don't think there is enough theater traffic to justify an expanded version of the showtime trolley.

It is good to see the Charlotte trolley coming back. Raleigh can do something similar, with rail trolleys synched with the circulator, but I don't know who a rail trolley would serve *right now* except NC State Students, unless they run it to the rails that go through downtowns in Cary, Wake Forest and/or Garner. Even then, ridership would be low.

[ChiefJoJo]

Why hasn't any media picked up on this yet if it is more than a rumor?

[ncwebguy]

I don't see the new council voting against this, but is there anything we can do to show support? Email? Petition? Something else? Should it be geared toward CAT or the counicl? I think this would be a good "advocacy" project for this board, and we can try to promote it via other blogs, groups, etc.

Maybe the amount of money involved needs council approval? I guess there is nothing that needs to be done other than posting signs at the stops and buying the buses.

It is odd that the media sometimes deems rumors about projects newsworthy while other projects get little to no coverage.

I guess it isn't a story until something is on the city council's agenda to approve buying the buses, but why is this a city council decision and not part of CAT operations? Council gets involved sometimes, like when the shopping centers decided they didn't want buses on their properties. But CAT is better suited to "micromanage" service, routes, service, etc. vs. the council.

[Gard]

I don't see the new council voting against this, but is there anything we can do to show support? Email? Petition? Something else? Should it be geared toward CAT or the counicl? I think this would be a good "advocacy" project for this board, and we can try to promote it via other blogs, groups, etc.

Maybe the amount of money involved needs council approval? I guess there is nothing that needs to be done other than posting signs at the stops and buying the buses.

It is odd that the media sometimes deems rumors about projects newsworthy while other projects get little to no coverage.

I guess it isn't a story until something is on the city council's agenda to approve buying the buses, but why is this a city council decision and not part of CAT operations? Council gets involved sometimes, like when the shopping centers decided they didn't want buses on their properties. But CAT is better suited to "micromanage" service, routes, service, etc. vs. the council.

[Jones_]

I too have received responses from Meeker. Also I sent a few emails to him and others about the 1870's commercial buildings at the NW corner of the Edison block.....sure enough they are all saved at the moment, even Isaacs that Progress bought up too, so maybe someone either listened a bit or was thinking the same thing I was...either way, I generally am more encouraged rather than less so when I try to get someones attention on something.