The Gateway Site

[deltad22]

The taxes and fees is what I was referring to.  I hope that this piece of land gets developed, but I hope its something that will really stand out and be a true gateway to our great city.   

[Jet-set]

A few tidbits here:

http://www.wyff4.com/article/developer-purchases-empty-downtown-greenville-lot-with-legendary-history/14745450

Proposed 200,000 mixed use multi-phase multi-building project. Good to see local developers here. 

[johnpro318]

43 minutes ago, Jet-set said:

A few tidbits here:

http://www.wyff4.com/article/developer-purchases-empty-downtown-greenville-lot-with-legendary-history/14745450

Proposed 200,000 mixed use multi-phase multi-building project. Good to see local developers here. 

How many acres is the site? What would 200K square feet equal in terms of height?

[gman]

1 hour ago, johnpro318 said:

How many acres is the site? What would 200K square feet equal in terms of height?

It’s 1.83 acres. 

[Jet-set]

Depends, but they could conceivably fit 200,000 square feet in 4 or 5 stories within that 1.83 acre site. Then again they could make it 12 stories or more. Two Liberty Square is 12 stories and totals 185,000 square feet but is on only .735 acres. 

Interesting though that they are proposing multiple buildings in multiple phases. Might increase the height. 

[johnpro318]

51 minutes ago, Jet-set said:

Depends, but they could conceivably fit 200,000 square feet in 4 or 5 stories within that 1.83 acre site. Then again they could make it 12 stories or more. Two Liberty Square is 12 stories and totals 185,000 square feet but is on only .735 acres. 

Interesting though that they are proposing multiple buildings in multiple phases. Might increase the height. 

That’s what I’m thinking. Multiple buildings might just mean two buildings but that could increase the height a little. Probably just a couple less than six or seven stories. 

[ausrutherford]

Some of that acreage would be sacrificed for parking I am sure, which I doubt was counted in the sq. ft. given. 

[gman430]

2 hours ago, johnpro318 said:

That’s what I’m thinking. Multiple buildings might just mean two buildings but that could increase the height a little. Probably just a couple less than six or seven stories. 

If it’s only six to seven stories, I hope it falls through. This site deserves a signature high-rise and nothing less. 

Edited January 5, 2018 by gman430

[apaladin]

On 1/4/2018 at 9:05 PM, gman430 said:

If it’s only six to seven stories, I hope it falls through. This site deserves a signature high-rise and nothing less. 

I agree gman, if there is not height, leave it alone.  I don't like the term "multi-phase" either.  Multi-phase for less than 2 acres? To me that translates into a long time before it is complete if it ever is.  I am not really excited about this, just smells like another failure on the horizon. Anyone want to bet we don't hear anymore about this for a long time?

Edited January 6, 2018 by apaladin

[Spero]

1 hour ago, gman430 said:

If it’s only six to seven stories, I hope it falls through. This site deserves a signature high-rise and nothing less. 

mmmmmmmmmmmI don't know if that's realistic. The neighborhood around the site is not helpful. The new federal courthouse will only add a little height to the area.

Demanding an 8+ story tower or bust may be an exercise in cutting off one's nose to spite one's face

Edited January 5, 2018 by Spero

[ausrutherford]

9 hours ago, apaladin said:

I agree gman, if there is not height, leave it alone.  I don't like the term "multi-phase" either.  Multi-phase for less than 2 acres? To me that translates into a long time before it is complete if it ever is.  I am not really excited about this, just smells like another failure on the horizon. Anyone want to bet we don't here anymore about this for a long time?

ONE was multiphased....

[Upstate Guy]

At this point, I am going to say any development is better than nothing at all on that site. The site itself has so many issues that it has to deal with. I would be happy with a good 5-6 story building or in a perfect world a "ONE" sized building. 

[gvegascple]

did all of the issues with this site suddenly go away?  There is so much renewed optimism, but how do we know this isn't another developer buying and saying they have big plans only to sell again in a few years?  How about we put a big "welcome to Greenville" sign there as we go through all of this :-)  

[gman430]

I wouldn't have a problem with something the height, size, and scale of the ONE buildings especially with the site being on a higher elevation. However, I still don't want anything only 5-6 stories tall. For me, the buildings need to be at least ten stories tall. 

[gvegascple]

19 minutes ago, gman430 said:

I wouldn't have a problem with something the height, size, and scale of the ONE buildings especially with the site being on a higher elevation. However, I still don't want anything only 5-6 stories tall. For me, the buildings need to be at least ten stories tall. 

Why would anyone do that, spend that kind of money when we can still either go out or find one of the many empty parking lots with much better access to invest in?  This is sort of this location's Achilles heel? its just a little too far from everything (other than being a great place for a welcome to Greenville sign), access sucks, and there are enough alternative locations left to pass this one up, invest very little, or hang on to it and resell.

[gman430]

nvm.

Edited January 5, 2018 by gman430

[cabelagent]

22 minutes ago, gvegascple said:

Why would anyone do that, spend that kind of money when we can still either go out or find one of the many empty parking lots with much better access to invest in?  This is sort of this location's Achilles heel? its just a little too far from everything (other than being a great place for a welcome to Greenville sign), access sucks, and there are enough alternative locations left to pass this one up, invest very little, or hang on to it and resell.

Remember....its been 20 YEARS since this site became  available & nothing has developed that is suitable/attractive utilizing it. That's a long time and an indication of the difficulty a developer will encounter for the property.  I hope this is the real deal and something special is built. I pray we are not hearing crickets a year from now...

[Exile]

I suppose that, in a way, the problem of this island is the price paid for what downtown actually has now.

As I recall (and I was single-digit age at the time), the right fork that is now Beattie Place was constructed ca. 1970-ish, I guess to extend College St. and to improve the flow through that part of downtown. I'm pretty sure that before then, North St. had been two-way all the way to Heritage Green.

Anyway, without that road construction (which orphaned the old Memorial Auditorium site) there might have been no Hyatt, no U. S. Shelter Center/Liberty Square, and all the redevelopment that ensued, including the arena. Or, at least, the alternative history would be quite different.

 

 

[Upstate Guy]

Random thought...I don't see this location as being far away from anything but I enjoy a good walk (except in the current weather). It's apx. 1100 feet to Main street and if you go to main and turn down main its 2200ish to the One Plaza area.  IF they do build a hotel here, it would be really smart to include a downtown shuttle that runs every 15-30 minutes from the hotel all the way to the West End with a stop at One Plaza, the Peace Center, and the Ball Field. It would be a selling point for anyone not staying for an event at the Well.

[ausrutherford]

There are some simple solutions to improve accessibility to the site.

1. The City wants to put Beattie Place on a road diet; this would be the perfect opportunity to do it.

2. A pedestrian crossing light at E. North St and Broadus Ave. This would connect to a semi-linear plaza that would come from the intersection of Church and E.North, continue to the red crossing, then proceed north to the bridge, and then finally back west to Beattie/Church.

The parking entrance should be on Church Street. There could also be a car entrance only (no exit) ramp going west bound on E. North after it splits from Beattie.

I am betting they will want to go under ground with the parking. This could lead to a new bridge (and a new wall) over Beattie.

[gvegascple]

Does anyone have a history of the sale prices over the years?  20 years and nothing to show for it, was wondering if you are better off buying an empty lot in TR than this spot regarding ROI.  There needs to be alot more development near it in my opinion before its worth investment.  Take a bus to downtown?  You can do that from Haywood for a lot less.  No one would walk to the west end or city center to shop and then have to lug their bags all the way back to this spot.  The best retail access they have is to the Hyatt and that spot of North Main which is less than hot right now.  Maybe in another ten years we will see something here...

Edited January 8, 2018 by gvegascple

[vicupstate]

January 2008 Sold from the Auditorium authority for 1,810,000. Sold on 11/30/2017 for 3,000,000. 

 

[gman430]

On 1/5/2018 at 4:13 PM, gvegascple said:

Why would anyone do that, spend that kind of money when we can still either go out or find one of the many empty parking lots with much better access to invest in?  This is sort of this location's Achilles heel? its just a little too far from everything (other than being a great place for a welcome to Greenville sign), access sucks, and there are enough alternative locations left to pass this one up, invest very little, or hang on to it and resell.

You’re right and because of that they should put a QT on site instead. 

[gvegascple]

24 minutes ago, vicupstate said:

January 2008 Sold from the Auditorium authority for 1,810,000. Sold on 11/30/2017 for 3,000,000. 

 

Yikes so about what you get from a money market.

18 minutes ago, gman430 said:

You’re right and because of that they should put a QT on site instead. 

Well I wouldn't exactly go that far, maybe somewhere in between a QT and the 20 story building that everyone wants here.  Id settle for more realistic expectations in the short term.

 

[SVL]

https://greenvillejournal.com/2018/03/28/city-asks-what-the-future-holds-for-downtown-greenville/

 In the Gateway District, there are plans to build a hotel on the former Greenville Memorial Auditorium site. 

Interesting quote in the Journal today. Wonder when the plan will be revealed?