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ncsugrad204

Winston Hotels 25-story tower @ Hillsborough & Harrington St

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The location is just across Harrington from Second Empire, on the block next to the Clarion. This is a great location for hotels and condos, in what is now a relatively quiet area between Glenwood South and Fayetteville Street. It's a bit of a walk from the Convention Center (about 3/4 mile) but when there's a convention going on, I'm sure they will run a shuttle service.

I don't think there are any notable buildings on that block. The L-shaped building at Hillsborough & Harrington is OK, I guess, but in spite of its age it doesn't really do a good job addressing the street. The only business I can recall along there is a gym.

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The only business I can recall along there is a gym.

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Man, I walk past there everyday. I've been wondering when something like this would happen to that block or the one across Hillsborough St. It's kind of a transition area between the DT core, RCC, and Glenwood South, and the buildings are fairly nondescript and run down, so it makes sense to locate something large here to serve both areas.

With the 80-room Aloft and 120-room Hampton Inn, and 200-250 condos, I imagine he's going to do perhaps two towers right? I can't ever recall seeing two hotel franchises in the same structure. Good deal to about getting the approval of Inland American, who just agreeed to buy Winston. I does seem like a no brainer project.

Here's the site.

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Haha I've been saying for years that we need a Hampton Inn downtown - I'm glad we're finally getting it!

Another thing - Winston hotels seemed to poopoo downtown for a long time but it says they've been scouting for 3 years? Whats up with that?

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With the 80-room Aloft and 120-room Hampton Inn, and 200-250 condos, I imagine he's going to do perhaps two towers right? I can't ever recall seeing two hotel franchises in the same structure. Good deal to about getting the approval of Inland American, who just agreeed to buy Winston. I does seem like a no brainer project.

Here's the site.

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Its good to see them adding some more affordability to the DT Raleigh hotel market. The Sheraton is rather affordable now but I can see rates increasing after its facelift and after the convention center opens. In a couple of years I won't even recognize this place.

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Raleigh's downtown in the next 6 years will look nothing like it does today. It seems that this city of just under 400,000 in a metropolitan area of over 1.5 million will have a downtown skyline to match.

It's nice to see Raleigh's downtown catching up with the Raleigh-Durham region's growth.

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Raleigh's downtown in the next 6 years will look nothing like it does today. It seems that this city of just under 400,000 in a metropolitan area of over 1.5 million will have a downtown skyline to match.

It's nice to see Raleigh's downtown catching up with the Raleigh-Durham region's growth.

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I can't wait to see rendernings, though they probably wont be coming for a while. This is a huge plus for the city.

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I wonder what this does to the Reynolds building since that had a hotel planned. Without a hotel and struggling for a major tenant, I wonder if they will ever break ground. Winston has much more capital than the Reynolds.

Also, I find it funny. Reynolds rented part of this block to keep other restaurants away and so he could control the tenants on the block. One of the businesses that was there for a while was his daughters' as he had to fill them since he was renting.

It is the perfect place for a hotel and the double identity is great. I wonder how they will do the entrances. Will one side be the Aloft and the other side be the Hampton. I would not imagine the entrance would be the same. Depends on where the lobby is. Sometimes lobbys are on a higher floor. So maybe the building has an entrance and the Hamption lobby would be on the 4th floor and the Aloft would be on the 5th floor. Wonder if they use the same elevators? Questions Questions

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The good thing about this tower is that it will continue to add length to the skyline. Good going Bob Winston!

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Haha I've been saying for years that we need a Hampton Inn downtown - I'm glad we're finally getting it!

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Amen to that!! I've been saying that too. Everyone seems to only get excited if it has a bunch of stars, but I know with my travel per diem at work I spend a lot of time at Hampton Inns.

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Sorry to double post, but I was just reading the N&O article again, and it seems to really emphsize that these hotels will be competing with the lafayette, reynolds, and other area hotels. I just don't see it. When I add up existing and planned rooms that are in walking distance to the CC I get:

Sheraton- 355

Marriot- @400

Lafayette- @125

Clarion- 202

Reynolds- @70

HI/Aloft- @200

for a total of 1352 rooms. For a refernce the Koury Cenetr in Greensboro alone has almost 1100. I think the market can absorb these and a lot more. The CC's target audience is midsize conferences. I think DanRNC said they had just booked a 1500 Chamber Exec conference. Even with all the planned rooms that isn't enough. Anyway, this is exciting news!! Wooo-hooo!

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:yahoo: Happy Day!

I also wonder about parking. Is there a deck involved with this building?

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Definitely this project will add density to that area of Downtown - I remember people were worried about the Reynolds Tower (32 story) would stick out - but I think we're getting a little mini-skyline in that area as well. We'll have the West at North which I'm sure you'll be able to see, Quorum, Clarion, Reynolds I & II (eventually) and now this. I would almost also consider the Wachovia Center part of this "skyline" as well.

Connectivity is an issue this downtown has had for years and with this project and Reynolds along with smaller projects like the Dawson and the "Hue" which I believe is what they are renaming the Nash - or so I heard from my real estate agent - this issue is being addressed. We may not have the prettiest or even second prettiest skyline in the state in the coming years, but we will have the most vibrant and exciting...I truly believe that. (okay, maybe asheville's will still be better - lets say best "large city" downtown in the state :) )

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Good point !! This may give the State Employee a place to stay downtown instead out on the beltline somewhere.

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I think the DT Raleigh hotel market is far from saturated considering the starting point was essentially zilch. Everytime there was a gala event for the NC Symphony it had to be held at one of the Crabtree area hotels which seemed kind of ridiculous. Next step is to transform the Sir Walter Raleigh into a Novotel.

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Haha I've been saying for years that we need a Hampton Inn downtown - I'm glad we're finally getting it!

Another thing - Winston hotels seemed to poopoo downtown for a long time but it says they've been scouting for 3 years? Whats up with that?

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I think the DT Raleigh hotel market is far from saturated considering the starting point was essentially zilch. Everytime there was a gala event for the NC Symphony it had to be held at one of the Crabtree area hotels which seemed kind of ridiculous. Next step is to transform the Sir Walter Raleigh into a Novotel.

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I think these develops underscore how the most conservative, if not pessimistic, developers want in on the action now. It also illustrates how wrong Isley and his ilk are on DT Raleigh investment as well as other Raleigh/Triangle projects.

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About parking... no doubt there will be a large parking deck. The question is how big and whether it's above or below ground. Likely, it will be like the Quorum or RBC Plaza built into the structure due to the cost advantages vs. below ground construction. There is some elevation relief on that property so I would expect they could use that to submerge some amount of the parking below grade.

I hadn't realized before how small that site is. Sure it's an entire block, but upon further examination, it's actually only 1 acre or 1/4 of a typical city block. Plenty of space for a single tower, but now I see why it's not two towers--not enough room for two mid-rises and parking on that block.

Retail... I hope they incorporate that, but it's *WAY* to early to tell. Winston probably doesn't know yet what they want exactly, and the city planning dept hasn't seen a site plan. I'd imagine the city would push hard for retail and *might* require it for approval based on what they did with Reynolds (fought hard for ground retail on the Hillsborough frontage).

Hotel market... I agree with bikwillie and Dan. I can't see how the downtown submarket isn't screaming out for these types of projects. The demand will be there and I don't see this project hurting Reynolds at all. Think about it... RBC & Progress and other small firms have HQs here (more on the way?), we have the RCC coming, PE Center concerts, etc... and that's not even counting the additional markets created by growth we haven't seen built yet, such as new tenants in Reynolds, PE III, Site 1, etc.

Condo market... this is the part of the project that will likely rise or fall with the success/failure of other projects before it... 630 North, Nash, Reynolds, West, etc. Depending on what happens to those in the coming months, we might see the condo element reduced from this project. Either way, it sounds like they are still committed to doing the hotels.

Oh, almost forgot.... I was thinking, if you draw a line from Fayetteville St at PE Ctr up to Hillsborough and over to Glenwood Ave, it represents a zig-zag of developments that will probably be the defining corridors of the future activity centers and skyline of DTR. :)

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Retail... I hope they incorporate that, but it's *WAY* to early to tell. Winston probably doesn't know yet what they want exactly, and the city planning dept hasn't seen a site plan. I'd imagine the city would push hard for retail and *might* require it for approval based on what they did with Reynolds (fought hard for ground retail on the Hillsborough frontage).

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