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joeDowntown

GR Interactive Crime Map

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Select March or April of this year. Seems pretty accurate to me.

A lot of it seems to be last years info...

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Select March or April of this year. Seems pretty accurate to me.

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Seems like the SE side if the city still has issues to work out. The concentration of Homicides and Armed assaults seem to be a deterrent to anybody seeking a safe place to live.

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On the way home today, I heard somebody on NPR discussing New Orleans. The current population of the city is around 280,000 people: not too different from Grand Rapids. In the city, there is an average of 2 murders PER DAY.

With that said, something definitely has to be done on the SE side. I say this as a resident of the southeast side and as a resident of GR. I look at thriving downtowns, like Ann Arbor, and one stat pops out--0 murders in an average year. The high crime rate is definitely holding the area back. Every time something happens in the SE side, I catch an interview with a resident who announces that they're moving out. Heck, you can buy a house there for the same price as inner city Detroit or Flint.

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With that said, something definitely has to be done on the SE side. I say this as a resident of the southeast side and as a resident of GR. I look at thriving downtowns, like Ann Arbor, and one stat pops out--0 murders in an average year. The high crime rate is definitely holding the area back. Every time something happens in the SE side, I catch an interview with a resident who announces that they're moving out. Heck, you can buy a house there for the same price as inner city Detroit or Flint.

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Not my house, or the rental poperty my wife and I own next door. Southeast side? Give me a break, its 1/4th of the city and includes some of the most densely populated, and poorest of GR neighborhoods. Can you spell "statistical comparisons" and "demographics"?. The Southeast side also includes more than 2/3rd's of Heritage Hill: "you can buy a house there for the same price as inner city Detroit or Flint" ???

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OK, you can't bring New Orleans into this and compare to GR, you have to compare to alike cities in the Midwest, Fort Wayne IN always comes to mind as the city that most resembles GR, also Des Moines and Lexington, maybe Dayton Toledo, Akron. These cities for the most part have comparable populations, demographics, and seem to remeble the culture and intustries. Fort Wayne had 25 murders in 06 and had over 20 everyear except one for seven years, I count GR at 17 for 07 and yes that is a spike but by no means an "epidemic" that is the same number as 2000 and far fewer than in early 90s when there were 40 something. All of those other cties have comparable rates or above than GR

scroll down to check crimes and look at other cities

As far as the SE side, that is the largest area land wise, population wise ad desity wise, also includes some of the poorest hoods so naturally thats where there is going to be more crime but there are also plenty on the north side too.

Also I wonder if these are reports of crimes only including GRPD response, because there is NO WAY that there was no violent crimes in EGR and only 5 or 6 in Wyoming and Kentwood, maybe not murders but there is always going to be some crime in cities that big. I specifically remember some armed robberies in Cascade TWP. and I think there was a murder there last year.

My conclussion is that GR is normal and there is nothing out of the ordinary that is happening. In a perfect world there would be no crime, but it is inevitable and murders will happen and the SE side is the most likely place because it has the largest area and the most people. Hopefully we do not see as many as last summer, I count 5 so far for 07 and thats on pace with about 15.

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OK, you can't bring New Orleans into this and compare to GR, you have to compare to alike cities in the Midwest, Fort Wayne IN always comes to mind as the city that most resembles GR, also Des Moines and Lexington, maybe Dayton Toledo, Akron. These cities for the most part have comparable populations, demographics, and seem to remeble the culture and intustries. Fort Wayne had 25 murders in 06 and had over 20 everyear except one for seven years, I count GR at 17 for 07 and yes that is a spike but by no means an "epidemic" that is the same number as 2000 and far fewer than in early 90s when there were 40 something. All of those other cties have comparable rates or above than GR

scroll down to check crimes and look at other cities

As far as the SE side, that is the largest area land wise, population wise ad desity wise, also includes some of the poorest hoods so naturally thats where there is going to be more crime but there are also plenty on the north side too.

Also I wonder if these are reports of crimes only including GRPD response, because there is NO WAY that there was no violent crimes in EGR and only 5 or 6 in Wyoming and Kentwood, maybe not murders but there is always going to be some crime in cities that big. I specifically remember some armed robberies in Cascade TWP. and I think there was a murder there last year.

My conclussion is that GR is normal and there is nothing out of the ordinary that is happening. In a perfect world there would be no crime, but it is inevitable and murders will happen and the SE side is the most likely place because it has the largest area and the most people. Hopefully we do not see as many as last summer, I count 5 so far for 07 and thats on pace with about 15.

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Okay. I own rental properties in Heritage Hill, and have had to answer mulitple calls from tenants regarding their homes and vehicles being robbed (600 Block of Union mostly...SE side). I also live in Fairmount Square, and can see the location where "Fat Boy" was killed on Cherry Drive from my upper window. In fact, he was a good friend of one of my tenants (who was there when he was shot...SE side). When doing yard work on a house on Fuller Ave last summer, I heard gun shots coming from the MLK park area and saw people running (SE side). While driving to Spike & Mike's last summer, I watched a man crash into the barrier wall for the cemetary on Fulton. Come to find out, he was shot and killed in his vehicle (SE side).

I lived on the West Side for a couple of years, and never encountered any of this. I grew up in Kentwood, and never encountered any of this. You can ignore the facts, but the majority of violent crime is happening in the Southeast side. Now, to make you feel a little better, we can remove Heritage Hill (although crime does happen there...I know from multiple experiences). And, despite my examples of Fulton St. and Cherry Drive, I think it's fair to say that the majority of the crime is happening south of Wealthy, West of Fuller, East of Division, and North of Burton. We do have an epidemic. It may not be even close to New Orleans, but violent crime rates have doubled over the last couple of years (for "statistical comparisons," dig out that report from the GRPD...I don't feel like writing an essay).

As far as house values are concerned, I also own houses in Flint, and a business partner owns homes in Detroit's "hood." The average cost of these houses was $40k to $60k. Houses in the aforementioned high crime blocks in Grand Rapids also fetch a similar price in many cases (look at grar.com if you don't believe me). However, when is the last time you saw a house in Ann Arbor's older, inner-city neighborhoods for less than, say, $200,000? The answer: a long time ago. These are not students, either. A good portion of these buyers and renters are people who enjoy the walkable, low crime community.

Anyways, I agree that Heritage Hill can be excluded from the discussion...for the most part. However, PRCH, there is a problem. I hope the community can pull together to make this summer less bloody than the last, but I fear that the opposite will happen. I'll just keep my fingers crossed and my eyes open.

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Explaining the reasons behind the high crime rate does not mean that my chance being a victim of a crime won't be higher in the SE side than an area with a low crime rate. The SE side does have a problem. There is no two ways about it. That was quite odvious when my brother and I painted houses in that area for ICCF. There's nothing like hearing gun shots, screaming, and the squabbings of domestic violence going on in neighboring houses. Oh yeah, I won't forget that day when we had to spackle up teeth marks on the wall of the very last house my brother and I worked on. :scared:

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Before we hold up Ann Arbor as the poster child of a model city, first of all, it's predominantly white by a huge margin, with the next largest race represented being Asian at about 11% (far higher than the national and Michigan averages), and African American at around 8%, far below the Michigan and National average. It's probably one of the least diverse cities in the State of Michigan. Contrast that with Ypsilanti only a few miles away, which is more like 30% African American.

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...and one more time, I shall pull facts from the air (I promise this is correct...just don't know where it came from). Crimes in urban area are FAR more likely to be premeditated than in rural areas. So, drug dealers are killing drug dealers, not walking down the street killing random people. I guess it makes me feel a little better knowing this, but it still doesn't make it right, and it still doesn't make people want to live nearby.

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I think this ties into the discussion with Grand Rapids losing i think 50 something police officers i can see why the spike in crime. What i am wondering is why arent the more high tech devices being used to fight crime such as cameras? I see a few at major intersections but i think if they were in some of the areas like Eastown,wealthy, west leonards area it would require less man power and save the city some money anyone agree?

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Also I wonder if these are reports of crimes only including GRPD response, because there is NO WAY that there was no violent crimes in EGR and only 5 or 6 in Wyoming and Kentwood, maybe not murders but there is always going to be some crime in cities that big. I specifically remember some armed robberies in Cascade TWP. and I think there was a murder there last year.

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Before we hold up Ann Arbor as the poster child of a model city, first of all, it's predominantly white by a huge margin, with the next largest race represented being Asian at about 11% (far higher than the national and Michigan averages), and African American at around 8%, far below the Michigan and National average. It's probably one of the least diverse cities in the State of Michigan. Contrast that with Ypsilanti only a few miles away, which is more like 30% African American.

Undoubtedly the Southeast side you are referring to has a large percentage of African Americans, probably the largest percentage in the city. Helping the racial strife that is affecting the African American community, as well as other economic issues facing African Americans, would go a long way to reducing crime in the "Southeast side", IMO.

But I hope this discussion doesn't explode into a big racial argument.

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Why highlight the racial makeup of Ann Arbor, compare it to the SE side, and then say "I hope this doesn't explode into a big racial argument?"

If race has nothing to do with it (I believe this to be true) don't bring it up.

It's economics. GR's SE side is huge and runs the demographic gammut from Heritage Hill and Ottawa Hills with their high values, pristine neighborhoods and relatively higher incomes to the up-and-coming East Hills all the way to poverty-stricken higher-crime neighborhoods. It just depends where you are.

The problem with our quadrant-based labeling system is that saying "SE side" implies that there's a tie in the crime rate in different neighborhoods in that vast swath of land southeast of the D&F. None exists.

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What does poverty have to do with crime rates? My grandparents grew up on the city's west side - some of the poorest people in a poor neighborhood - and there wasn't the crime we see on the SE side today. Poverty does not cause crime. Neither does race. Probably the biggest contributer to crime rates is a lack of education. GRPS is doing a miserable job - only contributing to the cycle of poor upbringing, glorification of violence, drug culture, etc.

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What does poverty have to do with crime rates? My grandparents grew up on the city's west side - some of the poorest people in a poor neighborhood - and there wasn't the crime we see on the SE side today. Poverty does not cause crime. Neither does race. Probably the biggest contributer to crime rates is a lack of education. GRPS is doing a miserable job - only contributing to the cycle of poor upbringing, glorification of violence, drug culture, etc.

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Grand Rapids SE side is also home to a few gangs, and a very vibrant crack trade. You mix the economics of crack with the violent tendencies of gangs you get violent crime. Also those addicted to crack commit crime. I have worked in SE side in quite a few locations and have always been within a stones throw to a crack house. I think if this particular drug is removed a lot of crime and hopeless situations would go away.

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Grand Rapids SE side is also home to a few gangs, and a very vibrant crack trade. You mix the economics of crack with the violent tendencies of gangs you get violent crime. Also those addicted to crack commit crime. I have worked in SE side in quite a few locations and have always been within a stones throw to a crack house. I think if this particular drug is removed a lot of crime and hopeless situations would go away.

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Grand Rapids SE side is also home to a few gangs, and a very vibrant crack trade. You mix the economics of crack with the violent tendencies of gangs you get violent crime. Also those addicted to crack commit crime. I have worked in SE side in quite a few locations and have always been within a stones throw to a crack house. I think if this particular drug is removed a lot of crime and hopeless situations would go away.

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Bad drug deals might be part of it, but recently it seems to be more of gang related and turf war murders, I hate to bring race in, but the plain fact is that the majority of the murders are black on black and Blacks only represent 20% of the population. There is a serious problem in the inner-city African American community and culture of innercity youths growing up in poverty with one parent and bad schools, its like a trap that wont end until you don;t have a kid at the age of 17 and stay together and get an education. Crime is the fast and easy way out for some of them and maybe thats all they see or maybe its not "cool' to do things right. its sad

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