Killian's Crossing

[CorgiMatt]

the sprawl is amazing. i like it.

I admit it's fun to see in a way, but it leads to more smog and bigger butts.

[Chi2Midlands]

Does anyone think Killian Crossing will work? I'm thinking that it needs to have a good game plan and needs to differentiate itself from Sandhill to work. Learn from Sandhill's flaws and where it has failed. Look at more successful centers in other communities. Sandhill went in thinking if you build it the tenants would come. Some of them did, but ultimately it was all mid-range stuff. Thus Killian needs an attractive plan to lure in those designer names. Personally my wishlist is:

*H&M

*Brooks Brothers

*Banana Republic

*Lucky Brand

*Urban Outfitters

*J. Crew

*Guess?

*Something like a Fresh Market or Whole Foods or Trader Joe's

*Nordstrom Rack(a stretch but hey!)

I actually have heard the possibility of a Tanger Outlet Center or something like the outlet center in Gaffney is going in. That's fine with me and might be better for Columbia at the moment...only if they have a good selection of stores though!

I agree - Killian's Crossing will definitely have to differentiate itself to stay viable. So far from what I've heard and read, both public and rumor, points to the developer getting this and not just re-creating Village at Sandhill or simply building a newer version of Lower Two Notch/Decker that's further out. From what was said in The State newspaper, it will have retailers that are new to the Midlands and even new to South Carolina.

The most plausible rumor I've heard so far is a Super Target (I think they're actually just called Target with what's termed a large "Fresh Grocery" section), with a strong rumor of a Costco coming too. While these are technically Big Boxes, they are slightly upscale and I think will be both a safe start to Killian's Crossing but offer the possibility of attracting higher-value retailers.

I like your list but unfortunately I think they're a bit too upscale and risky for Killian's Crossing, at least initially - this is still largely a garden-variety middle-class suburban area, although with some upper-middle-class neighborhoods like Longcreek and Lake Carolina. Hence why the new Wal-Mart and car dealerships like Toyota, Honda, Kia, and Mazda nearby. However, the presence of Acura, VW, and Lexus dealerships could hint that slightly more upscale customers could be served in this area, too.

The trend in the Midlands for upscale retail seems to be clustering around Forest Acres/SE Columbia, especially Trenholm Plaza and the new Whole Foods-anchored Cross Hill Market, because this is where these retailers have seemed to have determined where there is the highest density of higher-disposable-income folks willing to spend at these places. Rumor has it that Trader Joe's is looking at precisely this area (specifically the old Columbia Athletic Club/Gold's Gym on Forest Drive).

If I were to make a realistic wish list of Killian's Crossing or nearby parcels, this is what I'd like to see:

- A good, high-quality cinema chain - a Cobb or AMC, although probably not too big to avoid cannibalizing from Regal Cinemas 16 @ Sandhill.

- A good, high-quality sit-down/casual restaurant chain like a Mimi's Cafe (something the Midlands doesn't have but is present in Greenville's semi-upscale Woodruff Road retail corridor - something I could see roughly being replicated at Killian's Crossing).

- A solid, respected grocery chain, although I don't know if the Killian/I-77 area could support one with a Wal-Mart and Target already having grocery sections. If it's feasible, a Bi-Lo or Kroger would fit in fine, and their other locations are far enough away in the Northeast to not cannibalize their territory. It doesn't have to be a Super Bi-Lo like the one at Sandhill (a concept they're moving away from it seems, anyways). The very nice Bi-Lo off Emanuel Church Road in the Three Fountains area of West Columbia is probably a good concept to copy. Publix, Food Lion, and Piggly Wiggly have locations fairly close by on Hard Scrabble already.

Now, if I'm going to be surprised and truly upscale stuff starts coming, then here's my short pie-in-the-sky list:

- Wegman's - super long-shot, but could draw customers from as far as the southern stretches of Charlotte (it is a true destination grocer). Plus the developer is from Upstate NY where Wegman's is based and there are both lots of Upstate NYers traveling on I-77 to the SC beaches & FL, AND there are many Upstate NY transplants in the Midlands as well.

- Upscale cinema - Cobb has its CineBistro concept. If this will become a destination development eventually, perhaps. But I still see them gravitating towards the Forest Acres/SE Columbia-type market area.

If Tanger Outlet comes, I hope it's not just another copy of their other properties - there are already 4 of them on the SC coast so I don't really see the need for them even as a destination development. Gaffney and Concord Mills aren't that far either. If it's some new exciting upscale concept, then I'd be more interested.

[Temeteron]

I agree - Killian's Crossing will definitely have to differentiate itself to stay viable. So far from what I've heard and read, both public and rumor, points to the developer getting this and not just re-creating Village at Sandhill or simply building a newer version of Lower Two Notch/Decker that's further out. From what was said in The State newspaper, it will have retailers that are new to the Midlands and even new to South Carolina.

The most plausible rumor I've heard so far is a Super Target (I think they're actually just called Target with what's termed a large "Fresh Grocery" section), with a strong rumor of a Costco coming too. While these are technically Big Boxes, they are slightly upscale and I think will be both a safe start to Killian's Crossing but offer the possibility of attracting higher-value retailers.

I like your list but unfortunately I think they're a bit too upscale and risky for Killian's Crossing, at least initially - this is still largely a garden-variety middle-class suburban area, although with some upper-middle-class neighborhoods like Longcreek and Lake Carolina. Hence why the new Wal-Mart and car dealerships like Toyota, Honda, Kia, and Mazda nearby. However, the presence of Acura, VW, and Lexus dealerships could hint that slightly more upscale customers could be served in this area, too.

The trend in the Midlands for upscale retail seems to be clustering around Forest Acres/SE Columbia, especially Trenholm Plaza and the new Whole Foods-anchored Cross Hill Market, because this is where these retailers have seemed to have determined where there is the highest density of higher-disposable-income folks willing to spend at these places. Rumor has it that Trader Joe's is looking at precisely this area (specifically the old Columbia Athletic Club/Gold's Gym on Forest Drive).

If I were to make a realistic wish list of Killian's Crossing or nearby parcels, this is what I'd like to see:

- A good, high-quality cinema chain - a Cobb or AMC, although probably not too big to avoid cannibalizing from Regal Cinemas 16 @ Sandhill.

- A good, high-quality sit-down/casual restaurant chain like a Mimi's Cafe (something the Midlands doesn't have but is present in Greenville's semi-upscale Woodruff Road retail corridor - something I could see roughly being replicated at Killian's Crossing).

- A solid, respected grocery chain, although I don't know if the Killian/I-77 area could support one with a Wal-Mart and Target already having grocery sections. If it's feasible, a Bi-Lo or Kroger would fit in fine, and their other locations are far enough away in the Northeast to not cannibalize their territory. It doesn't have to be a Super Bi-Lo like the one at Sandhill (a concept they're moving away from it seems, anyways). The very nice Bi-Lo off Emanuel Church Road in the Three Fountains area of West Columbia is probably a good concept to copy. Publix, Food Lion, and Piggly Wiggly have locations fairly close by on Hard Scrabble already.

Now, if I'm going to be surprised and truly upscale stuff starts coming, then here's my short pie-in-the-sky list:

- Wegman's - super long-shot, but could draw customers from as far as the southern stretches of Charlotte (it is a true destination grocer). Plus the developer is from Upstate NY where Wegman's is based and there are both lots of Upstate NYers traveling on I-77 to the SC beaches & FL, AND there are many Upstate NY transplants in the Midlands as well.

- Upscale cinema - Cobb has its CineBistro concept. If this will become a destination development eventually, perhaps. But I still see them gravitating towards the Forest Acres/SE Columbia-type market area.

If Tanger Outlet comes, I hope it's not just another copy of their other properties - there are already 4 of them on the SC coast so I don't really see the need for them even as a destination development. Gaffney and Concord Mills aren't that far either. If it's some new exciting upscale concept, then I'd be more interested.

Mimi's Cafe?? That has to be the worst restaurant I've ever been to. Overpriced and the food and service was horrible. I rather go to Applebee's (That's not saying much either lol). Cheesecake factory or Maggiano's perhaps. But Columbia doesn't have enough high-income households/people for something like that. Nor does it have enough tourism. Killian's might pull off an On The Border or a Ruby Tuesday....there are none of those for miles....

[clt29301]

Mimi's Cafe?? That has to be the worst restaurant I've ever been to. Overpriced and the food and service was horrible. I rather go to Applebee's (That's not saying much either lol). Cheesecake factory or Maggiano's perhaps. But Columbia doesn't have enough high-income households/people for something like that. Nor does it have enough tourism. Killian's might pull off an On The Border or a Ruby Tuesday....there are none of those for miles....

Are you saying that Chessecake factory is high end? It is more of a volume/destination restaurant, not high end. Besides, Columbia is at the top (with Charleston) in SC with regards to household income.

[waccamatt]

Are you saying that Chessecake factory is high end? It is more of a volume/destination restaurant, not high end. Besides, Columbia is at the top (with Charleston) in SC with regards to household income.

I agree; neither Cheesecake Factory nor Maggiano's are "higher end" - they're chain restaurants slightly above Applebee's, Red Lobster and Chili's.

[Temeteron]

I agree; neither Cheesecake Factory nor Maggiano's are "higher end" - they're chain restaurants slightly above Applebee's, Red Lobster and Chili's.

The prices are high-end is what I mean, especially compared to other restaurants in Columbia.

[heeheejaris]

Killian's Crossing will be success. And I would love to see a Cheesecake Factory. Columbia has plenty of rich if you dont belive me drive through Saluda River Club, Wild Wood and place like that... then we will talk.

But there is a SERIOUS ISSUE there is a single lane in bettween Wal-Mart and Killian's Crossing... Thats not going to work LOL.

What I realy want to see is all that stuff LAME Columbia doesnt have.(i.e. Ikea) but we have Charrlotte anyway so people in N.Columbia who have an 1 hour drive from dont care. Spring Valley has grown more than any other place in South Carolina if you ask me so we will ge much attention from them.

Whats funny though is that area North of Columbia has EVERYTHING... Harbison, VAS and in the future Killian's Crossing take that S. Columbia. What you got? A National Park?

[johnpro318]

Killian's Crossing will be success. And I would love to see a Cheesecake Factory. Columbia has plenty of rich if you dont belive me drive through Saluda River Club, Wild Wood and place like that... then we will talk.

But there is a SERIOUS ISSUE there is a single lane in bettween Wal-Mart and Killian's Crossing... Thats not going to work LOL.

What I realy want to see is all that stuff LAME Columbia doesnt have.(i.e. Ikea) but we have Charrlotte anyway so people in N.Columbia who have an 1 hour drive from dont care. Spring Valley has grown more than any other place in South Carolina if you ask me so we will ge much attention from them.

Whats funny though is that area North of Columbia has EVERYTHING... Harbison, VAS and in the future Killian's Crossing take that S. Columbia. What you got? A National Park?

I agree about a lot of stuff being in North Columbia. There's not a lot of build-able land in South Columbia but with the 12th Street Extension, interest off of Bluff Road and the new Whole Foods, you can expect a lot of new construction in South Columbia in next 10-15 years. People are already beginning to notice how far away they live in the farthest stretches of Northeast Richland. At least in the Northwest there is Lake Murray which will retain a lot of property values and there is a lot of property close to Columbia in the south that can still be developed and also remain close to Interstate 26, Interstate 77 and the airport.

[growingup15]

Killian's Crossing will be success. And I would love to see a Cheesecake Factory. Columbia has plenty of rich if you dont belive me drive through Saluda River Club, Wild Wood and place like that... then we will talk.

But there is a SERIOUS ISSUE there is a single lane in bettween Wal-Mart and Killian's Crossing... Thats not going to work LOL.

What I realy want to see is all that stuff LAME Columbia doesnt have.(i.e. Ikea) but we have Charrlotte anyway so people in N.Columbia who have an 1 hour drive from dont care. Spring Valley has grown more than any other place in South Carolina if you ask me so we will ge much attention from them.

Whats funny though is that area North of Columbia has EVERYTHING... Harbison, VAS and in the future Killian's Crossing take that S. Columbia. What you got? A National Park?

I can really southern part of Columbia being developed on soon. starting with Amazon being opened up in the south part of town. (not Columbia) but close enough to spark off something.

also I heard that USC is expanding there campus pass I-77 also so we can see bigger development out there soon.

[krazeeboi]

Killian Road at Interstate 77 is quickly becoming the next major mixed-use development and destination area for the Midlands.

The largest tract of land being developed is the 400-acre Killian’s Crossing, a residential and commercial development.

The development plans include:

• 1.3 million square feet of retail space.
  
• 2,100 residential units, including apartments, townhouses, single-family units, living spaces above retail shops and assisted living.
  
• Two hotels with a total of 400 hotel rooms.
  
• 550,000 square feet of office space.
  
• A movie theater.
  

But don’t expect to see this development spring up over night. Matthew Congdon, vice president of DCG Development Co., who is managing the site, said there is a 10-year build-out for the completion of the $750 million project.

[heeheejaris]

10 Years... Im moving to Greenville...

[CorgiMatt]

Beats Blythewood.

[krazeeboi]

10 Years... Im moving to Greenville...

LOL...huge projects like this typically take several years to get fully built-out. And why would you let one development frustrate you to that level that you'd move???

[Temeteron]

LOL...huge projects like this typically take several years to get fully built-out. And why would you let one development frustrate you to that level that you'd move???

It takes Columbia 10 years to do anything! That's the reason why I moved to Charlotte. For a capital city Columbia should be way more advanced in infrastructure and developments but its not at all!

[growingup15]

It takes Columbia 10 years to do anything! That's the reason why I moved to Charlotte. For a capital city Columbia should be way more advanced in infrastructure and developments but its not at all!

I'm sorry i love Columbia but i have to agree with you on that. because i've been to Charlotte and Atlanta and they don't wait too long to start anything. The reason why projects like that takes so long is because we have a lot of older people that wants it to stay the same ole same ole. and don't want fast change like that.

I mean i'm all for change i mean things have to change eventually. i think its time for Columbia to change there Zoning and Designing rules to bring in more projects and companies wanting to start new things now.

Yes i understand they are standards but at what cost............. losing multi-million dollar companies. or a chance for new residents to move in downtown. to put Columbia on the spot as the new place to live instead of people fleeing to Charlotte, Greenville or Atlanta.

see what i mean?

[CorgiMatt]

All cities and regions have their issues. Charlotte just nixed a proposed budget that would have meant millions for capital improvements, and there was a front-page article in the Atlanta Journal Constitution the other day titled "Atlanta in Crisis." The article was about the effects of the recession on Atlanta's job market and real estate, and it wasn't pretty. I read newspapers from lots of cities every morning, and everywhere has disagreements, delays, compromises, successes and everything in between. I'm putting all my eggs in the Columbia basket, though, not in the baskets of the 'Blythewoods.' I believe in the current makeup of City Council. I know I've strayed from the Killian Road topic. Sorry.

[krazeeboi]

It takes Columbia 10 years to do anything! That's the reason why I moved to Charlotte. For a capital city Columbia should be way more advanced in infrastructure and developments but its not at all!

You obviously have no clue about the magnitude of this development. 10 years is a more-or-less average time for full build-out of a project this size, no matter which city it's located in. It's a good thing that it's even still a go, as I thought it would be overkill with the development of VAS.

And even cities like Charlotte don't throw up every development in a year or two. First Ward Urban Village is a smaller development than Killian's Crossing and has a 10- to 15-year build-out. A more apt comparison in metro Charlotte would be Langtree at the Lake, a suburban 300-acre, $800 million mixed-use development, which started taking shape about five years ago with only the first phase slated to be completed at the end of this year. Again, developments of this size and scale typically have multi-year buildouts. And it should also be understood that such developments can still contain a lot of stuff before they are fully built-out, like VAS.

And what does being a state capital, especially of a state the size of SC, have to do with being "way more advanced in infrastructure and developments"???? There's absolutely no correlation; otherwise, capitals like Tallahassee, Albany, Springfield, Harrisburg, etc. should be waaayyy more than what they are. Being a capital only means it's the seat of state government. Otherwise, they are subject to the dynamics and fluctuations that occur in any other city.

If you prefer larger cities, that's all fine and dandy; I do too. But to say it's because "it takes Columbia 10 years to do anything" is quite inaccurate in light of this particular development. Killian's Crossing is par for the course in practically every way, especially considering the economic conditions that came about shortly after it was proposed.