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The Greensboro Triumph Center


cityboi

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first of all that article has no credibilty. The skeptics in the article claimed there were no feasibilty studies when in fact they were done. Those were just a few unelected leaders that had no clue what was going on. Dont take what they say seriously because they are not in the loop and dont know jack skwat. I emailed DGI about this and have not gotten a response. When I email them about other things, I get an immediate response. That tells me right there something is still going on. Trust me any secret project thats gone dead goes public.

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first of all that article has no credibilty. The skeptics in the article claimed there were no feasibilty studies when in fact they were done. Those were just a few unelected leaders that had no clue what was going on. Dont take what they say seriously because they are not in the loop and dont know jack skwat. I emailed DGI about this and have not gotten a response. When I email them about other things, I get an imediate response. That tells me right there something is still going on.

How can anyone take what you say seriously? How do you know he has feasibility studies? Have you seen them? Have they been made public? Probably not.

You always make wild statements but never have any tangible proof to back up your claims. And this time...there is no way that you can say that i'm the only one who feels this way, because others have made the same comments about your ability to support your claims.

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How can anyone take what you say seriously? How do you know he has feasibility studies? Have you seen them? Have they been made public? Probably not.

You always make wild statements but never have any tangible proof to back up your claims. And this time...there is no way that you can say that i'm the only one who feels this way, because others have made the same comments about your ability to support your claims.

No.. Ray Gibbs of Downtown Greensboro Inc. was involved with the studies. This is not what im claiming so dont try to make it sound like its coming from me.

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I emailed DGI about this and have not gotten a response. When I email them about other things, I get an immediate response. That tells me right there something is still going on. Trust me any secret project thats gone dead goes public.

HOW CAN YOU ASSUME THAT BECAUSE YOU HAVEN'T GOTTEN A RESPONSE THAT THIS THING IS STILL ONGOING???

You seriously need to take some time out.

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Melvin says Cain has no economic feasibility studies, seemed unfamiliar with the city's demographics, doesn't seem to know the extent of the environmental problems posed by the properties he's targeted and declined to reveal the sources of his financial backing.

That in itself is enough to put doubt in someone's mind. It's not my job (or desire) to sway people's opinions one way or another, but I've followed enough projects in New York, Winston-Salem, and Atlanta and been involved with several architecture and development companies to know how businesses get things off the ground. I do not see in any possible way how someone after reading that article can come out and have a 100% gut feeling that this will be built. I want nothing more than for positive things to happen, BUT everyone has to be realistic. Everywhere you look there are headlines about sub-prime lenders (such as Citibank) tightening restrictions on who they lend to, interest rates are horrible, the dollar is the weakest it's been in decades, and gas prices are pushing $100 a barrel. Let's take a deeper analysis of just how much these factors come into play in a development:

1) If you want to move land, you have to have bulldozers and graders which require gas. Diesel is hovering at $3 now. Not exactly cheap is it?

2) The cost of steel is ABSURD! It takes oil to make steel (again oil is not cheap) and with countries such as China hogging the new batches of steel, that jacks the price up even more.

3) No lending company in their right mind is going to lend money to a person who doesn't have any experience in the development field, but is proposing a large mixed-use development. Sure, some sub-prime lenders probably will but their interest rates are around 9%, digging deeper into the developer's pockets.

4) People are cutting corners anyway they can due to high gas prices and the everyday products they buy going up in price (due to the costs of transportation). Not many people, especially in the Triad, are looking at entertaining their families in lavish ways and buying downtown condos. I don't think any explanation is needed.

Cityboi, I realize you have a lot of faith in this project. If we don't have faith, what do we have? I understand, but listen it's a BAD time to start a development. I really don't care who says what, no development company in their right mind would start a project of this size in a market like the Triad at this time.

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HOW CAN YOU ASSUME THAT BECAUSE YOU HAVEN'T GOTTEN A RESPONSE THAT THIS THING IS STILL ONGOING???

You seriously need to take some time out.

im not responding to you anymore because I KNOW what the deal is with this project. I know what you are doing and im not taking the bait any longer

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That in itself is enough to put doubt in someone's mind. It's not my job (or desire) to sway people's opinions one way or another, but I've followed enough projects in New York, Winston-Salem, and Atlanta and been involved with several architecture and development companies to know how businesses get things off the ground. I do not see in any possible way how someone after reading that article can come out and have a 100% gut feeling that this will be built. I want nothing more than for positive things to happen, BUT everyone has to be realistic. Everywhere you look there are headlines about sub-prime lenders (such as Citibank) tightening restrictions on who they lend to, interest rates are horrible, the dollar is the weakest it's been in decades, and gas prices are pushing $100 a barrel. Let's take a deeper analysis of just how much these factors come into play in a development:

1) If you want to move land, you have to have bulldozers and graders which require gas. Diesel is hovering at $3 now. Not exactly cheap is it?

2) The cost of steel is ABSURD! It takes oil to make steel (again oil is not cheap) and with countries such as China hogging the new batches of steel, that jacks the price up even more.

3) No lending company in their right mind is going to lend money to a person who doesn't have any experience in the development field, but is proposing a large mixed-use development. Sure, some sub-prime lenders probably will but their interest rates are around 9%, digging deeper into the developer's pockets.

4) People are cutting corners anyway they can due to high gas prices and the everyday products they buy going up in price (due to the costs of transportation). Not many people, especially in the Triad, are looking at entertaining their families in lavish ways and buying downtown condos. I don't think any explanation is needed.

Cityboi, I realize you have a lot of faith in this project. If we don't have faith, what do we have? I understand, but listen it's a BAD time to start a development. I really don't care who says what, no development company in their right mind would start a project of this size in a market like the Triad at this time.

Im not arguing that this project is on hold because I know it is. I was addressing claims that the project is alledgedly dead. also dont believe the statement about no feasibilty studies being done because they were done. Ray Gibbs was invovled with that and he even gave dollar amounts on how much the studies cost. Its hypocrytical to believe some unelected leader that has no proof in his statements and is not even in the loop on things yet disbelieve statements from supporters of this project who are in the loop and have the facts.

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One thing I've learned in the development world is that a developer will BS you and say anything they can just to make their project look good. Ray Gibbs could just be saying all the right things for positive press. Again, we don't know.

Its hypocrytical to believe some unelected leader that has no proof in his statements yet disbelieve statements from supporters of this project.

I don't follow, which unelected leader are you talking about?

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One thing I've learned in the development world is that a developer will BS you and say anything they can just to make their project look good. Ray Gibbs could just be saying all the right things for positive press. Again, we don't know.

the one who said there were no feasibility studies done "Jim Melvin"

First of all I know Ray Gibbs and he is not that kind of person. And he certainly wouldnt lie.

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Im not arguing that this project is on hold because I know it is. I was addressing claims that the project is alledgedly dead. also dont believe the statement about no feasibilty studies being done because they were done. Ray Gibbs was invovled with that and he even gave dollar amounts on how much the studies cost. Its hypocrytical to believe some unelected leader that has no proof in his statements and is not even in the loop on things yet disbelieve statements from supporters of this project who are in the loop.

Citiboi, Ray Gibbs was the head of DGI, then he stepped down right before this whole thing started to take a new job with an "unidentified" company. Later it was revealed that the "unidentified" company was Cain's company. Talk about conflicts of interest and deception.

Ray Gibbs has completely and forever lost his credibility with anyone with common sense, and you would be wise to not quote him ever again.

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Citiboi, Ray Gibbs was the head of DGI, then he stepped down right before this whole thing started to take a new job with an "unidentified" company. Later it was revealed that the "unidentified" company was Cain's company. Talk about conflicts of interest and deception.

Ray Gibbs has completely and forever lost his credibility with anyone with common sense, and you would be wise to not quote him ever again.

you dont even know whats going on. Its not just Cain. Cain is only spearheading this project which involveves other developers inluding one from Orlando, FL. He pulled these developers together because he couldnt do it alone.

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Well could it be that Isaac Cain told Ray Gibbs that he had documents that he really didn't have? I've been googling this project everytime this topic pops up, and I haven't seen any feasibility studies. How do you know they were done?

EDIT:

Ahh, so the mystery gets even more screwy... Ray Gibbs went to work for Issac Cain? I wonder how come we never heard about that in the press.

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Well could it be that Isaac Cain told Ray Gibbs that he had documents that he really didn't have? I've been googling this project everytime this topic pops up, and I haven't seen any feasibility studies. How do you know they were done?

like I said Ray GIbbs was also involved with these studies. It wasnt like Cain told him that he did it. Even if he did, why would you think Cain would be lieing about it?

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I haven't seen any proof and no article I've read stated that feasibility studies were done.

whether you see it or not, that doesnt mean it wasnt done. Come on this is not the UFO thread. We are not trying to prove if aliens are real. We dont have to have scientific proof of the existance of a feasibilty study. There is no reason to not believe one was done. Its not hard at all to do a feasibilty study.

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you dont even know whats going on. Its not just Cain. Cain is only spearheading this project which involveves other developers inluding one from Orlando, FL. He pulled these developers together because he couldnt do it alone.

Regardless to how it was structured, Ray Gibbs was the head of Downtown Greensboro's (DGI) booster organization, then he got into bed with Cain (and supposedly these "mysetery" deverlopers from FL and other countries).

Then, when Gibbs is no longer working for DGI, he begins making all of these early statements, but tells everyone "it's way to early for them to speculate."

It is clear that Gibbs tried to used his influence gained from his former position within Greeensboro to promote the agenda of a private developer, but this was a textbook case of how not to kickoff a development.

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whether you see it or not, that doesnt mean it wasnt done. Come on this is not the UFO thread. We are not trying to prove if aliens are real. We dont have to have scientific proof. Its just a measly feasibilty study and there is no reason to not believe one was done.

The thing is, if there is no credible source saying that a feasibility study was done, and there was a source that actually said that one wasn't done, can you really blame people for thinking that a study hasn't yet been done? It's not exactly a leap in logic.

The fact of the matter is that if the developer(s) are serious about this project, then a study will have to be conducted sooner or later. Personally, I just think that the project is stalled for now. In all actuality, the time between us last hearing about this project and the present hasn't been very long at all.

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I know that, but you are the only one stating that the studies were done.

On a side note, it looks like someone likes to keep tabs on what we write here:

http://fecundstench.com/WordPress/?m=200708

yes I read that a while ago, apparantly im a rapper from Charlotte. (I dont even like rap lol) I think they said krazeeboi was one two. That just demostrate that you cant assume something when you dont know what going on. Its very easy to make a claim that a project is dead or is on its way to falling through. but until you are prived to the facts you dont know. It works both way. If you say someone has to back up claims of this project moving forward, likewise you have to back up claims that its not.

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yes I read that a while ago, apparantly im a rapper from Charlotte. (I dont even like rap lol) I think they said krazeeboi was one two. That just demostrate that you cant assume something when you dont know what going on. Its very easy to make a claim that a project is dead or is on its way to falling through. but until you are prived to the facts you dont know.

Wow, I feel like I've been stalked online, LOL. That's what I get for using the same screenname almost everywhere else I post. :)

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Its very easy to make a claim that a project is dead or is on its way to falling through. but until you are prived to the facts you dont know. It works both way. If you say someone has to back up claims of this project moving forward, likewise you have to back up claims that its not.

I wish you would show me these "facts." I have yet to see any.

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You're referring to my comments as "watercooler" talk? I have given you evidence that this has most likely been put on hold. Where's yours? You continue to evade my posts.

no im making reference to people who have said the project has been canceled. There is a difference. I know its on hold because my "inside" source told me that.

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