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The Greensboro Triumph Center


cityboi

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Just because there is nothing yet to report about this project as far as its actual status is concerned (approved, on hold, cancelled, etc.) doesn't mean that other aspects of the project can't be discussed. If we applied such a policy across the board, we wouldn't have half the discussions we have here on UP.

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Just because there is nothing yet to report about this project as far as its actual status is concerned (approved, on hold, cancelled, etc.) doesn't mean that other aspects of the project can't be discussed. If we applied such a policy across the board, we wouldn't have half the discussions we have here on UP.

true...but at the same time a few troublemakers like to stir the pot and make this a heated discussion. Personally I think the problem could easily be solved by warning those who stir the pot by constantly bashing this project and calling the developer names. Its one thing to disagree on this matter, but the negative sarcasm and "baiting" needs to stop.

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I'd like to count how many times I've had to intervene in this thread. It's as simple as not posting something that you know a fellow forumer won't take kindly to, but I guess some can't grasp that concept. For the final time, be courteous to one another. It is not anyone's obligation to take someone else's "bait." There has been nothing reported about this project in a couple of months, whether it is still-a-go, on-hold, or canceled is anybody's guess. I've already spoken my word on why I think it's been put on-hold or scratched and I don't think I need to repeat myself.

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The "BS" comment was totally unnecessary.

Krazeeboi - I know that you feel the need to always support citiboi, but here's what I think is totally unnecessary:

1. Certain forumers immediately posting replies as soon as other forumers post statements that don't sound like what he wants to hear

2. Forumers using this thread to sensationalize a city or project and as a source of propaganda

3. Posting repeated statements that are ultimately misleading and somewhat deceptive

4. Forumers being made to feel like their comments are unwelcomed when they don't jive with this thread's culture

As you are aware, this thread has become somewhat of a soap opera. I'm not sure what all is taking place in the background with this project, but I think that everyone should be able to make their comments in an open-minded, neutral environment as long as they don't attack someone's person. Afterall, isn't that what this blog is supposed to be for?

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^Yes, and you came really close to attacking someone by saying that they are posting "BS."

Understand something, I have been critical of cityboi's POVs before, even in this thread. Yes, he may be a bit overzealous at times, but he is entitled to his own opinion. Even if he thinks that this project will be built if the developer(s) personally wrote him a letter telling him that it wouldn't, he has a right to express that opinion here so as long as he remains respectful of everyone else and their opinions. If you feel like what's being posted is misleading, then you have every right to ask clarifying questions--again, remaining respectful. Cityboi has not broken any rules in this thread (at least not in the past few pages). Make sure you don't either, and be careful how you label the opinions of others.

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^Yes, and you came really close to attacking someone by saying that they are posting "BS."

Understand something, I have been critical of cityboi's POVs before, even in this thread. Yes, he may be a bit overzealous at times, but he is entitled to his own opinion. Even if he thinks that this project will be built if the developer(s) personally wrote him a letter telling him that it wouldn't, he has a right to express that opinion here so as long as he remains respectful of everyone else and their opinions. If you feel like what's being posted is misleading, then you have every right to ask clarifying questions--again, remaining respectful. Cityboi has not broken any rules in this thread (at least not in the past few pages). Make sure you don't either, and be careful how you label the opinions of others.

It's funny how you always seem to delete posts that expose certain things/people for what they really are. Why is that?

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^ What is funny is that you still have an account here. You have instigated and been involved in more baiting and immature and outlandish type posting wars than I can count, and I haven't been here that long. Most have centered around your extreme and narrow minded Raleigh booster attitude, I really can't figure out why you hang around the Triad thread unless it is because you enjoy being a troll.

And by the way, nearly every forumer here, Krazzeboi certainly included, has attempted to move cityboi from his own boosterish stance, are you now just making stuff up to support your argument?

yes I read that a while ago, apparantly im a rapper from Charlotte. (I dont even like rap lol) I think they said krazeeboi was one two. That just demostrate that you cant assume something when you dont know what going on. Its very easy to make a claim that a project is dead or is on its way to falling through. but until you are prived to the facts you dont know. It works both way. If you say someone has to back up claims of this project moving forward, likewise you have to back up claims that its not.

It doesn't work both ways - the only evidence we have of this project is basically an O article and little more. In the world of urban projects that is akin to loosing a rock via slingshot and saying you declared war. You need a LOT more evidence to claim that this project is even a real project. Unless you are infact Ray Gibbs himself then your weight as a single individual in support of the viability of this project is very weak.

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^ What is funny is that you still have an account here. You have instigated and been involved in more baiting and immature and outlandish type posting wars than I can count, and I haven't been here that long. Most have centered around your extreme and narrow minded Raleigh booster attitude, I really can't figure out why you hang around the Triad thread unless it is because you enjoy being a troll.

And by the way, nearly every forumer here, Krazzeboi certainly included, has attempted to move cityboi from his own boosterish stance, are you now just making stuff up to support your argument?

It doesn't work both ways - the only evidence we have of this project is basically an O article and little more. In the world of urban projects that is akin to loosing a rock via slingshot and saying you declared war. You need a LOT more evidence to claim that this project is even a real project. Unless you are infact Ray Gibbs himself then your weight as a single individual in support of the viability of this project is very weak.

Not being able to provide evidence, doesnt mean something is not real. Me providing proof here at UP is not going to affect this project one way or the other. If it happens it happens, If it doesnt, it just doesnt.

The ballpark took three years from the first announcement to the ground breaking. Triad Tower was announced several years ago with little news about it in the past two years, yet its still planned and has not been scrapped. I can name a dozen Charlotte projects that have had very little news between the first announcement and the groundbreaking. The Greensboro Triumph Center was just announced in May which was not that long ago. Ray Gibbs even said this is going to take a long time to put the pieces together. So just because we havent heard any news in 3 months doesnt mean the deal is falling a part. Yes I do have my inside sources on this and I tried to do more verification contacting Downtown Greensboro, Inc. directly. Its funny that they ALWAYS contact me back whenever I ask questions on something yet I got no response from them when I inquired about the Greensboro Triumph Center. That clearly says to me that the project is still active.

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^ I dunno, that says to me that they might think you are a developer or analyst, and want to make sure that your confidence remains high in the event that your participation in our market is tied to other developers and their projects.

lets just say they know who I am and they know im not a developer.

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Enough of this my secret source bull sh**. Robbie Perkins says that this was never a project, never had legs, and could not believe that the N&R even reported it as such. Citiboi, find me a source more in the know than Robbie Perkins, then I will shut up.

Robbie Perkins doesnt even know all the details. I certainly wouldnt go by what he says because he is not even in the loop. He is just a former city councilman that has given his opinion. Everybody has opinions but opinions DO NOT = facts. Unless he is DIRECTLY in the loop, I wouldnt take what he has said as the gospel.

BTW Ray Gibbs and the mayor are directly in the know on this project and they said its a real deal. Mayor Holiday was FULLY briefed on this project. I'll take the mayor's word over a fomer councilman who doesnt know hardly any details any day of the week. To think anything otherwise, I guess you'd accuse the mayor of either being a liar or an idiot. Both of which are not likely.

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  • 2 years later...

Is there anything new about this project? I've tried Google and couldn't find much. I know projects can be put on hold until things get more stable. And plus with all of the other projects getting built in Greensboro, this one may actually come back to life sometime in the near future. I don't mean to jump the gun, tho. I'm just wondering :unsure:

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I'm assuming its dead unless the developer revives it at some point in the future. Anything is possible. But from what I understand the challenge was acquiring the tracts of land needed for the project. Apparently owners of certain properties didn't want to sell at the time. Even still, it would have stalled because of the bank and housing crisis of 2008-2009. But there have been a number of projects that were thought to be dead (including the current downtown hotel project) that have resurfaced at a later time. I will say based on info that I was told about the project, there would certainly be a demand for more hotel rooms in the central business district and to skeptics of the planned downtown Wyndham, there wouldn't be any questions about the hotel's viability.. A source within Downtown Greensboro Inc., (board member) told me the Greensboro Triumph Center was a lot closer to becoming reality than people realize and that it would have been something you'd expect to see built in Las Vegas or some place like that. A project of that magnitude was just unheard of for a city like Greensboro and the landowners of identified properties didn't take the project seriously because of that. When you start throwing around concepts that include a House of Blues, Vegas style entertainment with rides, some people don't take it seriously. But It would have been much more than a place like Epicenter in Charlotte. The person said it would have been that huge for Greensboro. I certainly would like to see this project resurface. If it does, hopefully the developer will get his ducks in a row before the media gets a hold to his plans. Maybe he could even take advantage of stimulus recovery bonds if there is another round. Those bonds are the reason downtown is getting a 10-story luxury hotel.

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I'm assuming its dead unless the developer revives it at some point in the future. Anything is possible. But from what I understand the challenge was acquiring the tracts of land needed for the project. Apparently owners of certain properties didn't want to sell at the time. Even still, it would have stalled because of the bank and housing crisis of 2008-2009. But there have been a number of projects that were thought to be dead (including the current downtown hotel project) that have resurfaced at a later time. I will say based on info that I was told about the project, there would certainly be a demand for more hotel rooms in the central business district and to skeptics of the planned downtown Wyndham, there wouldn't be any questions about the hotel's viability.. A source within Downtown Greensboro Inc., (board member) told me the Greensboro Triumph Center was a lot closer to becoming reality than people realize and that it would have been something you'd expect to see built in Las Vegas or some place like that. A project of that magnitude was just unheard of for a city like Greensboro and the landowners of identified properties didn't take the project seriously because of that. When you start throwing around concepts that include a House of Blues, Vegas style entertainment with rides, some people don't take it seriously. But It would have been much more than a place like Epicenter in Charlotte. The person said it would have been that huge for Greensboro. I certainly would like to see this project resurface. If it does, hopefully the developer will get his ducks in a row before the media gets a hold to his plans. Maybe he could even take advantage of stimulus recovery bonds if there is another round. Those bonds are the reason downtown is getting a 10-story luxury hotel.

I really appreciate your response Cityboi, because I was in the dark about it. But yeah, some people didn't even take the project seriously because of the style of it. It's more flamboyant than ANYTHING that we have in Greensboro(Except for the Coliseum maybe). Sometimes I feel as if the people here don't seem to have much pride or hope for the city(epically the younger people), simply because we often get overshadowed by our neighbors(Raleigh and Charlotte). Despite the amount of clubs, bars, colleges, venues, etc that we have here, this notion of Greensboro being "boring" or "wack" seems to rear it's ugly head from time to time. And I think it's almost starting to have a toll on the city's confidence and pride. You can do a topic search on Twitter and Facebook and you'll see people talk good about the city but then see alot of "Greensboro is boring" stuff as well. Other cities are called that too sometimes, but Greensboro gets alot of that. I don't really agree with the fact that the city is boring, but we could really use something to jump start us. Something BIG. Something that will help gain us some REAL national(perhaps even world) type attention. I see all of the proposals that we get, but we get the short end of the stick too often IMO. We have to continue to improve our leadership and government, for the sake of Greensboro. We are on the right track, but we have to keep going.

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I really appreciate your response Cityboi, because I was in the dark about it. But yeah, some people didn't even take the project seriously because of the style of it. It's more flamboyant than ANYTHING that we have in Greensboro(Except for the Coliseum maybe). Sometimes I feel as if the people here don't seem to have much pride or hope for the city(epically the younger people), simply because we often get overshadowed by our neighbors(Raleigh and Charlotte). Despite the amount of clubs, bars, colleges, venues, etc that we have here, this notion of Greensboro being "boring" or "wack" seems to rear it's ugly head from time to time. And I think it's almost starting to have a toll on the city's confidence and pride. You can do a topic search on Twitter and Facebook and you'll see people talk good about the city but then see alot of "Greensboro is boring" stuff as well. Other cities are called that too sometimes, but Greensboro gets alot of that. I don't really agree with the fact that the city is boring, but we could really use something to jump start us. Something BIG. Something that will help gain us some REAL national(perhaps even world) type attention. I see all of the proposals that we get, but we get the short end of the stick too often IMO. We have to continue to improve our leadership and government, for the sake of Greensboro. We are on the right track, but we have to keep going.

At the time when this project was proposed, there was a quiet element against it because it seemed to be not Greensboro like and that may have been what killed the project. We need to expand our horizons as a city and stop putting Greensboro in a box. We'll never be on the same level as Charlotte and Raleigh if we keep doing that. Cities are suppose to evolve and redefine themselves from time to time and thats more important than ever for Greensboro because we are still trying to find an identity. Thats really Greensboro's problem, no real identity other than its past association with textiles. I think alot of our citizens believe Greensboro can't reach its full potential because the city has been stuck in a rut for the past 30 years while Charlotte and Raleigh have catipulted. We are just now starting to see postive and progressive changes but this city really needs to start doing some bold things even if it seems to defy logic at times. Its like the little train that could.

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At the time when this project was proposed, there was a quiet element against it because it seemed to be not Greensboro like and that may have been what killed the project. We need to expand our horizons as a city and stop putting Greensboro in a box. We'll never be on the same level as Charlotte and Raleigh if we keep doing that. Cities are suppose to evolve and redefine themselves from time to time and thats more important than ever for Greensboro because we are still trying to find an identity. Thats really Greensboro's problem, no real identity other than its past association with textiles. I think alot of our citizens believe Greensboro can't reach its full potential because the city has been stuck in a rut for the past 30 years while Charlotte and Raleigh have catipulted. We are just now starting to see postive and progressive changes but this city really needs to start doing some bold things even if it seems to defy logic at times. Its like the little train that could.

I agree. And this project could be a stepping stone. But I wonder, what are we going to be? What are we the closest to?A Data center? Bank hub? Tourist destination? Medical hub? I think it will have to be something that Charlotte and Raleigh does not already dominate in, so we would be able to compete.

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I agree. And this project could be a stepping stone. But I wonder, what are we going to be? What are we the closest to?A Data center? Bank hub? Tourist destination? Medical hub? I think it will have to be something that Charlotte and Raleigh does not already dominate in, so we would be able to compete.

I certainly wouldn't mind Greensboro being a tourist destinaton. We already have a foundation for that with Grandover Resort and Wet'n Wild. The Greensboro Triumph Center would have been a major step forward in becoming a tourist destination. Like I said, don't rule out the possibilty of this project being resurected in the future. Because you just never know. If it does come back, the developer will have his ducks in a row and will have more control over leaks to the media. While I was told some very exciting elements of the project, the details have never been publicly reveiled. The scope of the project was much bigger the what was leaked to the public. I hope it will be ressurected. Greensboro has had a number of opportunties in becoming more of a tourist destination. Most people dont know that back in the 1960s, Greensboro was the first choice for a Busch Brewery an Busch Gardens themepark. It was to be built where the Grandover Resort is located today. Some how the land deal went sour and the company moved their plans to the secondary site, Williamsburg, VA. Greensboro was also on the radar for a Six Flags themepark in the late 1990s. In 1998 the Minnisota Twins were considering a move to North Carolina if Triad residents approved building a major league baseball stadium on the Guilford/Forsyth County line. If the stadium had been built, it would have inluded a Six Flags themepark in Guilford County near the stadium. (Six Flags over North Carolina) I suspect Six Flags would have aquired Wet'n Wild as well.

I still would like the area to get a themepark. Greensboro's waterpark would certainly compliment it. But if we were to become a tourist destination, it will take more than a themepark. Greensboro doesn't have natural features such as beaches or mountains or large historic districts like Charleston so it would be a challenge. It would take a cluster of entertainment and tourist developments in the city to accomplish that. It would also have to be done in a tasteful way so that it doesn't overshadow the essence of Greensboro. Also no offence to Asheboro but it would have helped if the zoo had been built in Greensboro. I still don't know why it wasnt built in Guilord County where it would have been close to the interstates.

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I certainly wouldn't mind Greensboro being a tourist destinaton. We already have a foundation for that with Grandover Resort and Wet'n Wild. The Greensboro Triumph Center would have been a major step forward in becoming a tourist destination. Like I said, don't rule out the possibilty of this project being resurected in the future. Because you just never know. If it does come back, the developer will have his ducks in a row and will have more control over leaks to the media. While I was told some very exciting elements of the project, the details have never been publicly reveiled. The scope of the project was much bigger the what was leaked to the public. I hope it will be ressurected. Greensboro has had a number of opportunties in becoming more of a tourist destination. Most people dont know that back in the 1960s, Greensboro was the first choice for a Busch Brewery an Busch Gardens themepark. It was to be built where the Grandover Resort is located today. Some how the land deal went sour and the company moved their plans to the secondary site, Williamsburg, VA. Greensboro was also on the radar for a Six Flags themepark in the late 1990s. In 1998 the Minnisota Twins were considering a move to North Carolina if Triad residents approved building a major league baseball stadium on the Guilford/Forsyth County line. If the stadium had been built, it would have inluded a Six Flags themepark in Guilford County near the stadium. (Six Flags over North Carolina) I suspect Six Flags would have aquired Wet'n Wild as well.

I still would like the area to get a themepark. Greensboro's waterpark would certainly compliment it. But if we were to become a tourist destination, it will take more than a themepark. Greensboro doesn't have natural features such as beaches or mountains or large historic districts like Charleston so it would be a challenge. It would take a cluster of entertainment and tourist developments in the city to accomplish that. It would also have to be done in a tasteful way so that it doesn't overshadow the essence of Greensboro. Also no offence to Asheboro but it would have helped if the zoo had been built in Greensboro. I still don't know why it wasnt built in Guilord County where it would have been close to the interstates.

I was kinda mad about the Asheboro Zoo thing, lol.

I heard about the Minnesota Twins wanting to relocate to The Triad(which would have been epic), but I never knew anything about a Six Flags Park and a Busch Brewery Busch Gardens themepark being planned here :blink:, it seems like we could have become an official tourist attraction by now. But I definitely think the Greensboro Triumph Center will come back sometime in the near future, especially when the economy comes back up. Greensboro already has the tools to become a tourist destination with the Greensboro Coliseum, the Civil Rights museum, the ACC Hall of fame, Wet 'N Wild, Koury Convention Center, all of the night clubs and bars we have, a large number of major universities to help provide a hipster-like vibe, we don't have beaches or mountains but we do have a good amount of vegetation that could help us in the scenery department(And I think mountains are visible from the western part of Greensboro. A special kind of Observation tower could help this). And I agree that it would take more than amusement parks to make Greensboro a tourist attraction. Since were land locked, we could study what Atlanta and other land locked cities did(I would put Orlando, but it's only 30 min away from a beach). I was thinking something like casinos and more adult-orientated features can be added as well as more entertainment districts. I think we should also develop our local features such as the Triad Stage and Carolina Theater to maintain it original feel. It's alot of work, but it can happen if the city puts forth the effort!

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  • 2 months later...

Folks...what we thought was dead may still be alive..... Its back!

I came across the developers website and it shows preliminary plans for his Greensboro Triumph Center which had been shelved. The plan actually includes a performing arts center called "Ardent Square" and it appears to be the anchor of the project. Coincidentally the talk of the town now is a new downtown performance arts center so something is going on behind the scenes ;) I had no idea he had this website showing plans. He gives a lot more detail about the project then what was revealed in the media. It looks like he is trying to bring this project back on the table. One thing I did notice is that on the website it mentions that the hotel rooms has changed from 500 to 300 due to market conditions and that fact that "another downtown hotel" is being proposed. The Wyndham is the only downtown hotel being proposed and he has a 2010 date at the bottom of the website. The developer also mentions the recent opening of the Civil Rights Museum which opened earlier this year...interesting ;) Since everyone one wants a downtown performance arts center now and no one knows whos going to pay for it, Issac Cain could use that as leverage to get his project off the ground again because before the focus wasn't a performing arts center. He states he is raising private capital to build the performing arts concert hall. The entertainment and convention component would make the 300-hotel feasible and would help bring even more business to the planned downtown 10-story Wyndham hotel. The Koury Convention Center may see a little competition if the convention part of it gets built. He may have to scale back the number of condo units since the housing and banking crisis has led to slow condo sales in the central business district, but there is a great demand for downtown apartments. However it would likely take a number of years before the this project gets off the ground and by that time there may be an increased demand for downtown condos as the economy improves. This project would also be built in phases. Obviously the local media hasn't picked up on his plans to resurrect the Greensboro Triumph Center...stay tuned folks!

The performing arts center/concert hall portion will be supported by "entertainers such as ,James Taylor, Sting, Bon Jovi, Vanessa Williams, and Natalie Cole to name a few" Other amenities of the Greensboro Triumph Center include NASCAR simulators, fighter jet simulators, children's rides and a double decker carousel. All he needs is a roller coaster LOL

http://exemptinc.com/Project_Specifications.html

preliminary renderings and site plans of the Greensboro Triumph Center (these renderings and plans represent the "smallest version" of what he had originally proposed. The larger version would have taken up more than two city blocks and because of the economy the larger version seems to be off the table. But this project would be in a great location because it would create energy along Church Street and it would be adjacent to the rail road tracks. A commuter or light rail stop could easily be put here in the future. The site is also about a block a way from the planned 10-story downtown Wyndham hotel. If this project really does take off, we could see a dramatic change in Greensboro's skyline. No longer would all the tall buildings be located around Elm Street.

The Entertainment Destination Project Specifications:

Mixed Use Project:

PERFORMING ARTS CONCERT HALL:

4000 Seats

10,000 square feet Restaurant

10,000 square feet Retail

HOTEL TOWER : (Franchise to be determined)

300 Rooms

10,000 square feet Retail Shops

ENTERTAINMENT PAVILION:

200,000 square feet total

Bowling Lanes

Roller Skating Rink

8 Screens (IMAX) 3D Theaters

Video Arcades

Shops and Food court

RESIDENTIAL MIXED USE TOWER

251 units

50,000 square feet Commercial space

50,000 square feet Retail space

CONVENTION CENTER:

100,000 square feet

These are not final renderings but it looks like the tall building is suppose to be the hotel. Originally the hotel was suppose to be 20-stories but since the rooms have been reduced to 300, this hotel should be around 15-stories.

triumph_center_-performing_arts_hotel_.jpg

This portion is located on three different properties. The city owns the land where the convention center is, Lincoln Financial owns the land where the hotel sit and the Weaver Foundation owns the land where the entertainment complex is located. I do know the city wants to sell this piece of property to a developer. The Greensboro Children's Museum is located on property next to the entertainment complex portion. Obviously DGI is still working with this guy because Downtown Greensboro, Inc even outlines this property for a potential performing arts center in the report they released a few weeks ago.

development_drawings_002_fovx_r4lz.png

This portion which would be part of the last phases of the project shows 3 towers.

development_drawings_003_xrx6.jpg

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