The Greensboro Triumph Center

[cityboi]

Trust me, from the sounds of this project I would like to see Greensboro to land it (unless, of course, Rock Hill is also in the running ), but if it is being implied that one $150 million dollar project is going to propel Greensboro and the Triad back to the top of the economic food chain in NC, forget it.

the $150 million is a rumored figure the media got a hold to....the project would likely cost much more considering the projects within this project that have not been revealed to the public or the press. The EpiCentre in Charlotte was quoted as $100 million at first but it turned out being over $300 million

[krazeeboi]

I think that was mostly due to the natural rise in construction costs, not because more stuff got added. But the point isn't as much about the dollar figure as it is about the nature of the development. This will undoubtedly be a great asset to downtown Greensboro, but in no way will a big entertainment complex alone all of a sudden put the Triad on par with Charlotte and the Triangle economically--again, if that is what was being implied by that statement.

[triadcat]

the $150 million is a rumored figure the media got a hold to....the project would likely cost much more considering the projects within this project that have not been revealed to the public or the press. The EpiCentre in Charlotte was quoted as $100 million at first but it turned out being over $300 million

It's ok cityboi............... krazeeiboi, 1968, and other naysayers arent even from our area.

I wouldnt pay much attention to them

[triadcat]

I think that was mostly due to the natural rise in construction costs, not because more stuff got added. But the point isn't as much about the dollar figure as it is about the nature of the development. This will undoubtedly be a great asset to downtown Greensboro, but in no way will a big entertainment complex alone all of a sudden put the Triad on par with Charlotte and the Triangle economically--again, if that is what was being implied by that statement.

Nowhere has cityboi 'implied' that the Triad is on par with Charlotte or the Triangle. The Charlotte and Triangle areas have a butt load of money.

[krazeeboi]

Nowhere has cityboi 'implied' that the Triad is on par with Charlotte or the Triangle. The Charlotte and Triangle areas have a butt load of money.

Read post #72 to see what I was referring to.

You really need to get out of this frame of mind that just because someone is providing objective criticism that he/she is a "naysayer." I've said time and time again in this thread that I wish Greensboro the best in landing this project, but we also need to be realistic about the whole thing. If you have any valid objections to my arguments, then state them, but don't hurl labels and then proceed to hide behind them; that isn't very mature at all. You should know me well enough by my posts in this subforum that I truly like Greensboro and I'm not hating on the city in the least.

[flir67]

I hate to say it but gso doesn't have jack on charlotte. charlottes downtown is freaking huge and there's always something happening downtown big. and add the bobcat stadium with it down their also slap dap in the center.

I believe greensboro is trying, but not hard enough. I've just moved back from charlotte and gso downtown is coming around. it has a several new bars and this new wireless park. same "n club" the resturants are much more upscale. and the apartment parking for the new tenants a joke.

"I got it hay lets move downtown where all the action is. Ok so you sell your house or get out of your lease. move downtown, only to fine out that you don't have a paid parking spot you have to drive around and park on the street. "

ps. everyhouse in dowtown charlotte has private parking and apartments. its under the buildings or built into house plans. gso really needs to do this

the only parking deck in downtown is next to the sherton on the far end of downtown or the police parking deck. thats it.

but lets face it. gso downtown needs parking deck in the center of it like charlottes 7th street station. I went to the press club off mlk and had to drive around the side streets for 20 minutes then park in the grass for a place.. come on... this is silly.

and by the way nascar in gso was a joke.

the problem I see is there is absolutely no easy way to get downtown from 40/85 area for vistors. all the signs point to side streets and every gets lost and ends up saying screw it and goes home.

just my 2 cents

[cityboi]

I think that Greensboro has to start somewhere. and eventually it will happen for Greensboro. When you enter Guilford County you see signs that say "Welcome to Guilford County - North Carolina's Future" and I believe that. I think before we make judgement on this potential project for downtown Greensboro we need to wait and see exactly what its is. It may have attractions in it that Charlotte or Raleigh doesnt have in their downtown or city. Its really just a wait and see game and as I said before, the size plan thats chosen will determine how much of an impact it will have on the region. In any case, I would imagine a project like this, speedin up other development and encouraging other developers to consider large scale development in downtown Greensboro. We could get a couple or several towers out of this deal depending on the size and Roy Caroll has his future plans for a tower next to Centre Pointe so I think the face of downtown Greensboro could dramatically change over the next 5 to 10 years or so.

[Creasy336]

the problem I see is there is absolutely no easy way to get downtown from 40/85 area for vistors. all the signs point to side streets and every gets lost and ends up saying screw it and goes home.

What is the Elm-Eugene Street Exit? What signs to side streets are you talking about?

[luvdowntowngso]

I hate to say it but gso doesn't have jack on charlotte. charlottes downtown is freaking huge and there's always something happening downtown big. and add the bobcat stadium with it down their also slap dap in the center.

I believe greensboro is trying, but not hard enough. I've just moved back from charlotte and gso downtown is coming around. it has a several new bars and this new wireless park. same "n club" the resturants are much more upscale. and the apartment parking for the new tenants a joke.

"I got it hay lets move downtown where all the action is. Ok so you sell your house or get out of your lease. move downtown, only to fine out that you don't have a paid parking spot you have to drive around and park on the street. "

ps. everyhouse in dowtown charlotte has private parking and apartments. its under the buildings or built into house plans. gso really needs to do this

the only parking deck in downtown is next to the sherton on the far end of downtown or the police parking deck. thats it.

but lets face it. gso downtown needs parking deck in the center of it like charlottes 7th street station. I went to the press club off mlk and had to drive around the side streets for 20 minutes then park in the grass for a place.. come on... this is silly.

and by the way nascar in gso was a joke.

the problem I see is there is absolutely no easy way to get downtown from 40/85 area for vistors. all the signs point to side streets and every gets lost and ends up saying screw it and goes home.

just my 2 cents

flir67, welcome to the forum! You make some very good points about things Greensboro needs to do. Yes, Greensboro does not have "jack" on Charlotte! I for one, am gratefull! A huge downtown or urban jungle? Yes, the State of Charlotte is great! I admire it's skyline and it's position as a great U.S. city. However, the last place I would want Greensboro to be like is Charlotte. I be;ieve Charlotte is growing too fast. I read the Charlotte forums! Lets see...at last count some 30-40 high rise projects in the works. And, while its great to see all those buildings added to the skyline. Charlottle residents think little of all the problems that will come with such rapid growth....traffic, crime ect.

Yes, the ball need to roll a little faster for Greenboro's DT...But not too fast! If we land this project, maybe it will lead to other projects. I hope so! As I have stated many times in this forum, I want Greensboro and the Triad to experience steady and planned growth. It is up to us and our local goverment leaders to insure this happens. Before you bash Greensboro too much, I encourage you to "GET INVOLVED" Your voice and ideas on how we should grow along with our downtown needs, will help insure planned growth and make Greensboro and the Triad a great place to live for decades to come. Welcome back to the Triad!

[cityboi]

flir67, welcome to the forum! You make some very good points about things Greensboro needs to do. Yes, Greensboro does not have "jack" on Charlotte! I for one, am greatful! A huge downtown or urban jungle? Yes, the State of Charlotte is great! I admire it's skyline and it's position as a great U.S. city. However, the last place I would want Greensboro to be like is Charlotte. I be;ieve Charlotte is growing too fast. I read the Charlotte forums! Lets see...at last count some 30-40 high rise projects in the works. And, while its great to see all those buildings added to the skyline. Charlittle residents think little of all the problems that will come with such rapid growth....traffic, crime ect.

Yes, the ball need to roll a little faster for Greenboro's DT...But not too fast! If we land this project, maybe it will lead to other projects. I hope so! As I have stated many times in this forum, I want Greensboro and the Triad to experience steady and planned growth. It is up to us and our local goverment leaders to insure this happens. Before you bash Greensboro too much, I encourage you to "GET INVOLVED" Your voice and ideas on how we should grow along with our downtown needs, will help insure planned growth and make Greensboro and the Triad a great place to live for decades to come. Welcome back to the Triad!

You also make a good point.....there is a such thing as too much growth too fast! But Greensboro really have some great thing in the works for downtown and when I look back over the past seven years, Im truly amazed at all the progress. 7 years ago, if someone said to me that downtown Greensboro would have the kind of development thats happened and being proposed, I would have thought there were crazy as hell.

[roningreensboro]

After reading all the post, I hope that we don't start with the negative comments going back and forth. Who cares if this growth is too fast of if the city can support it or not. Let the powers at be deside on that and hope that GSO gets this project. Looking at GSO history, ever since it was named, has been somewhat slow and fast at times. I think this is exactly what GSO needs because with Raliegh, Charlotte, and even Winston growing at their pase, this will help GSO keep up. If they decide to put in a Cheesecake Factory, Hard Rock Cafe of B&N, that would be cool because people will travel to downtown for those venues. Whether they leave it up to locally owned stores and shops, that is good too. As long as GSO maintain that charm and have the urban feel would be great.

Citiboy, I was thinking about your reply to my comment this morning. What if Carolina Bank is in with this deal, redesigned their poor excuse of a headquaters and is willing to incorparate a mix use tower with this project? What if that is the big news?

All in all, NO MORE NEGATIVE COMMENTS! Greensboro needs this.

[cityboi]

After reading all the post, I hope that we don't start with the negative comments going back and forth. Who cares if this growth is too fast of if the city can support it or not. Let the powers at be deside on that and hope that GSO gets this project. Looking at GSO history, ever since it was named, has been somewhat slow and fast at times. I think this is exactly what GSO needs because with Raliegh, Charlotte, and even Winston growing at their pase, this will help GSO keep up. If they decide to put in a Cheesecake Factory, Hard Rock Cafe of B&N, that would be cool because people will travel to downtown for those venues. Whether they leave it up to locally owned stores and shops, that is good too. As long as GSO maintain that charm and have the urban feel would be great.

Citiboy, I was thinking about your reply to my comment this morning. What if Carolina Bank is in with this deal, redesigned their poor excuse of a headquaters and is willing to incorparate a mix use tower with this project? What if that is the big news?

All in all, NO MORE NEGATIVE COMMENTS! Greensboro needs this.

you know I really hope they are involved because that design is pretty awful! For some reason I get the feeling that some headquarters could be involved. The rumor is that ther are about 5 BIG projects that make up this mega project and its rumored that office space would be a part of this development......also I totally agree about the negative comments...I know some of the speculations here seem far fetch for Greensboro but it doesnt hurt to speculate whats coming. I mean 6 or 7 years ago, no one thought Greensboro would ever have a downtown ballpark anytime soon and to be built privately at that. Also Southside was a miracle and Center Pointe couldnt have been forseen. Most thought the old wachovia building would be completely demolished. So I hope we dont redicule certain things said here no matter how far fetched it may seem. There is something big about this potential project for a big high-rise hotel to be in this. It was only a couple of years ago when hotels werent doing so good downtown. Then I was told that the Downtown Marriott was losing money

[cityboi]

I did find an article about Disney's plans for downtown hotels and entertainment districts. Notice the date on the article. This looks like some Disney is getting ready to do

http://www.topix.net/content/trb/111623826...829633186064765

www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-disneyside0807feb08,0,3685049.story

[roningreensboro]

I did find an article about Disney's plans for downtown hotels and entertainment districts. Notice the date on the article. This looks like some Disney is getting ready to do

http://www.topix.net/content/trb/111623826...829633186064765

www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-disneyside0807feb08,0,3685049.story

If Disney do build a Disney themed hotel in Greensboro it would work well with the proposed Carosel. It would be great for them to put a mini theme park beside the baseball stadium for kids during baseball games. With Greensboro's Revolutionary history this will also be a great way of weaving the cities history with a Disney twist to bring in more school trips for elementary students. History education with a fun twist. I think this will be a great project and hope that is comes here.

[cityboi]

If Disney do build a Disney themed hotel in Greensboro it would work well with the proposed Carosel. It would be great for them to put a mini theme park beside the baseball stadium for kids during baseball games. With Greensboro's Revolutionary history this will also be a great way of weaving the cities history with a Disney twist to bring in more school trips for elementary students. History education with a fun twist. I think this will be a great project and hope that is comes here.

I agree and if this deal goes through, the caroseul project could be placed in this development which I think would likely happen. like I said very clearly, this may have nothing at all to do with Disney, but I could see Disney building a theme hotel/entertainment complex in downtown Greensboro. Disney has also announced that its interested in building waterparks across the country. Wet n Wild Emerald Pointe is one of the popular waterparks in the Southeast and certainly one of the largest. The waterpark has already been acquired once by a major US waterpark chain. Its not out of the question for Disney to acquire Emerald Pointe since it would mean less money they would have to spend building from scratch and they would be buying a very successful and popular waterpark. the Wet'nWild chain has already sold off some its waterparks. WetnWild use to have waterparks in South America and Las Vegas. Now the only Wet'n Wild waterparks in the U.S. are in Greensboro and Orlando, FL. A Disney owned waterpark in Greensboro combined with a downtown Disney theme hotel/entertainment complex would create a dynamic package for Disney as the company searches for alternatives to to building Disney themeparks. Greensboro already has a resort hotel so maybe Disney sees the Triad region as being a potential destination. There is a very large popluation within a 100 mile radius of Greensboro too. For those of you who believe major themepark developers wouldnt come here, remember this, Greensboro was already considered twice for theme parks. In the late 60s, it was Busch Gardens. The Gate City was very close to getting a Busch Brewery and Themepark. It was to be built on the land where Grandover is today. Something happen and the land deal went sour and the company chose Williamsburg, VA instead. Remember this was back in the 1960/70s when Greensboro and the Triad was far less populated. During the major league baseball vote in the late 90s it was Six Flags. But Six Flags would only build if a major league baseball stadium were built.

Lets talk about the potential sites in downtown Greensboro.

1 The most obvious site is the two former chevrolet lots next to the ballpark (Smith Street divides the two properties) also the former county tax department property which now belongs to Roy Caroll (the corner of Lindsay and Eugene Streets.

2 The Former Duke Power site next to the Children's Museum which would include property between Friendly and Market Streets. The Duke Power site is a "land banked" property owned by the Weaver Foundation saved for development

3. The big parking lot/ Greensboro Inn motel property next to Solaris Restaurant and across the street from the NC Trust Center and Renaisance Plaza Tower

4 The Elm/Lee Street site is a possibilty but I doubt this site would be considered. For one thing there is already a plan laid out here. VERY tall building would be out of place here as well.

[Beany]

Sorry flir67 you are having trouble with parking downtown. DT could use more parking options.

By the way there are four city owned decks dt: Greene St, Davie St, Bellemeade and Church.

[roningreensboro]

I agree and if this deal goes through, the caroseul project could be placed in this development which I think would likely happen. like I said very clearly, this may have nothing at all to do with Disney, but I could see Disney building a theme hotel/entertainment complex in downtown Greensboro. Disney has also announced that its interested in building waterparks across the country. Wet n Wild Emerald Pointe is one of the popular waterparks in the Southeast and certainly one of the largest. The waterpark has already been acquired once by a major US waterpark chain. Its not out of the question for Disney to acquire Emerald Pointe since it would mean less money they would have to spend building from scratch and they would be buying a very successful and popular waterpark. the Wet'nWild chain has already sold off some its waterparks. A Disney owned waterpark in Greensboro combined with a downtown Disney theme hotel/entertainment complex would create a dynamic package for Disney as the company searches for alternatives to to building Disney themeparks. Greensboro already has a resort hotel so maybe Disney sees the Triad region as being a potential destination. There is a very large popluation within a 100 mile radius of Greensboro too. For those of you who believe major themepark developers wouldnt come here, remember this, Greensboro was already considered twice for theme parks. In the late 60s, it was Busch Gardens. The Gate City was very close to getting a Busch Brewery and Themepark. It was to be built on the land where Grandover is today. Something happen and the land deal went sour and the company chose Williamsburg, VA instead. Remember this was back in the 1960/70s when Greensboro and the Triad was far less populated. During the major league baseball vote in the late 90s it was Six Flags. But Six Flags would only build if a major league baseball stadium were built.

Lets talk about the potential sites in downtown Greensboro.

1 The most obvious site is the two former chevrolet lots next to the ballpark (Smith Street divides the two properties) also the former county tax department property which now belongs to Roy Caroll (the corner of Lindsay and Eugene Streets.

2 The Former Duke Power site next to the Children's Museum which would include property between Friendly and Market Streets. The Duke Power site is a "land banked" property owned by the Weaver Foundation saved for development

3. The big parking lot/ Greensboro Inn motel property next to Solaris Restaurant and across the street from the NC Trust Center and Renaisance Plaza Tower

4 The Elm/Lee Street site is a possibilty but I doubt this site would be considered. For one thing there is already a plan laid out here. VERY tall building would be out of place here as well.

Don't forget the parking lot behind the Guilford Building on the corner of Davie and Washington. That would be great for a hotel because it is close to the Train station and Depot. The parking lot on the corner of Market and Davie and beside Governors Court. And Someone could buy out the Hardees and Firestone and put a very nice mix use skyscrapper and plaza there too. There are lots of potiental for downtown.

[cityboi]

Don't forget the parking lot behind the Guilford Building on the corner of Davie and Washington. That would be great for a hotel because it is close to the Train station and Depot. The parking lot on the corner of Market and Davie and beside Governors Court. And Someone could buy out the Hardees and Firestone and put a very nice mix use skyscrapper and plaza there too. There are lots of potiental for downtown.

Indeed you are right. I forgot about the big parking lot next to Governors court. Also the News & Record lot across from the depot, There is great potential for that location.

[krazeeboi]

also I totally agree about the negative comments...I know some of the speculations here seem far fetch for Greensboro but it doesnt hurt to speculate whats coming. I mean 6 or 7 years ago, no one thought Greensboro would ever have a downtown ballpark anytime soon and to be built privately at that. Also Southside was a miracle and Center Pointe couldnt have been forseen. Most thought the old wachovia building would be completely demolished. So I hope we dont redicule certain things said here no matter how far fetched it may seem.

I hope we aren't confusing negativity and ridicule here with objectivity and constructive criticism, as they are different things. Do I see this development propelling the Triad past Charlotte and the Triangle? No, and it would be totally unrealistic to think so. Do I see it is as playing a significant role in the redevelopment and rebirth of downtown Greensboro? Absolutely.

[cityboi]

I hope we aren't confusing negativity and ridicule here with objectivity and constructive criticism, as they are different things. Do I see this development propelling the Triad past Charlotte and the Triangle? No, and it would be totally unrealistic to think so. Do I see it is as playing a significant role in the redevelopment and rebirth of downtown Greensboro? Absolutely.

very true. I dont recall saying this developement would propell Greensboro past Charlotte and Raleigh though. I know there has been alot of talk about how BIG this can be though and all kinds of ambitious speculation. When I said ridicule though I was refering to speculation that it seems like it could be a new type of Disney realated attraction based on several coincidental facts involved with this project. It may not be Disney, It may be something else but cleary its safe to say this is about entertainment for the most part and seems to be some sort of tourist attraction with other elements. The fact that the project has a highrise hotel in it and space potentially for the ACC Hall of Champions & Museum pretty much shows there is a big tourist element here.

[cityboi]

After reading the linked articles on forum, a poster on a local blog called the Disney Executive offices and got nowhere fast. He then called the Sentinel reporter (who reported the story about Disney building hotel/entertainment complexes in downtowns) to see if had any other information. He did not...

But the reporter did say this about the Greensboro/Disney speculation after the blog poster explained what he knew... "It wouldn't surprise me one bit."

Amazingly, a few people who opposed the downtown ballpark, actually like the idea of an Disney entertainment complex.

[roningreensboro]

This project is getting more and more hopeful to me. I just "hope" that it doesn't fall through but I have a gutt feeling that inspite of GSO's past negotiation practices, we will pull through for this project.

Krazeeboi, we know that every one has a right to an opinion but it's just that sometime the opinions tend to take go down a negative road, if we aren't careful.

[krazeeboi]

Amazingly, a few people who opposed the downtown ballpark, actually like the idea of an Disney entertainment complex.

That doesn't surprise me one bit. I would also expect some of those naysayers to have changed their tune once they saw how successful the ballpark was and how it added to the energy and vitality of downtown.

Krazeeboi, we know that every one has a right to an opinion but it's just that sometime the opinions tend to take go down a negative road, if we aren't careful.

I will make sure they don't.

[cityboi]

One thing is for sure...if it is a Disney hotel/entertainment complex, Greensboro would be the first and only city that would have such a development...once again here are clues that hint that it could be Disney

Here are some clues indicating this could be a Disney related project:

Here are some clues indicating this could be a Disney related project:

1) anonymous Florida Development company is behind the project (Disney Development Company?- a subsidary and community development arm of Walt Disney)

2) several southern states are competeing for this development (Greensboro is the front runner)

3) Disney announced 3 months ago that it was thinking about building themed hotel/entertainment complexes in downtowns. (Greensboro's rumored project has a highrise hotel /entertainment complex......btw what is in this project that makes it feasible to build a highrise hotel downtown? just a few years ago hotels werent doing good downtown) These "Disney Downtown Districts" would be modeled after the Downtown Disney parks in Orlando and Anaheim which have ACM theaters, House of Blues, ESPN Zone and other venues for families and Children.

4) the Development is described as having an entertainment complex with with attractions for families, children and singles (VERY DISNEY LIKE)

5) hudreds of thousands of dollars were spent to do feasibilty studies. (Why on earth would it take that much money for a project in downtown Greensboro?)

6) The Florida development company is pondering wether Greensboro can support this project (indicating the large nature of the project)

7) The company is looking at Greensboro because of its central location between Charlotte and Raleigh. (indicating this project is expected to draw people from around the Piedmont)

8) The company's decision to look at Greensboro also has to do with the city's history which indicates a theme development. (American Revolution theme? ACC?)

9) Project appears to be a tourist destination (the developer wants to include the ACC Hall of Champions and Museum with this project)

10) The project has been descibed as HUGE and MASSIVE for Greensboro

11) an Orlando news reporter said in reference to the Disney/Greensboro speculation "I wouldn't be surprised"

12) This project is secret as hell!

[krazeeboi]

I will say that I would be quite surprised if Disney chose to do this first-of-a-kind development in Greensboro. That's not to say that Greensboro would be "unworthy," but from a development and revenue-generating point of view, I could think of other locations that would make a bit more business sense to me (i.e., along the coast). But since we're still in the dark as far as details are concerned, it's theoretically possible.