Cap over Belk Freeway (277)

[15895]

The state should be heavily financially reliable for this, right?

[CLTNative]

I haven't seen those drawings before. Below is an updated image from the 2020 Vision Plan. You can download the PDF and get a closer look at just the cap.

 

[Matthew.Brendan]

Is the realignment of the I-77/Freedom/Wilkinson interchange tied to the cap or will that happen independently?

[ssh214]

As much as I would think this would be a cool project in the future is this really necessary right now? There is still so much land available within the core of uptown I really don't see the need for this project yet. Maybe it could be a good idea for the 2030 Vision Plan but even 2020 is too soon in my opinion...

[ah59396]

I agree.  This project is awesome, but I think it can wait.

[DEnd]

The state should be heavily financially reliable for this, right?

 

No.  While the state and feds should pony up money for the exits portion of the project it is unlikely due to the maintence and expansion/new road backlog the state currently has.  If it's to be done on any sort of reasonable time table the city will have to do it. 

[C_C_Planner]

The state should be heavily financially reliable for this, right?

No, the State won't invest in a project that does not include transportation solutions. This would be a joint City/County project if economic development or park funds can be identified.

[Urbanity]

As much as I would think this would be a cool project in the future is this really necessary right now? There is still so much land available within the core of uptown I really don't see the need for this project yet. Maybe it could be a good idea for the 2030 Vision Plan but even 2020 is too soon in my opinion...

 

Agree completely.  Downtown has too many parking lots to begin with and developing those should be a priority over developing new tracts of land to be developed.  

Also while I do love the renderings and what the cap could offer as far as connectivity - I really don't think that the city has that much of a problem with connectivity from downtown to South End.  If you want to talk about connectivity issues I would much rather see an effort go into developing the immediate (10-20 block radius) North and West sides of the 277 loop than a cap towards South End.

AS noted there would be no (or no significant) money from the state on this and since we can't even pass the CIP, and the Panthers are likely to get their $125m I just don't see how an argument can be made for spending any money on this project for a while.

 

BTW If a private developer wants to pay the entire project I have no qualms about this and I would say go for it.

Edited January 19, 2013 by Urbanity

[kermit]

St Louis is getting a downtown freeway cap and Anthony Foxx was at the groundbreaking.

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/jobs-and-economy/2013/08/whats-better-turning-urban-highway-park/6420/

To be fair all you need to do is glance at the first photo to see they have a pretty good justification for the project.

[Matthew.Brendan]

Can't wait for ours!

[15895]

Love mayor Foxx.

I'm very, very ready for our cap.... Not sure when it will happen, but by that time, it will be extremely transformative (assuming another transformative project gets underway).

[kermit]

Mary Newsom wants to know why we are still waiting on our cap. She says that it has been discussed since the mid 1990s.

 

http://nakedcityblog.blogspot.com/2013/08/when-it-comes-to-i-277-cap-bold.html

[C_C_Planner]

There are $350,000,000 reasons. The cap needs a funding source, since it is not a transportation improvement.

[Matthew.Brendan]

Will there really be NO road connectivity?

edit: looking at the PDF linked above now

Edited August 8, 2013 by melk

[ah59396]

As much as I'd love a cap, there are plenty other things in the city I'd rather spend $350m on.  Like more transit.

 

Now if a private enterprise came along and was willing to cap it, with some assistance from the city, I'd be open to the conversation for sure.

[ssh214]

As much as I'd love a cap, there are plenty other things in the city I'd rather spend $350m on.  Like more transit.

 

Now if a private enterprise came along and was willing to cap it, with some assistance from the city, I'd be open to the conversation for sure.

Agreed, I'd much rather see that money spent towards a Light Rail line built down Fairview to the airport to connect Southpark and the Airport with transfer station at Tyvola with the Blue Line...

[dubone]

There is no money set aside for a cap.  If people thought $100m for a streetcar was bad 3x that for a freeway cover would get insane pushback.

[Missmylab4]

The cheaper option is simple. Build a few/2 pedestrian bridges that only allow bikes and people that are fully caged. NO CARS!! Denver and Minneapolis have these along with many other cities. While these aren't as friendly for a pedestrian as a highway cap, they sure as hell beat the two access points from South End today.

You build two pedestrian points now, it builds some synergy for the future and makes the cap more realistic down the line. Plus, you get an access point to downtown without having cars shoot by at 2 feet away. Which is absolutely uninviting for a pedestrian.

Win-Win

[15895]

It needs to be capped. Whether its popular or not doesn't take away the merit of the project. It needs to be planned now and pushed through later

Though I do believe at this point in time, we need to focus on mass transit.

Edited August 17, 2013 by AirNostrumMAD

[Missmylab4]

Too draw the line further. You put both bridges at each end point of the future highway cap. That way, it sets some precedent for the future. Then in 10-20 years you have a more realistic shot of acquiring the cap.

[Guest]

Too draw the line further. You put both bridges at each end point of the future highway cap. That way, it sets some precedent for the future. Then in 10-20 years you have a more realistic shot of acquiring the cap.

I am not so sure. I live in Brooklyn off the BQE and regularly have to walk over it and I prefer the sidewalks walking along-side cars than the pedestrian bridges. The pedestrian bridges are lonely, seedy, full of trash and human waste. I can't say the same thing will happen in Charlotte, but I'm for a cap before any gated in, jail like pedestrian bridge. Either that or increased connectivity by widening our current uptown streets to better accommodate pedestrians and motorists alike.

[southslider]

Widening sidewalks on existing bridges would also be cheaper. College St bridge should be next. As was done on Tryon, do a road diet test with paint and cones first to prove to the traffic engineers that it works.

[nowensone]

Stupid question, and sure its been asked before, would it not be much cheaper to just fill in the southern-eastern portion (bottom half basically), up to Independence, and then just build regular connections.  This means eliminating 277 really, the northern half just becomes Brookshire, the southern half not much of a loss.  It has done its job to hem in downtown and provide an artificial reason to densify, now that Southend is doing that on its own, it is no longer needed.  Positive that is not a new idea, but really is it not also much cheaper?

Edited August 17, 2013 by nowensone

[DMann]

Stupid question, and sure its been asked before, would it not be much cheaper to just fill in the southern-eastern portion (bottom half basically), up to Independence, and then just build regular connections.  This means eliminating 277 really, the northern half just becomes Brookshire, the southern half not much of a loss.  It has done its job to hem in downtown and provide an artificial reason to densify, now that Southend is doing that on its own, it is no longer needed.  Positive that is not a new idea, but really is it not also much cheaper?

not only would that make sense to fill in the divide between Dilworth and downtown, but it would also bring the greenway and CCCP into the city by eliminating the barrier that the Belk Freeway is feeding into 74.

[southslider]

Except that Belmont, Optimist Park and Sunnyside deserve as much connectivity to Uptown as Dilworth, Midtown, and Elizabeth.  Besides, Brookshire is older and will need replacement sooner than Belk.  Rather than rebuild it, I say rip it out and restore 11th and 12th as a multi-way boulevard.  Best of all, eliminating 277 over 10th Street towards Independence would allow Little Sugar Creek Greenway to finally connect Belmont (and ultimately NoDa) with Midtown and Freedom Park.