SKYE Condominiums and Hyatt Place Hotel

[dubone]

we talk about how The Vue has its marketing engine in full effect. The Park has had just 3 crayon renderings since they first announced 5 years ago, and that is it. Their sales office was on the top of that parking deck, which looks rundown and dingy.

If the park really got that close to selling out, they should have updated their rendering to a shiny 3d computer model, updated their website to look sleek, and put a sales office on tryon. Instead, the park had the feeling of amateur-hour.

They were lucky to have sold as many as they did from the overflow of courtside before the real competition announced. But once that happened, it was hard to convince people to shell out that much money to live in a part of downtown where there are no other residences and not much commercial or otherwise nearby.

[ElricSeven]

we talk about how The Vue has its marketing engine in full effect. The Park has had just 3 crayon renderings since they first announced 5 years ago, and that is it. Their sales office was on the top of that parking deck, which looks rundown and dingy.

If the park really got that close to selling out, they should have updated their rendering to a shiny 3d computer model, updated their website to look sleek, and put a sales office on tryon. Instead, the park had the feeling of amateur-hour.

They were lucky to have sold as many as they did from the overflow of courtside before the real competition announced. But once that happened, it was hard to convince people to shell out that much money to live in a part of downtown where there are no other residences and not much commercial or otherwise nearby.

I really think it is a lousy location at a price that wasn't much of a value at the time of their big marketing push. In addition, the cost/square foot of the monthly dues was twice that of Courtside and probably 30% more than even the Vue is now. An extra $500 or more per month in HOA dues for a 2B is hard for most Charlotteans (who aren't used to these fees like New Yorkers) to stomach.

[monsoon]

Or New Yorkers who have escaped to Charlotte and expect the prices to be less here.

So is that the reason it appears to have failed? It's too expensive and in a bad location.

[dubone]

plus poor marketing and no consumer confidence.

[UrbanCharlotte]

Safe to say this ones dead...again.

[UptownGrrl]

plus poor marketing and no consumer confidence.

Poor marketing... they can't even decide if they're a high rise or a mid rise. They claim the benefit of being separated from the skyline so residents can see the skyline; but then say they're better for being part of the skyline. Contradictions abound on their website -- what size are the balconies? Depends what page on their site you're reading. Granite countertops and bamboo floors were added so the property could be "over and above" the other implied-inferior highrises on the market... then they turn around and say they made changes in response to what uptown buyers appear to prefer - so what's their market position -- setting the trends or struggling to play catch up?

Poor strategy - even worse execution. We all know it's lost credibility, but beyond that - it's lost any sense of identity. I wonder what it will take for those running this project to just admit it didn't work and move on from there. Scrap it and reformulate with a better plan from the get-go. PR case studies show time and time again: acknowledge, then inform what you're going to do to fix it. It's in the denials that you lose your reputation forever.

[dubone]

i agree.

i think the biggest thing they need to do is scrap the whole idea of a park on their roof. that has got to be very expensive.

They need to purchase the lot just west of them and redesign the building to include a larger parking footprint with their common amenities on top of that. Then they can cut about 5 stories of parking out... and lead to either a shorter building, or more condos in the same number of stories to make the numbers work better.

I think verna had the idea of building ontop of his parking deck... and he has just been stubborn with the single design he paid for half a decade ago.

And U/G, i agree completely with the rest.

[poplife88]

The Uptown magazine said that the Park was sold out. What gives?!

[MZT]

Poor strategy - even worse execution. We all know it's lost credibility, but beyond that - it's lost any sense of identity. I wonder what it will take for those running this project to just admit it didn't work and move on from there. Scrap it and reformulate with a better plan from the get-go. PR case studies show time and time again: acknowledge, then inform what you're going to do to fix it. It's in the denials that you lose your reputation forever.

Threadjoin: TTA and the light rail plan for the Triangle?

[UptownGrrl]

Threadjoin: TTA and the light rail plan for the Triangle?

Except the government always gets a lot more slack - in that sense, we're a captive customer base, with virtually no ability to opt-out of their long-term projects once they're approved. Maybe Verna should follow the government model: have someone new take over - have that person blame the heck out of the outgoing team and promise, now, everything will be better.

[appatone]

I haven't really said much about the park but does anyone else think that one of its big problems could be that it is just ugly. I think it's ugly, I almost hope it doesn't get built. On top of that, the rendering looks like something I could do in my free time with a pack of crayola colored pencils. When the other high-rise developers are wowing with their renderings The Park is falling flat. It doesn't help that the sales office has no hot presence in a better Uptown building like the Vue or Ave. Neither of those developers would attempt to sell their units out of the parking lot where their building will go. I would like to see them hire an architect to give the exterior a new look and to give them some slick renderings. Then they should set up shop somewhere on Trade St. to sell those bad boys. They're getting trampled by the competition and as long as there are high-rise condos in demand the competition won't let up on them.

[turbocraig]

I haven't really said much about the park but does anyone else think that one of its big problems could be that it is just ugly. I think it's ugly, I almost hope it doesn't get built. On top of that, the rendering looks like something I could do in my free time with a pack of crayola colored pencils. When the other high-rise developers are wowing with their renderings The Park is falling flat. It doesn't help that the sales office has no hot presence in a better Uptown building like the Vue or Ave. Neither of those developers would attempt to sell their units out of the parking lot where their building will go. I would like to see them hire an architect to give the exterior a new look and to give them some slick renderings. Then they should set up shop somewhere on Trade St. to sell those bad boys. They're getting trampled by the competition and as long as there are high-rise condos in demand the competition won't let up on them.

I couldn't agree more. Verna made much ado when he first announced this project (when was that again... 49 years ago?) about the classic "Chicago style" that the building supposedly celebrated. How on earth a cheap stucco, top-heavy, and cheesily detailed midrise harkens back to Old Chicago is beyond me. "New Ballantyne" is nearer the mark. It also kinda reminds me of the hideous Hampton/Hilton GI complex a couple blocks away, and if another one of those monstrosities never gets off the ground, I wouldn't shed a tear either.

[dxartist]

I wish this project would die already. Why or how the CBJ or Doug Smith keep bringing it up is beyond me. The Park is like a "Friday the 13th" movie. As in Jason keeps coming back killing or in our case annoying everyone around. It's one big tease that won't go away.

[UrbanCharlotte]

The Park is revived!? Park gets Co-developer A partner has signed on and this project seems revived... again. Just thought id share this even though it will probably die again.

[dubone]

that certainly is what all the pundits at Urban Planet Institute believed was necessary for this project to actually happen.

since they only have 30 more condos to sell (at least according to their website... and we know how that goes), maybe having a new developer will help them sell out and get this thing off the ground.

i hope they redesign it, though, and hopefully take up a larger portion of that block.

No matter what, though, they will need slick new renderings, and a new sales center to revive confidence.

[UrbanCharlotte]

Parking Garage uplift begins Mid December 2005. I wonder if it will really be built. I hope they add some floors to it, and redesign it after seeing what some of the competition is.

[A2]

Man I have never seen the Charlotte area hopping so much. I have learned of so many NEW things actually happening. This place is about to explode with growth. Atlanta watch out ! My new tower count is 16 (over 12 stories) that I believe will be BUILT in the next 2 to 3 years.

(3 of those will be super structures north of 50)

A2

[atlrvr]

I actually wouldn't mind the building at all if floors 5-21 were clad with limestone instead of stucco....I don't find the general design unattractive, though I do think that 9 stories of parking in a tight radius space is a bit ridiculous.

[dubone]

it would be awful to have a parking space on the 10th floor of a deck... just awful! you'd have to schedule a commute just to get out of the building.

Parking Garage uplift begins Mid December 2005. I wonder if it will really be built. I hope they add some floors to it, and redesign it after seeing what some of the competition is.

this is a rare example where they have put that more than a month out... so maybe they are now dealing with facts instead of lies or fibs or spin or whatever you want to call it.

[MZT]

It *is* a small footprint. This site has some serious compromises. But it is certainly close to the government center, I suppose that's what the developers are counting on to overcome the oddities of it.

[Mobuchu]

That "monthly parking available" sign really needs to come down first...

[dubone]

why does proximity to the government center help this project? city and county employees are not likely paid enough to make a difference for sales, i don't think.

i think they need to purchase the land between their current side and the row of storefronts on brevard for 5 reasons:

1) it is currently a risk for buyers that their view will be ruined at some point in the future.

2) the land is just an access routes for surface parking lot

3) by having a larger footprint, they can have a larger parking floor plates to avoid the problem stated earlier

4) by having a larger footprint, they can have a larger and less expensive amenity deck. the rooftop park is just inefficient and clearly hasn't been marketable.

5) they can do more or larger units. (potentially they could just build a mid-rise ontop of the current parking deck... and then build their 22 story tower on the land along 3rd street.)

[UrbanCharlotte]

Man I have never seen the Charlotte area hopping so much. I have learned of so many NEW things actually happening. This place is about to explode with growth. Atlanta watch out ! My new tower count is 16 (over 12 stories) that I believe will be BUILT in the next 2 to 3 years.

(3 of those will be super structures north of 50)

A2

I thought we only had two above 50 as of now. Vue, 210 Trade.

[dubone]

he still believes that certain bank will realize they have money.

[A2]

he still believes that certain bank will realize they have money.

I am an optimist. I think Wachovia still might pull something out over 50. Although I have heard it will be between 40-44 stories, I still want to believe 50+.

Here's for 50+

A2