Wake County Public Schools and growth

[avery]

Eliminating the softball field for a combined field makes sense...and we never ever needed two practice fields.....you could easily cleave off everything south of the creek...unused land and the fields and rework the faculty parking entrance over through the student parking lot. With a lot of work you could reduce the parking, squeeze the tennis courts over near the football concessions, push the baseball field nearer the main building and onto the space the faculty parking was removed from and then reduce the land requirement by almost half. This school site plan reminds me of a typical modern subdivision in wastefulness and wishy washy we want it all attitude.

Edit: holy cow...I am pretty sure I counted 789 parking spaces.....and there are already 7 "future mobile classroom unit"(s) penciled in....way to plan for the future...

[ChiefJoJo]

The larger problem is you have all these municipalities, Cary, Apex, Raleigh, etc, and the county commissioners in control of the developments that are approved (ie, where students live), the board then has to ask the Wake Commissioners for their budget and the school board has to pick up the pieces. Then they get sued for trying to deal with the problem by utilizing existing faciilities (year round schools). If you ask me the WCPSS has a thankless, nearly impossible job that will only truly be solved by somehow cobbling together some kind of governance structure that gives the school board input over development, impact fees, etc. Something's got to be done, otherwise, we're going to have another $1B bond, and the taxpayers won't buy it.

With schools, transportation, water, sewer, etc, we have all these problems caused by growth and town/city/county boards that are not accountable for it's true impact. These issues never stop at jurisdictional boundaries, but nobody wants to connect the dots.

[ChiefJoJo]

Mayor Meeker made an appearance at the County Commissioners meeting today, regarding the criticism he levied on their action--or rather, inaction--in the proposed land deal in Rolesville.

Gurley said county commissioners and school board members have had a good working relationship in recent years, including working together to get a $1 billion school construction bond passed last year. But he said the school board in recent months has stepped back from a collaborative approach to solving school growth problems.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, but Vice Chair and former Raleigh mayor Paul Coble, has been a negative influence on the commission, and has driven his formerly moderate GOP commissioners to the right, effectively creating a larger divide on issues such as Kane's parking deck issue (not sure that was "conservative" at all) with the city and funding the schools (with the school board). I may not have any evidence specifically pointing to Coble's influence on the Rolesville issue, but his impact has been pervasive.

[JeffC]

Yeah, the reason the school board has "stepped back" from the cooperative stance is that Coble has baited the rest of the Republicans into playing "gotcha" on the issue of taxes and spending, catering to their base. Here's to the hardcore GOP crowd being so demoralized and in disarray in 2008 that they all stay home and we get to throw Coble out on his ear.

[ChiefJoJo]

In the FWIW category, Wake is now the largest school system in NC.

[ChiefJoJo]

In what I consider a positive step forward for the county and the schools, the Wake Co Commissioners elected moderate Republican Joe Bryan as Chair. Tony Gurley and Paul Coble had been Chair and Vice Chair previously, and I believe had a strong role in hurting the relationship with the Wake School Board. Gurley, I thought, had some potential, but IMO he was strongly influenced by Coble's anti-spending stance on every critical vote. Bryan, by contrast, cast the deciding swing vote (with the 3 Democrats) for increasing funds in the 2008 school budget.

[JeffC]

In what I consider a positive step forward for the county and the schools, the Wake Co Commissioners elected moderate Republican Joe Bryan as Chair. Tony Gurley and Paul Coble had been Chair and Vice Chair previously, and I believe had a strong role in hurting the relationship with the Wake School Board. Gurley, I thought, had some potential, but IMO he was strongly influenced by Coble's anti-spending stance on every critical vote. Bryan, by contrast, cast the deciding swing vote (with the 3 Democrats) for increasing funds in the 2008 school budget.

[RaleighRob]

Coble remains, IMO, political target number one for pro-smart growth and pro-planning forces in 2008.

[ncwebguy]

Electing Betty Lou Ward as vice chair also shows the Wake board of commissioners wants to work with the school board, the cities and towns, etc. as opposed to Coble's politicizing of just about everything.

This, combined with Durham County's relection of Reckhow, are good signs going forward for the Triangle.

[ChiefJoJo]

No discussion in this topic for a while, but in the past few months, there has been plenty of discussion at the city, county, and state rep level about whether Wake School Board members should be elected at-large or by district. It seems some of those in Western Wake Co have been fighting behind the scenes for a move to at-large election of members, which would require massive fund-raising efforts and likely swing the board towards those more well-to-do interests rather than a diverse group that reflects the makeup of the county. A few town boards (Apex?) have resolved support for at-large seats, but I know Wake Forest resolved against it, and I believe Raleigh did as well. I don't think it will go anywhere.

Now, news of a major victory for the Wake School Board, as the NC Court of Appeals unanimously ruled that the schools do have a right to implement year-round schools, even without parental consent. The decision overturns the 2007 decision in the suit by Wake CARES , who wanted the year-round calendar stopped. I have no kids, and don't know all the issues, but I do know Wake Schools are among the best in the state and even the nation, and the school board has been put behind the 8-ball many times w/r/t growth and having to constantly beg for money to adequately fund the schools, despite objections from county commissioners. Now, they get a major victory which gives the school board another tool in the tool box to combat growth, outside raising county taxes or more bonds (thru more efficient use of space).

[ncwebguy]

The Wake County Board of Commissioners are working on a plan that puts themselves in charge of building and maintaing the county's schools while leaving the operations of the school system itself to the school board. On the surface, this looks like a good idea, but it could get ugly in a hurry:

- Commissioners put schools only where campaign fundraising developers tell them to.

- Commissioners decide to stop mataining some schools (Southeast Raleigh, ITB) and spending that money on schools elsewhere (Cary/Apex/Wake Forest).

- Schools built as cheaply as possible to "save taxpayer dollars" initially, but end up costing more over time due to maintenance costs.

- A repeat their recent mistake - ignore growth trends and deny that new schools are needed while schools become overcrowded, resulting in year round calendars

- Cutting school operation funds (bye bye arts!) to pay for higher construction costs.

It sounds like the board is promising more money for operations as a compromise, but since they control the purse strings, that money could easily be short lived.

It is another power grab by a handful of commissioners and I hope the school board shuts this down, and any move that would make more than one or two school board positions at-large.

[Jones_]

^ Exactly. The commissioners hand out crap, and expect the school board to still produce good results. Wanna save some money on schools, fine, hire a third party to value engineer the designs but the commissioners cannot begin to figure out what is needed where etc.

[Pack52]

The Wake County Board of Commissioners are working on a plan that puts themselves in charge of building and maintaing the county's schools while leaving the operations of the school system itself to the school board. On the surface, this looks like a good idea, but it could get ugly in a hurry:

- Commissioners put schools only where campaign fundraising developers tell them to.

- Commissioners decide to stop mataining some schools (Southeast Raleigh, ITB) and spending that money on schools elsewhere (Cary/Apex/Wake Forest).

- Schools built as cheaply as possible to "save taxpayer dollars" initially, but end up costing more over time due to maintenance costs.

- A repeat their recent mistake - ignore growth trends and deny that new schools are needed while schools become overcrowded, resulting in year round calendars

- Cutting school operation funds (bye bye arts!) to pay for higher construction costs.

It sounds like the board is promising more money for operations as a compromise, but since they control the purse strings, that money could easily be short lived.

It is another power grab by a handful of commissioners and I hope the school board shuts this down, and any move that would make more than one or two school board positions at-large.

[ChiefJoJo]

The Raleigh City Council unanimously backed the current school board district-based structure, as expected. Good news.

[ncwebguy]

The N&O's Wake Ed blog has a post on the Board of Education's reaction to the County Commissioners' school construction plan. The BoE listed the pros and cons of the proposal, and it is hard to tell if they are on board or not. If they need a bond referendum in 2009 as they have claimed in the past, they might sign on. But it is good to see people looking to get specifics in writing and are aware of potential pitfalls. They worded them more kindly than I did above, especially the politicizing of school sites and construction (which I think is another knock *against* all BoE seats being at-large) and the potential for being stuck with mistakes made by Commissioners who later punt the problem back to the school board.

[bullcity76]

How about giving the School Board taxing authority? You know the schools have responsibility and accountability for their portion of the tax money. Right now they can ask for $200B and say that the schools are overcrowded or performing poorly because of the County Commisioners. Hmmmm...I think Wake is headed in the wrong direction. Good luck guys/gals...

[ChiefJoJo]

Pretty interesting turn of events. Now, the NC Supreme Court has stepped in and halted the Appeals Court ruling until they decide whether to take up the case of whether or not schools must seek parental permission prior to making year-round school assignments.

Sorry, but this just seems like ideocy to me. If the State Consitution prohibits or places limits on year round schools (which are more efficient), then it should be changed ASAP. The entire reason for traditional calendar schools dates back to the agrarian-based economy of yesteryear. Could somebody explain to me what relevance "traditional" calendar has on kids sitting here in 2008? I understand there will be hiccups with some families that have kids on different tracks, but this lawsuit merely holds up the entire system for a few bitter parents in Western Wake. CARE? Give me a friggen' break.

[dmccall]

One major cost of year-round is air-conditioning the buildings and the buses.

[ncwebguy]

When will schools need to get parent's permission to schedule the traditional calendar? Not enough days off for Christmas and Easter? Going to school too early and/or getting out too late? If parents know best how to manage a school's calendar, why shouldn't they be "consulted" when a school is going to paint a wall?

Their next move -- push for at-large voting to concentrate school board control solely in areas with residents who can mount an exspensive election campaign -- is well underway. It is a shame they created the problem by moving to "cheap" homes (made cheap due to low impact fees and taxes that supported a much smaller school system) in outlying areas (F-V, Cary, Apex) putting a strain on the system while NOT PAYING FOR IT. Year round schooling is a direct result of fitting the swollen enrollment numbers into the physical school buildings already built because voters did not approve the school building bond two attempts ago and we've been playing catchup since.

Wake "Cares" has yet to show how we can keep the current number of students on a traditional calendar and on the campuses we have. Do they honestly think double shifts will be less of an impact on families (to say nothing of the effects on teachers!) than year round schools? They campaigned *against* the last bond (and were thankfully defeated), proving that they continue to not want to pay for the new schools needed.

Back in my day "air conditioning the buses" meant putting all the windows down, which didn't cost too much. The buildings, on the other hand, will cost. I doubt A/C costs would be more than extra trailers on existing campuses or accelerated land acquisition, construction (especially with today's materials costs), staffing, etc.

[RaleighRob]

Yeah and I am pretty sure they keep schools air-conditioned all summer anyways. You have to...either for summer programs, staff needs, etc. Plus you'd get a mold problem if you didn't.

[dmccall]

Back in my day "air conditioning the buses" meant putting all the windows down, which didn't cost too much. The buildings, on the other hand, will cost. I doubt A/C costs would be more than extra trailers on existing campuses or accelerated land acquisition, construction (especially with today's materials costs), staffing, etc.

[ncwebguy]

Going 100% year round would mean a costly retrofit of older schools, especially ones inside the beltline and in the heart of smaller Wake County towns.

I understand the need for more capacity, but it won't be easy to just build our way out of it with little to no tax increases (thanks low impact fees!). The defeated school bond several years ago continues to rear its ugly head and has painted the school system into this proverbial corner, but there aren't many options. Wake "cares" and other vocal minorities question maintaining older schools and would rather see the money spent on "neighborhood" schools next to their new subdivision where land is not available and/or costly.

It is sad that heat half days are only a relic of the past... not much learning gets done in the last few days of school, so why not adjust the calendar accordingly? "No school before Labor Day" passed on a statewide leve without parental concent or provisions for county flexibilty. The boundary for concent seems to be a fuzzy line at best.

As for air conditioning on buses, there have been voluntary/magnet year round schools for several years in Wake County, so I'd guess the A/C on buses issue has already been addressed?

High diesel prices are also cutting into school operation budgets, but research at NC State seems to be leading the way towards plug-in hybrid school buses with significant fuel savings, with Wake County testing one of the first modified buses.

[RaleighRob]

Newraleigh has a good article about a new parking lot at Broughton High School, and how its approval by the city council is a good example of poor planning and leadership in Raleigh.

Take a look: http://www.newraleigh.com/articles/archive...-a-parking-lot/

[dmccall]

Newraleigh has a good article about a new parking lot at Broughton High School, and how its approval by the city council is a good example of poor planning and leadership in Raleigh.

Take a look: http://www.newraleigh.com/articles/archive...-a-parking-lot/

[DanRNC]

^Peter Eichenberger is a mental case and should probably be housed out in Butner (I don't know who in their right mind would let this guy write anything) but that doesn't take away from the fact that snot-nosed brats should not be dictating parking policy. I would tell them to take the friggin bus and if they don't like it-tough sh-t.